East Cobb...Middle and High Schools (Atlanta, Sandy Springs: transplants, apartment, how much)
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Need information on schools. Tried to get answers on another thread, but there was more elementary school info there, so I thought I would start my own new thread.
We have 2 middle schoolers and 1 high schooler.
Any feedback on:
-East Cobb/Wheeler,
-Mabry/Lassiter and
-Simpson/Sprayberry?
-How is Wheeler for students not in the magnet program?
- What colleges are students going to upon graduation from these high schools?
I am new to the area as well. My husband is being transferred. All I can tell you is that Walton High School is the best in East Cobb as well as one of the best in the state. Don't know much about the schools that you have mentioned though. Good luck.
Those lists are just for reference, since they are lists they can't explain things to you. But I live in East Cobb and know the schools really well.
The best high schools are Walton, Lassiter, and Pope. The best middle schools are Dickerson, Dodgen, Hightower Trail, Simpson, and Mabry. Any combination of these schools is a winning choice. Note that there's a typo on the list, Durham Middle School is not in East Cobb, in fact it's really far away in Acworth.
Walton, Pope, and Lassiter serve only East Cobb. Sprayberry and Wheeler are both physically located in East Cobb (close to the western edge though), however these schools serve many different areas. The Sprayberry school district serves part of East Cobb as well as unincorporated parts of Kennesaw and north Marietta, including most of the Town Center retail/apartment district. Wheeler serves part of East Cobb, unincorporated eastern Marietta, and most of the Cumberland business district, which is a large office/retail district with a skyline of office towers where a HUGE amount of people work. It's one of the five employment hubs of Atlanta (the others are Downtown, Midtown, Buckhead, and Perimeter). About 100,000 people live in Cumberland, most of whom have no older children or any children at all. It's the most city-like place in Cobb County (though still not urban).
This zoning is the chief reason Sprayberry and Wheeler are viewed as average schools. Walton, Lassiter, and Pope serve a residential, almost completely single-family house area. The main reason these schools do well is because the area is wealthy and people move there specifically to send their kids to the best schools, so these three schools have slowly grown in excellence and continue to do so. Sprayberry and Wheeler have very mixed demographics compared to the other three schools, in terms of family income and also how settled down the families are, resulting in your average American high schools. Definitely not bad, but not exceptional.
Out of the three you noted, Mabry/Lassiter is definitely the best. Sprayberry and Wheeler are very similar, but Simpson is a far better middle school than East Cobb. In fact, East Cobb Middle is easily the worst middle school in the whole area (east of I-75).
Wheeler Magnet is not that great in the first place, and Wheeler High School for students not in the Magnet is a very average high school. I know a girl who went to Wheeler Magnet for 2 years but transferred to Walton (where she actually lives) because she hated Wheeler Magnet so much. She graduated from Walton and went to Northwestern.
Sprayberry is your average high school in every way. They even have security guards and hall monitors (these ideas are unthinkable at, for example, Walton, where security is of practically no concern and students can walk around whenever they want without consequence). I know several people well who went to Sprayberry, and they all went to Georgia Tech afterwards. They were however among the best in the school, and good students are going to do well regardless of what school you put them in.
Pope and Lassiter are both above-average high schools. Lassiter has one of the absolute best music programs in the country. These are both highly recommend schools.
Walton on the other hand is a very unique school. It is the best school out of the group, and probably the entire state. Walton excels in pretty much everything (sports, academics, music), and parents specifically move to this district to send their kids to Walton, more than any other place in the area. This part of East Cobb used to be be a conservative old-Georgia Republican type of area, but that is changing as there are tons of transplants now from other parts of the country and state. Walton also resembles a private school in many ways. Walton has its own special charter (which it gets to have only if 99% of Walton parents vote to keep it, which is done every 4 years). This charter allows Walton to pretty much have its own rules and transcend Cobb County regulations. Walton parents are also more involved than any of the other schools. Walton extracurricular activities like sports and music are all top-ranked, mostly because parents push their kids and also because parents pour lots of their own money into the school. Walton gets the same amount of funding as the other schools but spends far more, mostly from donations from parents and local businesses. The marching band alone spends something like $100,000 more per year than what the county gives them.
However, Walton is extremely packed. The school is practically overflowing with kids and is constantly expanding. The school buildings themselves is also not that nice, very average. However, many of the sports fields and things like that are very nice because the parents pay for them. Houses in the Walton district have practically unfair prices compared to other parts of the county, simply for being in the district. It's an expensive place to live which is the biggest downside. Pope is also very expensive. Lassiter is probably the best value.
Keep in mind that a good student is going to do well regardless of the schools. However good schools can be a big help to students. However, there's one thing that bears mention. Walton is not a friendly school for average students. Walton caters to its best students (which is a good 200 to 300 students out of the 600-700 per grade). A student with a 4.0 GPA will not even be in the top 100 of the class at Walton. Walton is a really split school: you have the 400 kids in the grade who take all regular classes, are not really payed attention too, and most of these end up in your average universities, mostly in Georgia because of HOPE (which practically every in Walton will get). Then you have the 200 kids in the grade who take nothing but college level classes, have 4.0 and higher GPA's, get ridiculous SAT scores, are taught by the best teachers at Walton (the AP teachers, most of whom are more than qualified to be excellent professors), and all of these kids will go either to GA Tech, Emory, UGA, or high ranked schools in the north and California. Only students at Walton can really tell you this, but Walton students are treated differently and have very different experiences based on if they are in the "regular" or "AP" group of the student body.
This is a lot of information, but I'm telling you this because everyone likes to say Walton is so great (and it is), but Walton is a very specific place and not for everyone, and most average students actually dislike the school, though most high-achieving students, of which there are a lot, really love it.
Pope and Lassiter on the other hand, don't really have this unique situation. They are simply good schools with nothing really weird to comment about.
Since you mention graduation and colleges... kids from Sprayberry and Wheeler tend to go to "worse" colleges, but like I said before a good student will still be a good student. Around 10 to 15 students from Sprayberry go to GA Tech per year for example, compared to at least 50+ per year from Walton or Pope. The number would be over 100 per year from Walton if students did not leave the state for college.
As for the middle schools.... it really doesn't matter. They are all fine. Dickerson is perhaps unnaturally ahead in math classes offered because of its connection to Walton (it is not uncommon for 9th/10th graders at Walton to take college level Calculus courses), but they are really all the same. Mabry, Simpson, Hightower Trail, Dodgen, Dickerson are great. Daniell and McClesky are pretty good. Avoid East Cobb Middle School. (note that a large part of McClesky students go to Kell High School, which is a rather bad school, but some go to Sprayberry and Lassiter I believe)
I've been rambling on, mostly because I'm bored, but I guess some of this information will be useful to you.
Thank you for the wealth of information!!!! This is exactly the type of information I was looking for.
I am leaning towards Lassiter and Pope because I know my kids are above average today, but I do not want them to fall through the cracks if they are not interested in a full AP schedule.
I was interested in Wheeler because I have read good things about the magnet program and the diversity there. My kids are used to diversity and I am not sure if they are willing to give that up.
Security is a big issue for me because I would like peace of mind. And I would like my kids to be in a learning environment and not have to worry about dangers in the hall or on and off campus.
I will check out your links over the next couple of days.
quick note about the security... I wasn't implying that Walton isn't a safe place, I was implying that it's so safe no one worries about safety. In Sprayberry kids are treated like little kids, hence the security guards and hall monitors. In Walton kids are treated like adults and it's really more like a college (for the AP group) where the teachers aren't going to waste any time making sure their students are in class or do homework and half the kids don't even know who any of the vice principals are. Despite this, Walton does have the lowest absent rates out of all the schools. (even though you're not really punished for skipping classes at Walton, you are rewarded for not skipping, since they let you exempt some exams if you miss less than 3 days of class - this rule is unique to Walton because of its charter. But you can also exempt if you have an A in the class, which is basically their way of saying we don't care if you skip if you're smart...).
As far as diversity goes, they are all pretty diverse, just in different ways. Walton/Lassiter/Pope are not very diverse in terms of family income, but Wheeler and Sprayberry are. Wheeler and Sprayberry also have less whites, more blacks, and small amounts of Asians and Hispanics. Pope and Lassiter are like 80% white with the rest split between blacks, hispanics, and Asians. Walton is basically nothing but whites and Asians (perhaps like 2% black and 1% hispanic). Asian covers a lot of groups though (Koreans, Chinese, Indians, and Persians are the main minorities at Walton for example), not really sure why they lump all these people in one category but that's how they do it when they gather statistics.
Also, I'm not sure how much of a nosy parent you are, but because of Walton's charter Walton has its own special online system which keeps track of students grades and attendance on a daily basis. As soon as a teacher grades any homework or exam and puts it in the gradebook, the grades are automatically updated online. Same for attendance. Therefore the students can know exactly what grade they have in any class (and any specific assignment) at any given time. Report cards are pretty much obsolete and useless at Walton because everyone always knows their grades. Most Walton parents find a way to get their student's password and most Walton parents check their student's grades every single day. The parents really love this feature (walton is the only school in the state with the system).
Also, I'm not sure how much of a nosy parent you are, but because of Walton's charter Walton has its own special online system which keeps track of students grades and attendance on a daily basis. As soon as a teacher grades any homework or exam and puts it in the gradebook, the grades are automatically updated online. Same for attendance. Therefore the students can know exactly what grade they have in any class (and any specific assignment) at any given time. Report cards are pretty much obsolete and useless at Walton because everyone always knows their grades. Most Walton parents find a way to get their student's password and most Walton parents check their student's grades every single day. The parents really love this feature (walton is the only school in the state with the system).
I just want to clarify.
The program you are describing is called I-Parent. That program is not exclusive to Walton--all schools in Cobb County Schools have this program. Most districts statewide have a similar program as well
No, Walton does not have I-Parent... they have something completely different... they use a program called Focus for student information and Argus for scheduling. The teachers at Walton say it's far superior to the system the rest of Cobb County uses and it's one of the primary reasons Walton has its charter, so that they can use Focus and not be subjected to the "terrible" system that Cobb County would force them to use otherwise. That's what Walton teachers say anyway, I'm not a teacher and I wouldn't know why they think I-Parent is so bad. I remember in 2002 when it was time for the vote for the Walton charter to be renewed, the teachers and administrators went absolutely ballistic because they needed practically every single Walton parent to vote for the charter to keep it (and their Focus system). They practically went door to door begging parents to make sure they vote. The whole faculty was really scared they might not get the charter renewed. 100% of the teachers voted to keep it, and they did get over 99% of the parents to vote to keep the charter. Only a single parent voted no to the charter. They also got 99% of students to vote to keep the charter. 20 students in the school voted no.
If you're interested, you can read Walton's 95 page petition (http://www.cobb.k12.ga.us/~walton/charter/charter2.pdf - broken link) to keep the charter... notice how it mentions that being able to keep using their Focus and Argus systems is essential to the success of the school. It also mentions that Walton will fund the Focus system completely by itself (i.e. from parent and local business donations, and I hear Focus was very expensive) and it also basically says the reason they use Focus is because the county system is inferior.
If you look at the terms outlined in the charter (which basically promises that Walton will remain among the very best of schools for the next decade), you'll understand why Walton caters to its best students... the school needs to be the best to keep its charter and to keep the parent donations pouring in.
I imagine it won't be long until other schools follow in Walton's footsteps and muscle their way into becoming charter schools. Nearby North Springs High School in Sandy Springs is currently in the process of becoming a charter school. Sandy Springs must really want to be free from Fulton County in every way....
EDIT: Note to the topic poster, you mentioned you were interested in what schools graduates from East Cobb schools end up going to. In the charter I linked to it lists the Universities the top 20% of Walton students attend. I imagine Pope and Lassiter would be similar.
Just some thoughts I'd like to add... the Walton charter is actually quite interesting. For example, Walton is not overseen by the local school council. Instead, Walton has its own governance council made up of administrators, teachers, parents, students, and local community leaders. In fact, the student president and vice president of Walton (voted by the students) sit on the governance council and possess voting power equal to the principal of Walton himself.... such an idea would be laughable at any other high school, but like I said Walton is very unique.
You should look skim through that charter because you can learn a lot about the school be reading. I think I scared you with my description of the school, but honestly, despite being a scary and imposing high school, I would recommend Walton over Pope or Lassiter (though those schools are really great). Good luck on finding a good deal in the area though....
Thanks for some of the info and opinions on Walton. It affirms our decision NOT to send our kids there. Yes it may be the "best" school in Georgia's rather underachieving school system, but from what I read and hear, Walton's student body, faculty, and parents simply reek with attitudes of snobbery and entitlement.
There are snobs at Walton, but they're a minority. I know Sprayberry parents who are snobs, and Pace Academy parents who are snobs, it doesn't have anything to do with Walton. Living in East Cobb, I know hundreds of Walton parents and students and most of them aren't snobs. Some are, yes, usually the really conservative, Bible-thumping, old-Georgia Republican types, but most people at Walton (and most of the overachievers) are transplants who moved here and those people aren't snobs. But Walton's a big school (2500+ people) in a pretty high income area so yeah, you're going to get snobs. But you're just as likely to run into snobs in other nearby places too, like Alpharetta, Dunwoody, Buckhead...
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Lassiter and Pope
