Austin restaurant smoking (Houston, Early, Mart: fit in, closing, bars)

[JayBrown80]

Originally Posted by atxcio

I should point out that even after quoting my message TWICE, you still seem to not understand the facts. I can't help with your reading comprehension, so let me just simplify the point for you:

I said Austin was the first of the big 4 Texas cities to pass it. That is a fact.

Do the math.

It's sort of pointless to even bring it up. I mean....you state a fact and back it up with a linkable source so that we can fact check.

Eep just says, "That's a lie!!!" But never actually provides proof of anything, nor does he dispute your source.

So it's your verifiable facts against Eeps admittedly biased opinion.

....not really a contest.

[bgrn198]

Originally Posted by eepstein

Many cities throughout the state had stronger smoking ordinances before Austin did including its neighbor to the north of Round Rock. Several Houston and Dallas suburbs also had smoking restaurant bans before Austin did. In addition, Austin passed with only 52% of the vote. Dallas and Houston both passed with far greater percentages.

Ok mister Fact person. Name me a state capitol in this country larger than Austin that is in a state that still allows smoking everywhere. Hmmmmmm?

You think you know more than every one on here then you should know which state capitals are biger than Austin.

[mayfair44]

Originally Posted by passionatearts

Sounds like you haven't been to Austin in a long time. I don't know any indoor places in Austin that allow smoking anymore, and Highland Mall is basically finished. Once ACC takes over, the transformation will begin.

Smoking bans have basically become a trend in all major metro areas in the United States. Actually, make that a trend all over the Western world. Take a look at this: List of smoking bans - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. Even Spain and France have banned smoking indoors! I can't wait to travel back to Spain and not have to deal with smoke in every restaurant.

Ha, yeah a recent trip to Eastern Europe has given me a greater appreciation for our current laws and trends here. Out of control over there.

My beef in Austin are the smokers posted outside the front doors of several downtown bars. Sometimes it's a gauntlet of smoke you must wade through to get inside. Annoying.

[eepstein]

Why do you need to quote FACTS here??. All you have to do is be breathing and have some idea of whats going on around you. I have lived here for 8 years since 2003. I travel extensively, and can tell you that back in 2003, MANY cities and states throughout the country had indoor restaurant/bar smoking bans before Austin did. Yes, many did not as well.

I do know for a FACT that the heavily conservative city of Round Rock (a good comparison because obviously no one on this board ever leaves central texas) had a total restaurant smoking ban nearly 2 years before Austin did. Meanwhile, the city of Austin was busy placing time restrictions of when you could smoke and not smoke in restaurants. As if second hand smoke was more harmful before 2pm! KEEP AUSTIN WIERD!!

Austin STILL has restaurants that you can smoke in. (and its almost 2012) I think Dennys and Trudys in central and south Austin--they got some kind of a waver, not sure how. I do know that most of the bars on 6th street are non smoking, but if people choose to smoke anyways, the city cannot enforce it unless they receive complaints from other customers.

Originally Posted by JayBrown80

It's sort of pointless to even bring it up. I mean....you state a fact and back it up with a linkable source so that we can fact check.

Eep just says, "That's a lie!!!" But never actually provides proof of anything, nor does he dispute your source.

So it's your verifiable facts against Eeps admittedly biased opinion.

....not really a contest.

[Paulmmm]

Originally Posted by eepstein

Why do you need to quote FACTS here??. All you have to do is be breathing and have some idea of whats going on around you. ...

Given who posted it, this is probably my favorite quote ever on any message board!

What are you going to believe? FACTS? Or what eepstein (who presumably is breathing and possibly has some idea of what is going on around him) tells you?

[oldtoiletsmkgdflrpots]

Originally Posted by Paulmmm

Given who posted it, this is probably my favorite quote ever on any message board!

What are you going to believe? FACTS? Or what eepstein (who presumably is breathing and possibly has some idea of what is going on around him) tells you?

I'm leaning toward eppstein at the moment.

[Michael J. McFadden]

Originally Posted by eepstein

I travel extensively, and can tell you that back in 2003, MANY cities and states throughout the country had indoor restaurant/bar smoking bans before Austin did.

eepstein, I'm fairly certain that in 2003, the only states that banned smoking in bars were California, New York, Delaware, and, possibly, Florida. California's ban exempted bars (and general workplaces) that had less than 6 employees, and Florida's ban exempts stand-alone bars (and possibly all bars that don't serve food... not certain on that though.)

And while most people might prefer to dine in a restaurant that banned smoking, there's never been a sound argument made for why ALL restaurants have to ban smoking.

[hoffdano]

How did I miss this eepstein related thread?

The reality of Austin is that the entertainment industry has always had a strong voice. That includes the bars of course. I remember going to Antones years ago in its original location on Guadalupe to see "blues monday" and it was full of smoke. And it is reasonable to expect they would fight for the right to allow smoking. I think that explains the 52% vote when the smoking ban was first allowed. But Austin was way ahead of Houston - where I traveled extensively (over 25 times a year) through most of the 1990s and mid-2000s. I was always taken aback when asked at a restaurant "smoking or non-smoking" when Austin had essentially no smoking restaurants at all.

One interpretation of "liberal" on this issue by the way is that it is more liberal to allow businesses to set their own policies regarding smoking.

Practically speaking, there is no smoking anywhere indoors in Austin in a business or public building. In my circle of many dozens of friends, family, acquaintances, colleagues, etc. I do not know a single smoker.

[eepstein]

Houston's ordinance is stronger than Austin's with regards to bars. Unlike the city of Houston, the city of Austin has no authority to enforce bar smoking UNLESS people are complaining. This was one of the loopholes that were introduced shortly after it was passed. This certainly still means that most bars ARE non-smoking, but I would be VERY surprised if a few didn't permit it on a "hush hush" basis.

Originally Posted by hoffdano

How did I miss this eepstein related thread?

The reality of Austin is that the entertainment industry has always had a strong voice. That includes the bars of course. I remember going to Antones years ago in its original location on Guadalupe to see "blues monday" and it was full of smoke. And it is reasonable to expect they would fight for the right to allow smoking. I think that explains the 52% vote when the smoking ban was first allowed. But Austin was way ahead of Houston - where I traveled extensively (over 25 times a year) through most of the 1990s and mid-2000s. I was always taken aback when asked at a restaurant "smoking or non-smoking" when Austin had essentially no smoking restaurants at all.

One interpretation of "liberal" on this issue by the way is that it is more liberal to allow businesses to set their own policies regarding smoking.

Practically speaking, there is no smoking anywhere indoors in Austin in a business or public building. In my circle of many dozens of friends, family, acquaintances, colleagues, etc. I do not know a single smoker.

[passionatearts]

Originally Posted by eepstein

Houston's ordinance is stronger than Austin's with regards to bars. Unlike the city of Houston, the city of Austin has no authority to enforce bar smoking UNLESS people are complaining. This was one of the loopholes that were introduced shortly after it was passed. This certainly still means that most bars ARE non-smoking, but I would be VERY surprised if a few didn't permit it on a "hush hush" basis.

In the 6 years since the smoking ban went into effect, I have yet to go to any bar or club in Downtown Austin where people are smoking inside.