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Old 05-14-2009, 08:30 AM
 
3,134 posts, read 3,277,413 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mimimomx3 View Post
Crime happens everywhere. How do the folks in Pemberton feel during the UT football season? I have friends who are used to waking up and seeing drunk frat boys in their yards!


Oh I suppose they just think that's cute because they're frat boys.
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Old 05-14-2009, 08:32 AM
 
3,134 posts, read 3,277,413 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mimimomx3 View Post
Respecting an individual's rights is the key. That means every citizen.




Again, I think people have a right to be safe.
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Old 05-14-2009, 01:08 PM
 
602 posts, read 1,847,041 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mimimomx3 View Post
No one 'hides' behind the constitution. It is the foundation of our legal justice system, and the police and the rest of the judicial system have to respect it. I don't care how drunk/stoned/belligerent you are, there are certain rights we have that have to be observed. What about someone with Parkinsons? I'm sure they look 'drunk' to many. Should they be strapped down and forced to give blood?
No, but someone with Parkinsons probably should not be driving? Being close to people who have died by the hands of drunk drivers, I am torn on this one. The problem is other tests police use to decide you are intoxicated are easy to beat in court. A blood test is definitive proof. If I was stopped and asked to give blood without an option of breath test then that is wrong. But, if I refused the breath test, I probably have something to hide. So I don't know.

As stated already, isn't it my right to be safe (and by safe I mean without drunk drivers) on the road? I have no sympathy for drunk drivers. I think too many gift off to easily.
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Old 05-14-2009, 01:09 PM
 
602 posts, read 1,847,041 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mimimomx3 View Post
Respecting an individual's rights is the key. That means every citizen.
How about respecting my rights to drive safely on the road without someone breaking the law and endangering my life?
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Old 05-14-2009, 02:13 PM
 
Location: SoCal
2,262 posts, read 4,384,071 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shaxs View Post
How about respecting my rights to drive safely on the road without someone breaking the law and endangering my life?
Isn't it kinda against the law to force a blood test on someone who may or may not have done anything wrong? I agree that drunk driving is wrong, should be punished, yadda yadda yadda. But I worry about "minor" rights being taken away in the name of "safety." They start out minor and can then grow bigger. I mean, we'd all be safer with a curfew as well. Women would be safer if they were never let out of the house. You get the drift.
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Old 05-14-2009, 02:43 PM
 
8,241 posts, read 10,173,710 times
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Originally Posted by shaxs View Post
No, but someone with Parkinsons probably should not be driving? Being close to people who have died by the hands of drunk drivers, I am torn on this one. The problem is other tests police use to decide you are intoxicated are easy to beat in court. A blood test is definitive proof. If I was stopped and asked to give blood without an option of breath test then that is wrong. But, if I refused the breath test, I probably have something to hide. So I don't know.

As stated already, isn't it my right to be safe (and by safe I mean without drunk drivers) on the road? I have no sympathy for drunk drivers. I think too many gift off to easily.
So, the disabled and sick can't drive? What about cancer patients? Amputees?

Of course you have a right to be safe...and we all have a right to not incriminate ourselves or be harassed by the police.
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Old 05-14-2009, 03:08 PM
 
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I won't even apologize for this: your right to feel or not feel you're being harassed is secondary to others rights to safety. I will not say there are no abuses from the police to citizens. It happens. Just as much as some citizens abuse the police. It works both ways. I've known some real a-holes in law enforcement and I've met some real good people. Have I done a study on it? No, but I've read plenty. Most of the police are trying to do a job people want them to do. And want to know who people call when they need help?

I don't know what is going on in Austin with the blood checks and I'm guessing it's going to wind up being decided in court. That would be my guess. The bottom line for me is I don't have anything to hide so let them test. If they're using the blood for something else then that is another story. But seriously, the people they want to test are the ones you can smell a mile away or they're so jacked up on other drugs it's quite obvious. I really don't think you have anything to worry about as far as being picked on if you're clean. If you do get picked on anyway and you haven't done anything then I'm sure you'll get a good lawyer or the ACLU will fight your case and protect your rights so the drugged up, drunk drivers can continue to kill themselves and others.

And just for reference and perspective when I talk about this subject I'm talking about people that are so out of it they can't even walk, let alone drive.
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Old 05-14-2009, 07:51 PM
 
3,986 posts, read 6,003,356 times
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Originally Posted by oldtoiletsmkgdflrpots View Post
No, I don't think someone with Parkinsons should be strapped down and forced to give blood. I agree with you that we all have rights. I have a right to be safe in my own home and on my own property. I have a right to be safe while driving down the road. I have a right to be safe while walking down the sidewalk. Or are those extreme rights to want? I'm just not of the persuasion that someone jacked up on coke and drunk at the same time has a right to drive, come up to my door, ask for cash for their next fix, or bug me while I'm walking down the street. I agree. We all have rights. Finding the balance is the key I suppose.
Those things you mentioned,while important, arent constitutional rights. The point of the constitution is that it protects us from the government.
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Old 05-14-2009, 08:02 PM
 
Location: Central Texas
16,186 posts, read 21,849,625 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mimimomx3 View Post
Respecting an individual's rights is the key. That means every citizen.
Exactly. Some people don't seem to get that the moment they start giving reasons for why someone else's rights shouldn't be respected for whatever "good reason" they come up with, they've just given up every right that they have. Can't have it, at least in this country, both ways - my rights should be respected, but if someone else is doing something I don't like, theirs are up for grabs. Doesn't work that way.

If someone is drinking and driving, yes, they should be stopped. However, they also still have the same rights as the rest of us to due procedure without cops having a judge in their pocket on the phone to pass out warrants like kleenex. If you don't agree with that, then you've just agreed to cops breaking down your door and coming in to your house on whatever suspicion they might have that you're doing something that they, or your neighbor's, don't like - that's the end of that slippery slope that you just shoved your fellow citizens down.
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Old 05-14-2009, 08:12 PM
 
3,986 posts, read 6,003,356 times
Reputation: 1594
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldtoiletsmkgdflrpots View Post
I won't even apologize for this: your right to feel or not feel you're being harassed is secondary to others rights to safety. I will not say there are no abuses from the police to citizens. It happens. Just as much as some citizens abuse the police. It works both ways. I've known some real a-holes in law enforcement and I've met some real good people. Have I done a study on it? No, but I've read plenty. Most of the police are trying to do a job people want them to do. And want to know who people call when they need help?

I don't know what is going on in Austin with the blood checks and I'm guessing it's going to wind up being decided in court. That would be my guess. The bottom line for me is I don't have anything to hide so let them test. If they're using the blood for something else then that is another story. But seriously, the people they want to test are the ones you can smell a mile away or they're so jacked up on other drugs it's quite obvious. I really don't think you have anything to worry about as far as being picked on if you're clean. If you do get picked on anyway and you haven't done anything then I'm sure you'll get a good lawyer or the ACLU will fight your case and protect your rights so the drugged up, drunk drivers can continue to kill themselves and others.

And just for reference and perspective when I talk about this subject I'm talking about people that are so out of it they can't even walk, let alone drive.
The issue is that when you allow the government to do the above things, you allow judgement calls on a daily basis. History proves that every government abuses those actions. Im willing to tolerate people killed by drunk drivers to respect the constitutional right to due process. The police can always get a warrant to draw your blood. Here are some of the things our government has done even without the right to do them:

Used military men and women as subjects in harmful experiments
Locked up innocent japanese men and women into internment camps during ww 2
Any number of IRS horror stories
Taking peoples property to give to someone to develop condominiums
Locked jose pedilla, a US citizen, away for almost 5 years without a trial on suspicion of a crime

My parents were originally from a country where people disappeared in the middle of the night. You have no idea what governments are capable of when given too much power.

Try to find out how many people are actually killed by drunk drivers before you give up your constitutional rights to be protected. (hint: drunk driving statistics mostly report total fatalities)
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