Nominations for Worst Drivers in Austin (Converse, Howe: gated, move to, cars)

[TexasHorseLady]

Originally Posted by brattpowered

I just think drivers should adhere to good driving practices as set out in the Texas driver's manual. There is no mention of "nutcases" or rate of speed, just an instruction to be prepared to move over.

People should not speed either, but it's the responsibility of each person to follow good driving practices. Just because someone else does not doesn't mean you are entitled to ignore these practices as well!

You know, that last wasn't said at all. What WAS said was that people who are speeding and blame others for being the problem are failing to take responsibility for the consequences of their own actions in causing the problem in the first place by speeding.

So, straight out: Do YOU acknowledge that, by speeding, you are the primary cause of the problem, because if you weren't speeding, someone going the speed limit in the left lane would not need to move over in order for you to get by because the person going the speed limit (you do get what that word means, right?) would not be the slower traffic?

[brattpowered]

I didn't mention anything about speed limits, and neither did the manual when dictating this good driving practice. So no, I'm not going to acknowledge something that is irrelevent.

Or even better, I will acknowledge that if a driver weren't going faster than someone loitering in the left lane that the loiterer would not need to move, if you acknowledge that these practices dictate that the loiterer move regardless of how fast the other driver is going.

[calel]

In my opinion, the worst drivers on the road are bicyclists charging down the shoulder of 360. Sure, it may be pretty to ride on, but 360 is a full-fledged highway with entrance and exit ramps.

[TexasHorseLady]

Originally Posted by brattpowered

I didn't mention anything about speed limits, and neither did the manual when dictating this good driving practice. So no, I'm not going to acknowledge something that is irrelevent.

Or even better, I will acknowledge that if a driver weren't going faster than someone loitering in the left lane that the loiterer would not need to move, if you acknowledge that these practices dictate that the loiterer move regardless of how fast the other driver is going.

Dancing all around giving a direct answer, aren't we? And I already acknowledged that last several times in this discussion.

How about a direct yes or no answer to this one. If a driver is going faster than the speed limit, is their behavior in speeding the original cause of the problem?

[brattpowered]

To answer your question, it is the speeding (or not technically speeding) driver's rate of speed that makes the loiterer adhere to good driving practices and common courtesy and move over regardless of how fast the other driver is moving. If the driver were not going faster than the inconsiderate loiterer, no matter what their rate of speed is, there would be no reason for that person to move. Does this answer your question? Hopefully it does, and you can answer my question in the second paragraph of my previous post unless you want to dance around it too.

[TexasHorseLady]

Originally Posted by brattpowered

To answer your question, it is the speeding (or not technically speeding) driver's rate of speed that makes the loiterer adhere to good driving practices and common courtesy and move over regardless of how fast the other driver is moving. If the driver were not going faster than the inconsiderate loiterer, no matter what their rate of speed is, there would be no reason for that person to move. Does this answer your question? Hopefully it does, and you can answer my question in the second paragraph of my previous post unless you want to dance around it too.

I already answered that question, both in my reply to the post it's in and previously.

However, you still did not answer "Yes" or "No" to the question of the speeder's responsibility in causing the problem in the first place. Leaving the "inconsiderate loiterer" who is going the actual speed limit's responsibility after the problem has been caused out of it (which has already been acknowledged as contributory negligence, which is the answer to your question yet again), does the speeder have the primary responsibility for causing the problem in the first place?

In other words, yes or no, if the speeder were not speeding but was going the speed limit, and everyone else was going the speed limit, would there be a problem?

[brattpowered]

Like I said, "If the driver were not going faster than the inconsiderate loiterer, no matter what their rate of speed is [if the person were speeding or not], there would be no reason for that person to move" and adhere to good driving practices. I don't know how you weren't able to extrapolate a "yes" to your question out of that.

I'm glad you acknowledged that drivers should move as a good driving practice as well. This is settled on my end. Are you satisfied too?

[twange]

Sure is a whole lot of tit-for-tat going on here...This is one of those discussions that try to measure "strict interpretation of law" against "common sense". Good luck. Humans have been trying to sort that crap out for quite a long time

Wow, I didn't know that speeding (technically, this would mean driving 56 in a 55), qualifies me as a nutcase criminal

[love roses]

To me, going 56 in a 55 doesn't count as speeding. Going 90 certainly does and that's exactly what gets my goat. If I'm cruising along in the right lane going 55 and come up behind someone going 45, I don't try and rear end them to make them go 55. I look in my blind spot to see if someone is in the left lane or not and when I can I get over into the left lane to increase my speed so I can get around the slower person. If, while I am passing, someone comes up behind me going extremely fast and gets literally inches from my bumper and acts aggressively, trying to force me to hurry up and ram my car into a non existent space in the right lane, YEAH, I have a MAJOR problem with that. Not all drivers going faster in the left lane are that aggressive and don't try and bump you from behind and cause a massive pileup just so they can try and drive 7,000 miles an hr. Some are cool and back off for a bit and give you a chance to get over safely so you don't end up killing a person in the right lane just to let speedy keep going without having to get a charley horse because they have to take their foot off the gas for just a brief moment. THAT is the type of driver I have a problem with.

People like that are literally a danger on the road and how they don't lose their licenses is beyond me.

[CptnRn]

Originally Posted by brattpowered
I just think drivers should adhere to good driving practices as set out in the Texas driver's manual. There is no mention of "nutcases" or rate of speed, just an instruction to be prepared to move over.

People should not speed either, but it's the responsibility of each person to follow good driving practices. Just because someone else does not doesn't mean you are entitled to ignore these practices as well!

Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady

You know, that last wasn't said at all. What WAS said was that people who are speeding and blame others for being the problem are failing to take responsibility for the consequences of their own actions in causing the problem in the first place by speeding.

So, straight out: Do YOU acknowledge that, by speeding, you are the primary cause of the problem, because if you weren't speeding, someone going the speed limit in the left lane would not need to move over in order for you to get by because the person going the speed limit (you do get what that word means, right?) would not be the slower traffic?

I think you have an excellent point here. It is the driver who is speeding, and tailgating that is creating a dangerous situation, they are the greater of the two evils and breaking two laws as they do so. If the driver who is going slower is driving the speed limit then they are not in themselves creating a hazard, it is the driver tailgating them that is in the wrong.