Are the relos moving to Austin some of the least grounded/established in the areas they are coming from? (Hamilton: condo, how much)

[austin-steve]

Actually, I think Hutto is doing a great job with its trail system. It's not huge by any means, but I can get on it and go under 79 to get to other areas of town. Like flowerpots says, pretty soon all the schools will be interconnected so kids don't have to walk near traffic. We're also about to get lots more sidewalks.

What were the bonds that Hutto voted down? I didn't study up on it, but anytime I see a community saying "no thanks" to more spending, I think "good job". Not that all bonds are wasteful or not needed - some are - but as a new (new as in recent growth) growing community, it's important to not overdrive the headlights, in a manner of speaking.

Steve

[love roses]

Only one, for a sports complex. My next door neighbor and my husband are thinking like you as far as bonds. My husband asked me why in the world do I want to pay higher taxes? I think the improvements can only do us good in the long run....or so I hope. Last time we had a bond election everything got voted down. These had more to do with street improvements (widening, sidewalks, covering ditches), bike trails, YMCA....lots of people here go to the ones in Taylor or Round Rock anyway..the Sports Complex, park improvements. I voted yes on them because I think it can only make this a better place.

[inthecut]

Originally Posted by oldtoiletsmkgdflrpots

Whoa ITC, you need to get out more. Hutto not only has sidewalks but they are putting in MORE sidewalks, (which is needed). The plan is to connect all of the schools with sidewalks. How cool is that? As far as I can tell the city DOES involve people in decisions regarding the future planning. Regarding the "commons area" you speak of we are getting a YMCA. In my opinion this is AWESOME! It's a place for all ages to meet. I can't wait!

You say the outskirts don't have sidewalks?? From where we live I can maneuver around to find the trail that leads to downtown Hutto, (and they are adding to that trail as well). Although I admit since they moved the post office it is more of a challenge, (but doable). I do NOT like crossing 1660.

We didn't want to live in a commune so Hutto suits us fine. The schools are good. I have found the teachers to be accessible as well as staff, (my personal feeling is the teachers do care about the children). They know where the children are, what they're doing and how they are doing. I love how the schools here have accountability!

The people that live in the subdivision where we purchased, (I really didn't want to live in a subdivision) are friendly. I'm not really the "let's have coffee and talk about everyone else" kind of neighbor so a wave and hello, or "isn't this weather fantastic" suit us fine. I have grown to like it here. Could there be a homicidal maniac hiding somewhere in one of these homes? I suppose so but that is wherever you go eh?

If I were Jesse Jackson I'd say this was a "rainbow" neighborhood. People from all walks of life. Actually, the only negative encounters I've had are with people that claim they have "lived here their whole life". In this neighborhood I see many young families with children out doing what families and children do, (playing, walking their dogs, pushing babies in strollers). I would have to say this is a nice neighborhood. That could change I suppose but that is where we're at now.

Now, if only they would put in a nice, big grocery store I wouldn't have to leave Hutto much at all.

I'm sure you're "central" neighborhoods were young once. Don't worry, our trees will grow and we'll have that long-standing vegetation some day.

Regarding your original question, (yes, I have veered off). You say "grounded and established". I would challenge you to support what those terms actually mean. I suppose if we went back in time I would understand what you mean in regards to farmers for instance, (or hunters and gatherers). The family farm would be handed down from generation to generation. Also, with a state that has strong manufacturing. People were established and grounded as generation after generation were able to get a good job to support a family.

My question to you is, "what social structure is in place that supports the family staying in one area generation after generation so they can become established in an area?"

And of course I'm aware that old money can purchase an entire state where a family becomes "established and grounded". But obviously I'm not addressing that social strata.

And really, how "established and grounded" can any of us be? Life is fragile, can end in a blink of an eye. I don't want to take it for granted. We have today, this moment. Life is good but can change in an instant. And to be ever so cliche: my head is in the clouds but my feet are firmly planted on the ground. We all seem to be happy here. I do believe moving CAN change things for the better.

Also, I haven't noticed much road rage here in Hutto. Where I do notice it is when I get closer to the city.

Personally, I don't know why you are driven to pursue the line of questioning you do. What are you looking for?

And lastly, I tire of your endless insults regarding being on a forum and talking to people we may never meet. I'm perplexed as to how you can do that while spending so much time here talking to us "strangers". It must be a real conflict.

I can only speak from the sprawl I saw growing up in my metro and the sprawl I see in Austin and the other few cities I've lived in. It has much to to with the larger area houses take up in the lots they're contained in. Lot sizes are the same as they ever were, while houses have gotten far larger. Something has to give, and sidewalks are part of the casualty.
Also, today's subdivisions try to avoid as much possibilities of strangers or solicitors as possible, and removing as many communal areas as possible, sometimes including sidewalks, serves that purpose, as well as the winding, cul-de-sac nature of most subdivisions. Also, the older right-angle grid subdivisions pre-90's or so followed a right-angle grid, as an extension of the central city grid. The rectilinear grid pattern is infinitely more conducive to sidewalks than the serpentine nature of today's subdivisions.....finally, they simply cost more, and developers will cut costs wherever they can, being largely public, non-local corporations, with little ties to the local communities, if any at all, unlike the past, when builders themselves were all local...

I know that some subdivisions are friendlier than others, and some may provide more public thruspace like sidewalks, but the whole point of subdivisions is to keep strangers/traffic/ outsiders minimized, under the guise of crime and other things(solicitors, unruly kids, too much thru traffic, etc.). Often there are only a few ingress/egress roads leading into and out of the subdivisions as well.

Point is, they are constructed to minimize contact, rather than facilitate it....the abject lack of common areas/neighborhood centers extends the same....do most people prefer it? Probably so, which is the reason they moved there in the first place. If people really wanted contact, residential areas would be 180 degrees different than today.

Privacy rules today, even in friendly Austin.....

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Personally, I grew up in a traditional old neighborhood in the city, where people sat on porches and in chairs in front of their garages in the summer, neighbors would just drop in, and it was safe for kids to ride bikes all over the area(without those silly little helmets, BTW)....We rode to our local library, theater, shopping several miles away from 2nd grade on, and had the time of our lives.......As a teen, I started seeing suburban sprawl latently develop, and hated it from the getgo....I always thought it was ugly and cheap, and thought little if anything for the lifestyle of the kids growing up in the same.....biking to the library or store was a no go then, as Lamar blvd type traffic would have to be navigated, and without sidewalks in the retail areas, even that was denied.....


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Old toilets, good for you and your subdivision that you are reclaiming some vestige of humanity for yourselves and your neighbors. The day we let out-of-area developers dictate our lifestyles is a sad day indeed! And I like your description of groundedness and the fragility of life near the end of your post. Actually very beautiful. That's more important than anthing we can talk about. True, we are here and gone in a flash, so we are never really "grounded".....However, if we appreciate the short, fragile nature that is life, and let the uniqueness and beauty of those strangers we rush by each day seep in, even just a little, we are about as grounded as that term can possibly be.........

[mark311]

Originally Posted by inthecut

Actually, I can't even jog on the main street near my condo in Ft. Myers, as their retail strip has no sidewalks as well, and just culverts/retention ponds on the curbage, along with lots of asphalt.....and no kids are seen riding bikes either, but tons of SUV's are seen dropping kids off from place to place......
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How long ago did you move from Austin to Ft. Myers? Maybe things have changed for the better since you were last in the Austin area if it was a long time ago.

[inthecut]

Originally Posted by love roses

Only one, for a sports complex. My next door neighbor and my husband are thinking like you as far as bonds. My husband asked me why in the world do I want to pay higher taxes? I think the improvements can only do us good in the long run....or so I hope. Last time we had a bond election everything got voted down. These had more to do with street improvements (widening, sidewalks, covering ditches), bike trails, YMCA....lots of people here go to the ones in Taylor or Round Rock anyway..the Sports Complex, park improvements. I voted yes on them because I think it can only make this a better place.

Improvements bring up property values, and attract more residents...also, they bring back every penny and more so from the increase in tax base per the new residents attracted to the improvements in the first place....

the stingy, not in my backyard, let someone else build it mentality will just cause other areas to build out their own needed communal amenities and attract growth away....

Re Bike trails, the first few burbs to build a solid, long, viable bike only trail will see more growth than they could possibly dream. Austin's demographic of healthy, youngish families and singles screams for bike trails....the wisest thing they could do in the outlying region is establish a county or region wide corsortium to build it out throughout the entire region...

[inthecut]

Originally Posted by mark311

How long ago did you move from Austin to Ft. Myers? Maybe things have changed for the better since you were last in the Austin area if it was a long time ago.

Actually, it's an investment property condo I rent out sometimes, and live in a few months of the year(Jan -Feb usually)....I saw it on the web, looked good, it was listed for 78K, and I snapped it up, in 2001...The value shot up to 180K, then dropped down to just about what I paid for it(per the bust).....after all is said, its just a nice place to get away and feel 80's sunshine in the winter, and next to gulf beaches if I feel landlocked in Austin....

And yes, there are no sidewalks on their retail strips, just like much of Austin.....

[Paulmmm]

Our subdivision in South Austin (the Knolls of Slaughter Creek - probably about 5 years old) has sidewalks on both sides of every single street. We also have a community pool with a playground and picnic area right next to it, where neighbors gather all the time.

The kids and adults are on the sidewalks, front yards, pool area, and streets playing, walking their dogs, borrowing tools, driving each other places, etc. all the time. And when the people here have yard sales, everyone puts signs out on FM 1626, South 1st, and Manchaca (as well as putting ads in the paper and Craigslist) inviting "strangers" and "outsiders" into the development.

Our development may be the exception to the rule that another poster is presenting as the norm here, but having been to a lot of other developments in Austin (while looking at houses 2 years ago and visiting friends now), I just don't think so.

And I always thought that "the whole point of subdivisions" is to actually provide housing, not to minimize contact or discourage outsiders. It seems to me that that would be an extremely odd reason to build houses.

Just out of curiosity, can people weigh in on their subdivisions (and others that they know about) as to whether there are many sidewalks, common areas, visible neighbors, etc.? I'd be curious as to whether my subdivision layout and openness is the exception or the rule in Austin.

[love roses]

I'm going to say it's a rule in Austin. I know in our neighborhood here in Hutto, people frequently sit in their front yards in the driveway or front porch, walk, jog, play at the park, swim at the pool, have block parties and all other manner of parties, help each other out, etc...I also have friends who live in other neighborhoods around the area either here in Hutto, in Avery Ranch, West Round Rock, East Round Rock, Pflugerville, Manor, Georgetown, Taylor, Bastrop, Elgin, McDade.....wherever....many of the people are that way and so are their neighborhoods. I think it's just how Texans are. It's not just Austin either. We had great neighbors in Houston and my sister has some cool neighbors in Dallas.

[inthecut]

I'm glad, very glad, if i'm mistaken.......that's exactly how I grew up, and how most city neighborhoods were up till the 70's or so.......My experience with sprawl subdivisions, new construction housing, call it what you will, was formed over many years of seeing and living it in other cities, much of it in the Chicago metro, Indianapolis's Hamilton County(just north of city like our north burbs), and south florida. I live in a condo in the central city, but I do have occasion to drive throughout some of the burbs and newer city subs, and it looks much like what I'm familiar with, at least the upper-middle class and upscale ones.....the older city areas that date to the 70's and 80's most definitely seem to have more of the "sharing sugar/sitting on porches" goings on. I've never seen any of the good old neighborly sharing you mention where I've been. I saw lots of kids riding bikes in the streets and such, and hanging out, and such, but the houses and lots were large enough to make it hard to see any social activity centered on the same, though the backyards could have been buzzing with activity. The new construction I've seen did not have the porches of old, though sometimes had handsome facades and porticos in front, with winding driveways......

I think that the fact that so many people are new in Austin forces people to get out of their shell a bit. So many are unmoored from old friends and family, and MUST get out of their comfort zone if they plan on having any friends. Surely the native texans and southerners bring a measure of down home friendliness as well.

I have a few questions for you guys as well. Sounds like you are relatively new arrivals, and quite excited about moving to Austin, with the extra buzz and energy that goes with any new experience, and that seems to filter down to the connections you are making....How established are these areas? Are they mostly composed of new arrivals like yourself?

How many safe paths/streets are there for kids to bike on? Are you concerned about heavy traffic when they venture forth on their bikes, helmeted or not? Do your kids have access to bike trails, specifically and only for bikes/joggers?

How much public spaces, besides pools, are in your subdivisions? Are there just little "pocket parks", just large enough to take toddlers on swings, or are they substantial, with large fields for baseball/soccer/football, along with rec centers for neighborhood activities?

Do you honestly hang out with your neighbors, or just know them enough to chat once in while?
Do you invite them in for dinner, parties, and such? Would you honestly feel comfortable knocking on many of their doors asking them to join you doing something? Do you have their home/cell numbers in case of emergency, or when you go on vacation to keep an eye on the house?

How are the retail options outside of the big-boxes on the major streets? Are there smaller little local stores independently owned you can walk to? Speaking of walking to, are the amenities close enough to walk to outside the subdivision, or must one fire up the car to do pretty much everything?

Finally, and don't take offense, how diverse are your subdivisions? Are they pretty much Anglo, with a smattering of a few Asians, Asian-Indians and such, or do you have a fair number of blacks and hispanics? Are your childrens schools composed largely of the same demographic as well?

Thanks for your candor..........

[Jennibc]

To answer you ITC, we are in Circle C. Our street has a block party just about every week during daylight savings time. One neighbor is our emergency contact for our son's school and we are theirs. Sometimes I pick my neighbor's kids up from school. We babysit for each other. The kids ride bikes together outside. There are a couple of parks where the kids can play. There are sidewalks throughout the entire subdivision.

Up at Escarpment Village, walking distance from some parts of the neighborhood, we have several locally owned eateries and an icecream shop. There is a large HEB but it carries many of the items from Central Market.

On the diversity front, if by that do you mean are there people of color, there are some, but certainly not many, I would say between 15 and 20%.