Old bludgers immigrating to Aus and NZ (retiree, health)

[the troubadour]

If aged folk have the economic base to fund their stay in Australia,be that from their own fortune of children undertaking a written agreement to be responsible,i can see no problem.

Aged folk from many nations live out their non working years in droves in so many other nations,be it Spain or Cyprus or Thailand or Panama where most take out private insurance.

Really can't see a problem at all.

[artemis agrotera]

Originally Posted by nzrugby

NZ bubble ? I served with the 6RAR, two tours of Vietnam, you have done what for Australia ?

So yep I have paid my dues to Aus to comment.

haha! Using military experience, to say you have more of a say than me. Musta hit a nerve there.

[anski]

Here's another another situation to ponder.
A British person migrating to Australia in the 1960's aged 20 & then works in Australia all their life until 65, upon retirement decides would like to spend remaining years left with their only family member who happens to live in UK.
Q. Now what does pension is this person entitled to from the Australian government?
A. If going to live in UK permanently- Zero -reason Australia does not have reciprocal agreement with UK
Q.So what is this person entitled to from the UK government?
A. Zero- In the past you would have been required to have contributed for 44 years to the UK system to qualify for a pension but this has since been reduced to 30 years.

Bit tough eh?

[minibrings]

Originally Posted by nzrugby

Get it right, 99% of Pacific Islanders getting state housing are born in NZ which makes them kiwis.
We owe old foreigners who want to move to NZ nothing.

Again can you support your claims with actual government statistics?

[minibrings]

[quote=anski;18901527]

Originally Posted by nzrugby

Get it right, 99% of Pacific Islanders getting state housing are born in NZ which makes them kiwis.

Well I am not sure that statement is correct, where do you get your facts from?

He has no sources for his facts. I did a google, could not find the data.
The only data I found are the ones that showed that Maoris are over-represented in jails (sad).

[the troubadour]

Originally Posted by anski

Here's another another situation to ponder.
A British person migrating to Australia in the 1960's aged 20 & then works in Australia all their life until 65, upon retirement decides would like to spend remaining years left with their only family member who happens to live in UK.
Q. Now what does pension is this person entitled to from the Australian government?
A. If going to live in UK permanently- Zero -reason Australia does not have reciprocal agreement with UK
Q.So what is this person entitled to from the UK government?
A. Zero- In the past you would have been required to have contributed for 44 years to the UK system to qualify for a pension but this has since been reduced to 30 years.

Bit tough eh?

A bit tough indeed. Even more so considering it was paid until 2001. Even more confounding is that it will be paid if the retiree decides to move to Germany or The Netherlands or Portugal along with a number of other countries.

[anski]

Originally Posted by the troubadour

A bit tough indeed. Even more so considering it was paid until 2001. Even more confounding is that it will be paid if the retiree decides to move to Germany or The Netherlands or Portugal along with a number of other countries.

Yes really tough seeing that Australia has reciprocal agreements with I think 17 other countries which include many European countries & USA but not UK.

What really stinks though is if UK retired citizen goes to live in Australia or New Zealand they will receive pension from governments in these countries after a qualifying period even though they have never contributed in any way.

But not the same in the UK -nothing unless you are an illegal entrant!!!!!!!!!!!

[the troubadour]

Originally Posted by anski

Yes really tough seeing that Australia has reciprocal agreements with I think 17 other countries which include many European countries & USA but not UK.

What really stinks though is if UK retired citizen goes to live in Australia or New Zealand they will receive pension from governments in these countries after a qualifying period even though they have never contributed in any way.

But not the same in the UK -nothing unless you are an illegal entrant!!!!!!!!!!!

I would assume though a person on a British passport would get the basic pension?

It is possible to top up one's National Insurance payments while away. Read something about this the other day.

Wonder which nation severed the agreement in 2001, Britain or Australia,have you any idea?

Are you considering a move back? I've considered moving there as somehow the idea of living in a compact country that is easy to get around would have a strong appeal I feel in old age.
Little scared will be forced to work far longer though. Have/am looked/looking into mainland European countries as well but that's a hard one to decide.

Always South East Asia and have giving consideration to Malaysia,a country I do already know,where has in place a rather good policy called "Make Malaysia Your Second Home" easy to obtain for those fifty and over.

[Darla.R]

Originally Posted by anski

I think Work & Income (WINZ) & Housing New Zealand (HNZ)would spend more on housing & providing all forms of financial support to Pacific Islanders & Asians than free medical care given to senior citizens moving to New Zealand.

Did you know HNZ build 6 bedroom houses to house large South Pacific families?

What would the government of these countries provide for Kiwi's?????

But isn't that racial profiling Anski?

Not all immigrants from those countries have large families and not all of them will be seeking financial support from the NZ government. Do HNZ still build houses and would they build one for a large Catholic or Mormon family in preference to a PI family?

Originally Posted by nzrugby

This is plain wrong, old people whose children have moved to Aus or NZ should not be allowed to immigrate in unless they can pay the full cost of their medical care as they use it.
They have done nothing for Aus or NZ so why should they be owed ?

You have a good point here nzrugby. No one should be allowed to immigrate unless they can contribute and pay their way without being a burden on their host country. My feeling is that too many people are retiring to NZ seeing its welfare system and free healthcare it as a soft option.

It's unfair when women on temporary visas and international students are deported if they become pregnant, EVEN IF THEY OFFER TO PAY FOR THEIR MATERNITY CARE. More so when many of them are well educated and are working towards permanent residency when they, and presumably their children, are highly likely to contribute to New Zealand to a significant degree.

The present system means that more and more young people are leaving for jobs abroad and they're being replaced with older people and retirees.

[anski]

Originally Posted by the troubadour

I would assume though a person on a British passport would get the basic pension?

Troubadour

Just to answer part of your comments:

To obtain a age pension in the UK you have to contributed to the system for 33 years (previously it was 40 years) otherwise you are entitled to NOTHING.

The agreement with the United Kingdom (UK) ended on 1 March 2001.

I think Australia severed the agreement. If memory serves me right the situation was this.
A friend who was born in UK but moved to Australia in his 20's then moved back to the UK 2 years before qualifying for an age pension was given a pamphlet by Centrelink on leaving Australia advising to contact the authorities in the UK as they would pay him an age pension.
On arrival in the UK he went & inquired & they were quite adamant that because he had not made 40 years contributions he was not entitled to anything. He produced the pamphlet & they just dismissed it. Shortly afterwards ( approx March 2000) the full page newspaper advertisements appeared in the UK newspapers paid for by the Australian government .

The newspaper adverts stated the facts that Centrelink was paying Australian age pensions to retired Brits who had moved to Australia & had never contributed to the country, & they were happy to do that as long as the UK government did the same for any Australian moving to the UK in retirement years. However there were far more Brits moving to Australia in retirement, than those moving to UK in retirement so the financial obligations were not balanced & I wonder how many former Australian residents were refused a British age pension?????

The Australian government went on to say they were giving the British government 12 months notice to correct this situation or the Australian government would cease paying age pensions to Brits moving to Australia. I think they did not entirely remove it but replaced it with a 2 year waiting period before qualifying.

Since then Australia WILL NOT pay an Australian Age pension to anybody residing in the UK BUT they will pay it if living in any of these countries which Australia has reciprocal agreements with.
Australia has agreements with a number of countries to share the responsibility for social security coverage. These agreements are with:

Austria
Belgium
Canada
Chile
Croatia
Cyprus
Czech Republic
Denmark
Finland
Germany
Greece
Republic of Ireland
Italy
Japan
Republic of Korea
the former Yugoslav
Republic of Macedonia
Malta
the Netherlands
New Zealand
Norway
Poland
Portugal
Slovenia
Spain
Switzerland
United States of America (USA)

On the other hand I knew of a retired Brit who gained entry to New Zealand because of his younger wife's qualifications. They are no longer married & at first he continued claiming the UK age pension but after he obtained citizenship he then switched over to the NZ pension realising that NZ Super was more flexible in allowing him to earn an income & it paid more than the UK pension also. He has since left New Zealand & living in Europe but grumbles that the lousy Kiwi's will not continue paying the NZ pension if away from the country for more than 6 months! Yet he has never contributed a farthing to NZ apart from the GST (VAT) on purchases. Some people are so greedy. Rant over.