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Old 07-13-2011, 01:08 AM
 
9,703 posts, read 12,026,104 times
Reputation: 7064
Quote:
Originally Posted by BCC_1 View Post
Thank you for making my point.

Even the Christian Science Monitor agreed that the "Climategate" scientists had not misled anyone. Of course the tin-foil hat brigade will never be happy.
I don't see how there is anything intellectually wrong with skepticism, rather use my own common sense and basic science to understand that a tiny faction of CO2 is not going to cause crazy weather patterns and all of the coastal cities to drown. Just because some paid off scientist says so doesn't mean it is so.

There are all kinds of quacky things scientists believed in the past that ended up being not true.

None of the prophets of doom who all insisted we adopt these radical measures have been right at all so far and none of their science holds water.

Speaking of water, water vapor causes more greenhouse effect than co2 does.

Go back and read those emails, those scientists did manipulate data and they did set out to misled people.

All of the global warming hysteria is the new vehicle for marxism, all dressed up differently and rebranded. All of the things they propose do nothing but increase costs, kill jobs, punish private business, increase dependency on government and increase taxes. There is absolutely nothing in this carbon tax scheme that will change the climate at all.

The earth's climate is much bigger than all of us. It has always gone in cycles and it always will.

Most people seem to be unaware than during the Medieval Warming Period the earth was even warmer than now. People had tons of food, life was good and Vikings settled Greenland. The previous warming period was marked with the rise of the Roman Empire and subsequently the decline as well when cooling set in.
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Old 07-13-2011, 01:30 AM
 
1,942 posts, read 1,369,928 times
Reputation: 1428
Quote:
Originally Posted by wanneroo View Post
I don't see how there is anything intellectually wrong with skepticism, rather use my own common sense and basic science to understand that a tiny faction of CO2 is not going to cause crazy weather patterns and all of the coastal cities to drown.
There's nothing wrong with skepticism. If you go back and see what I wrote, I said the overwhelming opinion of scientists is that global warming does exist and humans are in some part causing it. I don't disagree they could all be wrong, but I find conspiracy theories as fanciful as anal probing aliens.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wanneroo View Post
There are all kinds of quacky things scientists believed in the past that ended up being not true.
So what?


Quote:
Originally Posted by wanneroo View Post
None of the prophets of doom who all insisted we adopt these radical measures have been right at all so far and none of their science holds water.
This is your scientific opinion that they don't hold water, or your "common sense and basic science"?


Quote:
Originally Posted by wanneroo View Post
Go back and read those emails, those scientists did manipulate data and they did set out to misled people.
Four seperate independant inquires cleared them of trying to mislead anyone. I know that won't mean much to anyone looking for a conspiracy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wanneroo View Post
All of the global warming hysteria is the new vehicle for marxism, all dressed up differently and rebranded.
Oh dear.
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Old 07-13-2011, 04:13 AM
ino
 
Location: Way beyond the black stump.
681 posts, read 1,315,749 times
Reputation: 946
It's not conspiracy, it's design. Get the people divided and squabbling between themselves to distract them from more intelligent and pressing matters.
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Old 07-13-2011, 03:50 PM
 
9,703 posts, read 12,026,104 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BCC_1 View Post
There's nothing wrong with skepticism. If you go back and see what I wrote, I said the overwhelming opinion of scientists is that global warming does exist and humans are in some part causing it. I don't disagree they could all be wrong, but I find conspiracy theories as fanciful as anal probing aliens.

This is your scientific opinion that they don't hold water, or your "common sense and basic science"?

Four seperate independant inquires cleared them of trying to mislead anyone. I know that won't mean much to anyone looking for a conspiracy.
Overwhelming opinion of scientists?

Is that what the drive by media told you?

There is no consensus, neither are there "overwhelming" facts or opinions that support "global warming".

There is no rise in global temps in reality and no change in CO2 levels.

Everytime you breath you exhale CO2, CO2 is not a bad gas, it is essential to human survival.

I don't know where you drag the conspiracy theory into it, people that are paid to further global warming hoaxes and to put money in their pocket have radically falsified figures and studies. I got eyes, I can read.

There is plenty of info out there, all people have to do is research outside of what they have been force fed and use some basic scientific common sense.

The left that promotes marxism knows change overnight creates kickback so instead they have waged a silent cultural war, slowly creating more dependency on government and government programs, gradually making life more difficult, driving up costs and taxing more and more. Global Warming, if one examines the intentions of those touting that, have marxist motives and intent and what they propose has nothing to do with the climate. Or will change the climate.

The earth is much bigger than all of us. It has it's own mechanisms to balance things and there is nothing short of nuclear war that is going to radically change the climate.

Here in the USA, I was just reading today that the lefties are after ice makers in freezers. They managed to get a rule passed that will add about $2 billion in costs to consumers due to changes fridge manufacturers have to make. All in the name of global warming cause cutting out ice makers will save a few kilowatt hours.

They've done the same with washing machines and dryers in this country. They are working on cars as well.

It's all a fraud, to drain you of money and control you the way they see fit.

All these people offer is sacrifice under the guise of "the greater good", but really it is sacrifice for them to control you.
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Old 07-13-2011, 05:28 PM
 
11,025 posts, read 5,755,055 times
Reputation: 14853
Related:

Turnbull stirs pot on carbon tax

Turnbull has every right to be annoyed with Abbott.

I wonder if people are more annoyed at the tax, or being told there wouldn't be a tax in the lead up to the election..
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Old 07-13-2011, 06:26 PM
 
Location: Brisbane
2,550 posts, read 2,422,334 times
Reputation: 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by artemis agrotera View Post
Related:

Turnbull stirs pot on carbon tax

Turnbull has every right to be annoyed with Abbott.

I wonder if people are more annoyed at the tax, or being told there wouldn't be a tax in the lead up to the election..
Yeh the more i think about it i wish Turnbull was in charge.

Ive pretty much decided i dont mind the policy (any thing that promotes technology and innovation is good as far as im concerned), but never for the life of me would i trust a labor government to impliment it.

Last edited by danielsa1775; 07-13-2011 at 06:43 PM..
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Old 07-13-2011, 06:34 PM
 
Location: Sunshine Coast, BC
10,801 posts, read 4,880,797 times
Reputation: 17567
Quote:
Originally Posted by wanneroo View Post
The left that promotes marxism knows change overnight creates kickback so instead they have waged a silent cultural war, slowly creating more dependency on government and government programs, gradually making life more difficult, driving up costs and taxing more and more. Global Warming, if one examines the intentions of those touting that, have marxist motives and intent and what they propose has nothing to do with the climate. Or will change the climate.
Sounds exactly like what our PM Brown has foisted on us.

More dependency on government? The compensation. Billions of it.

Government programs? Massive bureaucracy of carbon cops and other useless public service jobs and departments created just to administer this money churn and green programs.

Making life more difficult? We've already got little old ladies sitting in their houses, wrapped in blankets, with only one light on and the TV, worried about their next electricity bills after this Save the Planet tax. Our PM assures us that people like that will be overcompensated but nobody believes anything that twit says anymore. They're talking shutting down those nasty dirty coal plants with nothing real planned to replace them, just some airy fairy ideas about clean energy.

Driving up costs and tax us even more? Yes and yes. Everything we use and buy uses electricity along the way, most goods come to us via truck. It'll be a snowball effect with everybody adding a few bucks along the way.

I don't believe the "science is settled" mantra either. It's never settled, there's always new discoveries. The old hockey stick was quietly dropped from the IPCC report so obviously it's not settled. And all those catastrophes they predicted? Has bit too much of a religious dogma feel to me, with a lot of unquestioning blind faith expected, which always sets off alarm bells for me.

It's way too politicised and there's been far too many lies for me to buy the belief that we can alter the climate with a tax in Oz. But the biggie for me is all the carpet-baggers latching onto this, and greedy wasteful governments like ours. Banks and financial types want an ETS because of the money to be made. Money corrupts. So does handing too much power to a government.
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Old 07-13-2011, 07:45 PM
 
Location: Brisbane
2,550 posts, read 2,422,334 times
Reputation: 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vichel View Post
Sounds exactly like what our PM Brown has foisted on us.

More dependency on government? The compensation. Billions of it.

Government programs? Massive bureaucracy of carbon cops and other useless public service jobs and departments created just to administer this money churn and green programs.

Making life more difficult? We've already got little old ladies sitting in their houses, wrapped in blankets, with only one light on and the TV, worried about their next electricity bills after this Save the Planet tax. Our PM assures us that people like that will be overcompensated but nobody believes anything that twit says anymore. They're talking shutting down those nasty dirty coal plants with nothing real planned to replace them, just some airy fairy ideas about clean energy.

Driving up costs and tax us even more? Yes and yes. Everything we use and buy uses electricity along the way, most goods come to us via truck. It'll be a snowball effect with everybody adding a few bucks along the way.

I don't believe the "science is settled" mantra either. It's never settled, there's always new discoveries. The old hockey stick was quietly dropped from the IPCC report so obviously it's not settled. And all those catastrophes they predicted? Has bit too much of a religious dogma feel to me, with a lot of unquestioning blind faith expected, which always sets off alarm bells for me.

It's way too politicised and there's been far too many lies for me to buy the belief that we can alter the climate with a tax in Oz. But the biggie for me is all the carpet-baggers latching onto this, and greedy wasteful governments like ours. Banks and financial types want an ETS because of the money to be made. Money corrupts. So does handing too much power to a government.
and thats pretty much why i would never trust a labor government to impliment it.

Also pretty much every commuter train and tram network in Australia runs on electricity! Prices of public transport are going to go up, while the prices of running a car are not as petrol is exempt!

So much for promoting the use of public transport.

Last edited by danielsa1775; 07-13-2011 at 08:18 PM..
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Old 07-13-2011, 08:38 PM
 
9,703 posts, read 12,026,104 times
Reputation: 7064
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vichel View Post
I don't believe the "science is settled" mantra either. It's never settled, there's always new discoveries. The old hockey stick was quietly dropped from the IPCC report so obviously it's not settled. And all those catastrophes they predicted? Has bit too much of a religious dogma feel to me, with a lot of unquestioning blind faith expected, which always sets off alarm bells for me.

It's way too politicised and there's been far too many lies for me to buy the belief that we can alter the climate with a tax in Oz. But the biggie for me is all the carpet-baggers latching onto this, and greedy wasteful governments like ours. Banks and financial types want an ETS because of the money to be made. Money corrupts. So does handing too much power to a government.
Agreed.

The weather people can't even predict my weather forecast with any accuracy 5 days ahead, so somehow they are going to know 50 years down the road???

Right.

There are always new discoveries, as science rolls on, there is a lot more to our weather and atmosphere than CO2.

Back 10 years ago there were articles in the UK papers saying that children would never know snow again and that winter was a thing of the past.

Except the past 2 winters the UK has been BURIED under snow, so much so it's shut the country down for days and weeks at a time.

Here in the USA it's known from tree core samples(we have trees up to 5000 years old here) that generally the USA swings in 30-40 year long "hot and dry" and "cold and wet" cycles and the world in general also has longer bigger cycles of 300-400 year spells.

Global Warming is just another example of political correctness. It's like a green religion that is not allowed to be questioned and if we don't pay tons of tax and wear dirty clothes and not have ice machines and freeze in the winter and ride a bike to work, the climate will be ruined and we will all die.

Well we are all going to die anyways. I believe if things like electricity and oil are here, they are here for a reason, God put them here for us to make good lives for ourselves. Obviously we should not be wasteful to be wasteful, but it's also stupid to freeze in winter and boil in summer and not be able to go anywhere or do anything.
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Old 07-13-2011, 08:42 PM
 
11,025 posts, read 5,755,055 times
Reputation: 14853
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielsa1775 View Post
Yeh the more i think about it i wish Turnbull was in charge.

Ive pretty much decided i dont mind the policy (any thing that promotes technology and innovation is good as far as im concerned), but never for the life of me would i trust a labor government to impliment it.
I think Turnbull is a much better leader than speedo abott. There was a poll on the age website this morning, 79% prefer Turnbull to 15% to abbott ....

And to think Turnbull was outed for agreeing to ETS, whilst abbott doesn't have a clear policy other than "oppose everything" and come up with ridiculous figures to try to sell his ideas.
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