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Old 10-03-2012, 12:21 AM
 
3,183 posts, read 7,170,216 times
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I heard about the reef today.. Well the way I see it is that reef is very close to Australia so we need to figure out what the people in Australia did to it so they wont do it any more....
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Old 10-03-2012, 01:07 AM
 
Location: Canada
4,866 posts, read 10,478,593 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TVC15 View Post
You sound like a very clueless/ignorant person....unless you have a solid diverse science background or are just a truly brilliant person then NOTHING you say holds merit when it comes to global warming and the coral reefs.


IMO ignorance is not bliss
Honestly, you don't even need to believe in global warming to realize humans are killing the reef through CO2 emissions. You just have to recognize that the concentration of CO2 has gone up and that the equilibrium reaction of atmospheric CO2 with the ocean means this causes more carbonic acid in the ocean, so we're acidifying the ocean. Of course, the raise in temperature compounds the acidification and kills the reefs even more.
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Old 10-03-2012, 01:30 AM
ino
 
Location: Way beyond the black stump.
680 posts, read 2,492,105 times
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And so the cycle comes full circle once again. This has been going on since time began.
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Old 10-03-2012, 01:44 AM
ino
 
Location: Way beyond the black stump.
680 posts, read 2,492,105 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
Very tragic. Global warming and pollution affects everyone, and everyone is to blame. When will we truly start to work as one to solve this problem?

I was lucky enough to snorkel in the Great Barrier Reef - it is an amazing experience, I dread to think what the world will be like in 50 years time. What will be left of the GBR and the world's coral reefs.
Slight correction required here. Everyone is *NOT* to blame. If you want to blame anyone, blame the capitalist ethos. It's governments and corporations that are to blame, we are but puppets dancing to their tune. I recall an outcry about oil shortage back in the 70's but did they do anything constructive about it...No!

We have the ways and means to do things better...but there is no money in that, not until they can come up with some other capitalist scheme whereby WE pay for it!

I certainly won't cop this "we are to blame" rubbish, think outside of the box.

As long as the corporation has control, and governments are in their back pockets, we'll NEVER work as one, that's not how capitalism works, it thinks only of NUMBER 1, and that's not you and me I'm afraid, it's themselves and the shareholders. You and me are only a means to THEIR end, financial end that is.
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Old 10-03-2012, 06:48 AM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,606 posts, read 55,818,026 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theunbrainwashed View Post
Well, maybe if people spent mroe time teaching about real environmentalism, and not crock like global warming, people wouldn't be so trashy. But, you're complaining about the first world being trashy? You do know the dirtiest people and those with the least respect for the environment are those living in 3rd world countries, not first?
I agree global warming might be hogging the limelight at the expense of other issues...pollution, recycling, resources, deforestation - they'll all have the same end result of making this planet less liveable for every species including us.

I never put the sole blame on first world countries. I've been to China and Vietnam and have seen how they treat the ocean like a big rubbish dump. This will require a truly effort. Encouraging environmentalism and green thinking is half the effort - the other half is that many people still want to live this consumerist lifestyle.

I think arguing the finer points of global warming is besides the point, in a sense. Warming or not, pollution is bad, so we should be trying to cut emissions regardless.
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Old 10-03-2012, 06:51 AM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,606 posts, read 55,818,026 times
Reputation: 11862
Quote:
Originally Posted by ino View Post
Slight correction required here. Everyone is *NOT* to blame. If you want to blame anyone, blame the capitalist ethos. It's governments and corporations that are to blame, we are but puppets dancing to their tune. I recall an outcry about oil shortage back in the 70's but did they do anything constructive about it...No!

We have the ways and means to do things better...but there is no money in that, not until they can come up with some other capitalist scheme whereby WE pay for it!

I certainly won't cop this "we are to blame" rubbish, think outside of the box.

As long as the corporation has control, and governments are in their back pockets, we'll NEVER work as one, that's not how capitalism works, it thinks only of NUMBER 1, and that's not you and me I'm afraid, it's themselves and the shareholders. You and me are only a means to THEIR end, financial end that is.
That's a rather defeatist attitude. The governments/corporations are supported by the people, we support them. If we really cared we wouldn't continue to support this system. We'd rise up and do something about it. It looks like most people are satisfying going through tonnes of plastic a year, burning coal for electricity, eating beef raised on land cleared of rainforest yada yada yada. I'm guilty too. We should at least start thinking about this, as we live our daily lives.
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Old 10-03-2012, 07:50 AM
ino
 
Location: Way beyond the black stump.
680 posts, read 2,492,105 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
That's a rather defeatist attitude. The governments/corporations are supported by the people, we support them. If we really cared we wouldn't continue to support this system. We'd rise up and do something about it. It looks like most people are satisfying going through tonnes of plastic a year, burning coal for electricity, eating beef raised on land cleared of rainforest yada yada yada. I'm guilty too. We should at least start thinking about this, as we live our daily lives.
NO, you are NOT guilty, that's what they want you to believe!

I agree with you for the most part, but who pushes all that plastic and cardboard upon us? I don't need anything packaged the way things are packaged, I also don't need to purchase the latest, brightest, shiniest, best packaged goods, it's about capturing the market with the newest and the best looking packaged goods to suck the consumer in, couple that with the non existent spare parts for most stuff today and the consumer is forced to BUY a new item simply because they are unable to repair the old item. That's capitalism working, your hands are always in your pocket shelling out money, and to whom are you shelling that money out to? the corporation, and its shareholders.

The only way to make change is to enforce change, as has always been the case throughout history, and that can only happen when people stop purchasing the next thing which hits the store shelf every fortnight. They need to take back their power by whatever means is necessary if they REALLY want change.

It's not a 'defeatist attitude', this is why I reject your statement about 'everyone is to blame', it's a matter of getting more people to see the bigger picture and understand it's not THEM that has caused this myth about carbon pollution. It's been forced upon us by those who will not support alternatives, unless of course there is considerable money to be made - for THEM. Those alternatives would not cost us anywhere near as much, and who would be the loser? THEM, we would be the ones to gain.

There isn't much that modern technology can't achieve in the 21st century so why don't they do something constructive about it instead of putting a guilt trip on Joe and Jill Average by making *US* the scapegoats for all the problems brought about by governments and corporations lack of interest and concern for the people at large. Capitalism is all about money, we need to break that cycle, come up with a better way of doing things, in short - people need to rebel, and this is my puny way of rebelling, trying to get people to see the bigger picture and encouraging them to get off that 'going nowhere' guilt trip train they have been herded into!

WE didn't cause the problem, THEY caused it by not looking into future sustainability! I've said it before and I'll say it again, it won't be too far away and EVERY facet of our lives will be controlled by those have the power!

I'm not even an academic but I can see what's coming around the corner. People need to read less and think more!
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Old 10-03-2012, 09:12 AM
 
Location: Central Bay Area, CA as of Jan 2010...but still a proud Texan from Houston!
7,484 posts, read 10,408,293 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIMBAM View Post
Honestly, you don't even need to believe in global warming to realize humans are killing the reef through CO2 emissions. You just have to recognize that the concentration of CO2 has gone up and that the equilibrium reaction of atmospheric CO2 with the ocean means this causes more carbonic acid in the ocean, so we're acidifying the ocean. Of course, the raise in temperature compounds the acidification and kills the reefs even more.
I totally agree with you don't have to believe in it but at the same time you don't have to be ignorant about it and act as if it is hog wash. During my entire life the only people that I have encountered who argue about global warming are those who have zero science backgrounds. They can't logically discuss this topic even with all the solid strong data to look at.
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Old 10-03-2012, 10:33 AM
 
25,024 posts, read 27,822,176 times
Reputation: 11790
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
I agree global warming might be hogging the limelight at the expense of other issues...pollution, recycling, resources, deforestation - they'll all have the same end result of making this planet less liveable for every species including us.

I never put the sole blame on first world countries. I've been to China and Vietnam and have seen how they treat the ocean like a big rubbish dump. This will require a truly effort. Encouraging environmentalism and green thinking is half the effort - the other half is that many people still want to live this consumerist lifestyle.

I think arguing the finer points of global warming is besides the point, in a sense. Warming or not, pollution is bad, so we should be trying to cut emissions regardless.
Yes, pollution is bad. However, carbon dioxide is not pollution, plants and phytoplankton need it! They are the start of the food chain on both sides of the water.

Also, ditching capitalism and replacing it with what? Socialism? Anarchy? Some of you on here are arguing that capitalism is the problem, then what do we replace it with? Cause I'll tell you, my family's lived under Stalinist socialism not that long ago, and it wasn't that environmentally friendly I'll have you know, especially not the Wartburg 353 they drove, with no emissions controls whatsoever and terrible amounts of smoke coming out the back.
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Old 10-03-2012, 10:35 AM
 
25,024 posts, read 27,822,176 times
Reputation: 11790
Quote:
Originally Posted by TVC15 View Post
I totally agree with you don't have to believe in it but at the same time you don't have to be ignorant about it and act as if it is hog wash. During my entire life the only people that I have encountered who argue about global warming are those who have zero science backgrounds. They can't logically discuss this topic even with all the solid strong data to look at.
As a fellow human being, I feel really sorry for you that you fell for the brainwashing and hate your fellow man so much. Since there is absolutely no point in arguing with you since you're so far gone, I'll have to put you on ignore.
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