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Old 08-15-2018, 12:50 PM
 
Location: Top of the South, NZ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bakery Hill View Post
A dying relationship or just need for some perspectives to be recalibrated to better fit with the realities of how different the two nations are in a lot of ways, particularly global outlook and sense of place in the world?
A dying relationship.
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Old 08-15-2018, 03:29 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90 View Post
A dying relationship.
But havenít NZ and Aus always been pretty distant? Thereís nowhere near the level of tension there was in the 1980s or early 2000s...
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Old 08-15-2018, 04:35 PM
 
Location: Top of the South, NZ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bakery Hill View Post
But havenít NZ and Aus always been pretty distant? Thereís nowhere near the level of tension there was in the 1980s or early 2000s...
I don't think they have always been distant, and I didn''t get a sense of tension in the 1980s.

It's a one sided issue imo - NZ laws see Australians as defacto citizens, while Australian law doesn't do the same for NZers.
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Old 08-15-2018, 08:00 PM
 
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Probably what is being referred to is NZ's independent foreign policy. They had a tiff with the Americans over the berthing of nuclear armed American warships in NZ ports. It saw the ANZUS Treaty in threat of survival but sure took NZ on another course of its own making if one more to the Left.
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Old 08-19-2018, 02:06 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90 View Post
I don't think they have always been distant, and I didn''t get a sense of tension in the 1980s.

It's a one sided issue imo - NZ laws see Australians as defacto citizens, while Australian law doesn't do the same for NZers.
The thing is that this isn't an issue in Australia. When you consider that ~0.25% of Australians live in NZ whereas 15% of Kiwis live in Australia it's not hard to see why it's a one sided issue. It just doesn't appear on the radar. Ever.
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Old 08-19-2018, 06:13 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BCC_1 View Post
The thing is that this isn't an issue in Australia. When you consider that ~0.25% of Australians live in NZ whereas 15% of Kiwis live in Australia it's not hard to see why it's a one sided issue. It just doesn't appear on the radar. Ever.
Meaning? Australia poaches NZ talent in droves. It gains the benefit from NZ graduates that in other circumstances, would be contributing to the NZ economy. one can see why it may well be an issue in New Zealand.
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Old 08-19-2018, 12:41 PM
 
Location: Top of the South, NZ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BCC_1 View Post
The thing is that this isn't an issue in Australia. When you consider that ~0.25% of Australians live in NZ whereas 15% of Kiwis live in Australia it's not hard to see why it's a one sided issue. It just doesn't appear on the radar. Ever.
It's not an issue in Australia, because it only involves politicians , not the piblic.

When the government here talked about reciprocal loss of rights for Australians living in NZ, informal polling showed that it had little support.

It's a dying relationship, and I'm starting to think it would be one better done away with.
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Old 08-19-2018, 07:16 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the troubadour View Post
Meaning? Australia poaches NZ talent in droves. It gains the benefit from NZ graduates that in other circumstances, would be contributing to the NZ economy. one can see why it may well be an issue in New Zealand.
Well, it isn't like those New Zealanders are being press ganged into service. Having the opportunity to live and work in a larger country which offers more opportunity and, quite likely, higher wages, they leave of their own accord. How I wish that Canadians could enjoy similar rights in the United States! (The Irish also profit similarly from having access to the UK.)
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Old 08-20-2018, 04:36 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maclock View Post
Well, it isn't like those New Zealanders are being press ganged into service. Having the opportunity to live and work in a larger country which offers more opportunity and, quite likely, higher wages, they leave of their own accord. How I wish that Canadians could enjoy similar rights in the United States! (The Irish also profit similarly from having access to the UK.)
I didn't insinuate that they were press ganged. I suggested the cost of losing so much talent, to the tax payer, economy in general for the gain of more powerful neighbour.
As such a little more generosity could be shown, as once was the case by Australia. Ireland tends to send not such a big per cent of their educated, I would hazard to guess. Over the decades working class Irish galore, have washed up on especially English shores, to work in construction, road work, factories with not a few ending up on hard times on the UK dole. Kilburn, an area of London, was once full of such Irish and their pubs. A bit of difference from what is being discussed here.
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Old 08-20-2018, 11:45 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the troubadour View Post
I didn't insinuate that they were press ganged. I suggested the cost of losing so much talent, to the tax payer, economy in general for the gain of more powerful neighbour.
As such a little more generosity could be shown, as once was the case by Australia. Ireland tends to send not such a big per cent of their educated, I would hazard to guess. Over the decades working class Irish galore, have washed up on especially English shores, to work in construction, road work, factories with not a few ending up on hard times on the UK dole. Kilburn, an area of London, was once full of such Irish and their pubs. A bit of difference from what is being discussed here.
Man, the City of London (i.e., the financial services sector), countless English companies (and foreign companies with British offices), the NHS, educational institutions, etc., all profit in a major way from high-skilled Irish talent. I'm not bemoaning it, mind. We're a rather long way from the days of Irish navvies and Irish brickies filling up slums and poorer areas in Britain.

Anyway, I don't follow. Kiwis can still work in Australia and it's to their great benefit.
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