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Old 10-08-2012, 05:36 PM
PDD PDD started this thread
 
Location: The Sand Hills of NC
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Just for you newbies, this is how the real men raced Talledega, you know without restrictor plates, without the lucky dog, without the wave around.


1985 Winston 500 NASCAR Bill Elliott - YouTube
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Old 10-08-2012, 07:09 PM
 
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Then one of those "real men" knocked the fence down a Talladega causing NASCAR to reimplement restrictor plates.

A couple of years later one of the crew of the driver who won that race was killed during a pit stop under caution because back then there was no speed limit on pit road because they were "real men."

A few years after that one of NASCAR's future champions spun and blocked the front stretch, was nearly t-boned because they were allowed to race back to the caution. During that same year(?) a rescue worker was run over while tending to a car that had wrecked because they were racing back to the caution.

My definition of a real man doesn't involve being real dumb. Those guys had no idea of the game changing consequences lurking in their future. I would bet if you could turn back time for those "real men" and give them the option of their safety equipment/rules and today's safety equipment/rules they would choose today's because of what they learned and witnessed.

In the grand scheme restrictor plates suck, but having fans/drivers killed by flying cars sucks worse and turning these elephants loose with 800hp is not the answer.
BTW, that race was just as big a yawner as any plate race today. As the last lap demonstrated it was a race for 2nd.
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Old 10-09-2012, 07:25 AM
PDD PDD started this thread
 
Location: The Sand Hills of NC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WFW&P View Post
Then one of those "real men" knocked the fence down a Talladega causing NASCAR to reimplement restrictor plates.

A couple of years later one of the crew of the driver who won that race was killed during a pit stop under caution because back then there was no speed limit on pit road because they were "real men."

A few years after that one of NASCAR's future champions spun and blocked the front stretch, was nearly t-boned because they were allowed to race back to the caution. During that same year(?) a rescue worker was run over while tending to a car that had wrecked because they were racing back to the caution.

My definition of a real man doesn't involve being real dumb. Those guys had no idea of the game changing consequences lurking in their future. I would bet if you could turn back time for those "real men" and give them the option of their safety equipment/rules and today's safety equipment/rules they would choose today's because of what they learned and witnessed.

In the grand scheme restrictor plates suck, but having fans/drivers killed by flying cars sucks worse and turning these elephants loose with 800hp is not the answer.
BTW, that race was just as big a yawner as any plate race today. As the last lap demonstrated it was a race for 2nd.
Perhaps you forgot Edwards tearing down the fence at Talledega a couple years ago in his restrictor plate Ford.

Again somebody with no clue why restrictor plate racing was initiated.

I'll give you one. Two laps made up under green. Some experts say was the greatest one race achievement by a driver in NASCAR history.
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Old 10-09-2012, 09:03 AM
 
6,368 posts, read 13,924,639 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PDD View Post
Perhaps you forgot Edwards tearing down the fence at Talledega a couple years ago in his restrictor plate Ford.

Again somebody with no clue why restrictor plate racing was initiated.

I'll give you one. Two laps made up under green. Some experts say was the greatest one race achievement by a driver in NASCAR history.
I remember that race.

Some experts also say that thunderbird was built 7/8th's scale too.
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Old 10-09-2012, 09:15 AM
 
Location: NY
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Restrictor plates do stink. To the point of ruining the race IMO. Sure, I bet there are some TV ratings when you have a 30 car pileup on the last lap Sunday. However, honestly, I am not sure that is really what Nascar needs to help it. Otherwise, they should put a plate on every race.

Not that we need the unsafe speeds of yore either. I just wish there was a better way to maintain reasonably safe speeds, and turn the race back into "racing" instead of 498 miles of waiting for a 2 mile, 43 car shootout that ends in carnage.

Eventually this style of restrictor racing is going to kill someone too.
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Old 10-09-2012, 01:52 PM
 
Location: Aurora, CO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PDD View Post
Perhaps you forgot Edwards tearing down the fence at Talledega a couple years ago in his restrictor plate Ford.

Again somebody with no clue why restrictor plate racing was initiated.

I'll give you one. Two laps made up under green. Some experts say was the greatest one race achievement by a driver in NASCAR history.
If that were truly the case, NASCAR would've slapped the plates on in '86. 2-3 feet is all that separated Bobby Allison's car from taking out either Harold Kinder or people in the lower level of the stands. If his left-front had hit the fence instead of the wall the car would've traveled further into the spectator area.

You and I both know the difference between Daytona/Talladega and Texas/Charlotte/Atlanta/Michigan is average speed. You can run Daytona and Talladega wide open all the way around, and before the plates they may have feathered the throttle in the turns but the brakes were only used for pit stops. You try to run wide open all the way around at Charlotte and you'll crash.

I personally like your gear suggestion. Give the drivers the ability to run the engine at ultra high rpms if they so choose, but they're playing with fire.

As a side note, I personally don't think the Elliotts have ever gotten the recognition they deserve. Bill's a helluva driver, but I don't think he would've been nearly as successful as he was without Ernie and Dan. At the early part of Bill's career, the three of them did amazing things with next-to-nothing.
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Old 10-09-2012, 03:41 PM
PDD PDD started this thread
 
Location: The Sand Hills of NC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluescreen73 View Post

As a side note, I personally don't think the Elliotts have ever gotten the recognition they deserve. Bill's a helluva driver, but I don't think he would've been nearly as successful as he was without Ernie and Dan. At the early part of Bill's career, the three of them did amazing things with next-to-nothing.
Thank you, glad somebody else appreciates what the Elliott family did back in the day.

Ford dealer has his son build a T-Bird, other son builds the engine and the other son does the driving.
Thanks to Harry Melling for a little cash and that team set NASCAR on it's ear.

Every time NASCAR tried to slow the car down by changing the rules they went even faster.
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Old 10-09-2012, 04:03 PM
 
12,577 posts, read 13,314,882 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PDD View Post
Perhaps you forgot Edwards tearing down the fence at Talledega a couple years ago in his restrictor plate Ford.

Again somebody with no clue why restrictor plate racing was initiated.

I'll give you one. Two laps made up under green. Some experts say was the greatest one race achievement by a driver in NASCAR history.
So you think it is some conspiracy the plates were put on to prevent someone from making up a lap under green? I'm thinking you're the one without a clue. Making up laps under green (racing back to the caution not withstanding) by pure driving was infrequent long before the lucky dog was implemented.
What was the reason for going to small block V8s?
The problem (one of many) lies within lack of downforce and if you apply too much at those speeds on that type of track the car will want to chase every groove in the track.
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Old 10-09-2012, 04:37 PM
 
12,577 posts, read 13,314,882 times
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1990 Atlanta Journal 500 - Fatal Pit Road Accident - YouTube

It was the ARCA race I mentioned earlier but the point remains the same.

Mike Staley paramedic accident - YouTube
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Old 10-09-2012, 09:41 PM
 
32,479 posts, read 26,356,312 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PDD View Post
Perhaps you forgot Edwards tearing down the fence at Talledega a couple years ago in his restrictor plate Ford.

Again somebody with no clue why restrictor plate racing was initiated.

I'll give you one. Two laps made up under green. Some experts say was the greatest one race achievement by a driver in NASCAR history.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gimme3steps View Post
I remember that race.

Some experts also say that thunderbird was built 7/8th's scale too.
in fact it was built as a 15/16ths scale. someone actually went back a few years later and measured the car and compared it to a factory car.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PDD View Post
Thank you, glad somebody else appreciates what the Elliott family did back in the day.

Ford dealer has his son build a T-Bird, other son builds the engine and the other son does the driving.
Thanks to Harry Melling for a little cash and that team set NASCAR on it's ear.

Every time NASCAR tried to slow the car down by changing the rules they went even faster.
i became a bill elliot fan the day he started running in winston cup. he was one of the very few ford drivers at the time.
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