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Old 10-07-2016, 10:02 AM
 
164 posts, read 234,503 times
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My fix for the cup series , Run a typical sat. night race event(exception would be
Talladega & Daytona,road courses) run heat races 10-20 laps with the feature being
no more than 150 laps. Fan vote on inverting the start of feature. winner from last weeks race automatically starts in rear of next feature race. put a claim on top 3 cars in feature race, only
6th place and back can claim top 3. No testing at tracks. no back up cars allowed. run more dirt tracks,some tracks just need to be retired.caution laps do not count. Of course there would have to be more, but you can get my ideal. It puts very heavy consequences on making any mistakes. and
helps the talented drivers not just the rich.
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Old 10-07-2016, 12:38 PM
 
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NASCAR's largest detractor is Brian France and his rule changing.
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Old 10-07-2016, 01:27 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the searchers View Post
NASCAR's largest detractor is Brian France and his rule changing.
Bill France was an avid rule changer too.
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Old 10-07-2016, 01:48 PM
 
9,426 posts, read 7,105,331 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WFW&P View Post
Bill France was an avid rule changer too.
Bill changed the cars. "Ford is at a disadvantage so they get a bigger spoiler.." "Pontiac needs more front downforce so give them a lower front air dam.." That kind of thing.

He didn't change the BASE rules very much at all. I think he implemented the points system that was in use his entire term.. Only real tweak to it was making sure the winner of the race got the most points.

He turned things over to Helton well before he died. So.. Helton and Brian France are really, IMO, the two to blame.
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Old 10-07-2016, 01:52 PM
 
Location: CT
3,461 posts, read 1,858,541 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Labonte18 View Post
Neither of them particularly had teammates. So, it's tough to say what they would or wouldn't have done. Yes, Petty had a team car here and there, but not all the time and I don't believe ever a team car running for the championship. So, in his case, the team car was there specifically to push HIM to the win.

Earnhardt wouldn't have pushed a teammate to the win or blocked for them.. Of course, what exactly was he doing on his last lap?


He was doing what gave the sport it's thrill, he was pushing his car for just one more place, taking a chance and he lost. If we had the safer barrier and hans device, he'd be alive and well today, so at least his legacy was to make the sport safer for drivers. Safety and passion for racing is two different things, it just seems the sport has lost a lot of it's spirit. IDK- maybe I'm just getting older.
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Old 10-07-2016, 10:34 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snowtired14 View Post
[/b]

If we had the safer barrier and hans device, he'd be alive and well today, so at least his legacy was to make the sport safer for drivers. Safety and passion for racing is two different things, it just seems the sport has lost a lot of it's spirit. IDK- maybe I'm just getting older.
The Hans Device was in use by some drivers back then but Dale Earnhardt did not use it. After he died it shortly became mandatory, I think.
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Old 10-08-2016, 12:34 AM
 
9,426 posts, read 7,105,331 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snowtired14 View Post
[/b]

He was doing what gave the sport it's thrill, he was pushing his car for just one more place, taking a chance and he lost. If we had the safer barrier and hans device, he'd be alive and well today, so at least his legacy was to make the sport safer for drivers. Safety and passion for racing is two different things, it just seems the sport has lost a lot of it's spirit. IDK- maybe I'm just getting older.
He was blocking for his cars. It was patently obvious. Sure, he was also trying to keep 3rd, because it's Daytona.. Plate racing.. Anything can happen.. But he was driving out the rear view more than the windshield. His car wasn't as good as those two, or as good as the people behind him. He also wasn't trying to organize the people back where he was to make a run on the top 2. That last part there is the key.

It's debatable, and unknowable whether he'd be alive today. He most likely would have survived that accident, but he didn't have a particularly good family history with long life. And demonstrated heart issues at Darlington back in.. '97 or so.

but, without his death.. We wouldn't have the SAFER barriers, the mandated HANS device, safer cars, etc. Earnhardt was actively AGAINST the HANS device and NASCAR would have kowtowed to him. Nadeau would be dead.. Gordon would likely have been killed as he had several bad accidents where he MISSED the SAFER barriers. Michael McDowell I think certainly would have been killed in that qualifying accident at Texas. of course, some of those may have elected to use a HANS even if it wasn't mandatory. Even Mark Martin was against the HANS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by the searchers View Post
The Hans Device was in use by some drivers back then but Dale Earnhardt did not use it. After he died it shortly became mandatory, I think.
It was the fall Charlotte race in '01 where NASCAR mandated a head and neck system be used. Stewart and someone else were the last holdouts.. Might have been Dave Marcis. As I recall, there was a choice between the HANS and Hutchens device and seemingly a Simpson device, but noone used that. The Hutchens device (Named after the engineer with RCR that invented it) was later decertified for NASCAR competition, leaving only the HANS. The reason was the death of Blaise Alexander in ARCA. They had required a restraint, but the "Horse Collar" was acceptable there which, obviously didn't save him.

The HANS had been mandated by IRL and most open wheel series for a number of years.

If I'm not mistaken, the full-face helmet was mandated immediately after Earnhardt's accident, because of the theory going around that his chin hit the steering wheel. The only person I can remember that affecting was Marcis.. And perhaps Jimmy Spencer. I'm pretty certain there were 2 other people who still wore open face helmets.. I know one was Marcis, but can't remember the other for sure. Dick Trickle, possibly.. Had a damn cigarette lighter in the car.

You talk about the changes.. There's a guy I miss. Dave Marcis. He's the epitome of what NASCAR was about. He never ran great (later in his career), but he was out there each and every week. Kenny Schrader, too.
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Old 10-08-2016, 11:52 AM
 
2,837 posts, read 1,928,149 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Labonte18 View Post
He was blocking for his cars. It was patently obvious. Sure, he was also trying to keep 3rd, because it's Daytona.. Plate racing.. Anything can happen.. But he was driving out the rear view more than the windshield. His car wasn't as good as those two, or as good as the people behind him. He also wasn't trying to organize the people back where he was to make a run on the top 2. That last part there is the key.

It's debatable, and unknowable whether he'd be alive today. He most likely would have survived that accident, but he didn't have a particularly good family history with long life. And demonstrated heart issues at Darlington back in.. '97 or so.

but, without his death.. We wouldn't have the SAFER barriers, the mandated HANS device, safer cars, etc. Earnhardt was actively AGAINST the HANS device and NASCAR would have kowtowed to him. Nadeau would be dead.. Gordon would likely have been killed as he had several bad accidents where he MISSED the SAFER barriers. Michael McDowell I think certainly would have been killed in that qualifying accident at Texas. of course, some of those may have elected to use a HANS even if it wasn't mandatory. Even Mark Martin was against the HANS.



It was the fall Charlotte race in '01 where NASCAR mandated a head and neck system be used. Stewart and someone else were the last holdouts.. Might have been Dave Marcis. As I recall, there was a choice between the HANS and Hutchens device and seemingly a Simpson device, but noone used that. The Hutchens device (Named after the engineer with RCR that invented it) was later decertified for NASCAR competition, leaving only the HANS. The reason was the death of Blaise Alexander in ARCA. They had required a restraint, but the "Horse Collar" was acceptable there which, obviously didn't save him.

The HANS had been mandated by IRL and most open wheel series for a number of years.

If I'm not mistaken, the full-face helmet was mandated immediately after Earnhardt's accident, because of the theory going around that his chin hit the steering wheel. The only person I can remember that affecting was Marcis.. And perhaps Jimmy Spencer. I'm pretty certain there were 2 other people who still wore open face helmets.. I know one was Marcis, but can't remember the other for sure. Dick Trickle, possibly.. Had a damn cigarette lighter in the car.

You talk about the changes.. There's a guy I miss. Dave Marcis. He's the epitome of what NASCAR was about. He never ran great (later in his career), but he was out there each and every week. Kenny Schrader, too.

Thanks for this posting. I remembered Earnhardt fighting the Hans but forgot about the full face mask being something he avoided. Enjoyed reading your facts. Schrader was the last of the 'seat of the pants' drivers to be in CUP racing.
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Old 10-09-2016, 08:26 AM
 
Location: Island of Misfit Toys
5,066 posts, read 2,187,860 times
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Wasn't Jr still using the open face helmet at short tracks? Those were the last 2 hold outs as I remember. Back in his frosted tips days. haha
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Old 10-10-2016, 05:05 PM
 
9,426 posts, read 7,105,331 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JonasW View Post
Wasn't Jr still using the open face helmet at short tracks? Those were the last 2 hold outs as I remember. Back in his frosted tips days. haha
He did in the Busch series days.. But I thought he switched over when he went to Cup.. Of course.. That's really only a year that he was in Cup before the closed helmet was required.

You are correct, though.. While I can't confirm the timing, I've also seen him wearing an open face helmet in the past.
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