U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Automotive
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 09-05-2010, 10:17 AM
 
6,368 posts, read 13,342,993 times
Reputation: 5858

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by wilson1010 View Post
I didn't miss your point, I was being polite by not mocking it. You have zero support for the position that a sidewall nail hole repair is any riskier than any other tire repair, other then "common sense." That is my entire point and 10 posts later, you have not cited any science on the subject other than your common sense view that a sidewall is made differently than a tread. It could be that the steel belts in the tread area are more likely to fail from a nail hole than the sidewall. You have no idea, do you, really?
^^
That applies to you also.

The sidewall flexes too much to make a safe repair. There, that covers the common sense aspect.

You really have no argument.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 09-05-2010, 10:21 AM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
4,464 posts, read 9,630,498 times
Reputation: 2819
Quote:
Originally Posted by wilson1010 View Post
I didn't miss your point, I was being polite by not mocking it. You have zero support for the position that a sidewall nail hole repair is any riskier than any other tire repair, other then "common sense." That is my entire point and 10 posts later, you have not cited any science on the subject other than your common sense view that a sidewall is made differently than a tread. It could be that the steel belts in the tread area are more likely to fail from a nail hole than the sidewall. You have no idea, do you, really?
There's nothing to mock.

And there's plenty of damage types they don't fix (or shouldn't fix) on the thread part of the tire too, but if you've looked at all at the build up of a tire (which I doubt you have, looking at your posts) you'll see that the thread part of the tire has several times the reinforcement of the sidewall, which is a reason it'll do better with repairs.

...And I don't know how I've managed to make 10 posts, seeing as this is my 6th in this thread.

EDIT: this should inform you, in the teaspoon sized portions you need.

Quote:
Belts are calendered sheets consisting of a layer of rubber, a layer of closely-spaced steel cords, and a second layer of rubber. The steel cords are oriented radially in radial tire construction, and at opposing angles in bias tire construction. Belts give the tire strength and dent resistance while allowing it to remain flexible. Passenger tires are usually made with two or three belts.

The tread is a thick extruded profile that surrounds the tire carcass. Tread compounds include additives to impart wear resistance and traction in addition to environmental resistance. Tread compound development is an exercise in compromise, as hard compounds have long wear characteristics but poor traction whereas soft compounds have good traction but poor wear characteristics.
Quote:
Sidewalls are non-reinforced extruded profiles with additives to give the sides of the tire good abrasion resistance and environmental resistance. Additives used in sidewall compounds include antioxidants and antiozonants. Sidewall extrusions are nonsymmetrical and provide a thick rubber area to enable molding of raised letters and sidewall ornamentation.
Oh and just so you won't misunderstand, the belt is the reinforcement in the contact part of the tire, that gives it the added strength.

Since I feel generous today, here's a picture too:

Last edited by TheViking85; 09-05-2010 at 10:36 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-05-2010, 10:36 AM
 
Location: Kalamalka Lake, B.C.
2,963 posts, read 3,759,379 times
Reputation: 3768
Ozone in the air down south, not to mention pollution, pretty much does it to rubber within a few years. Particularly if you park outside radial tires are pretty much toast. And when they blow they blow, particularly at higher speeds.
Here in the Northwest I've had good trucks tires (series E load range) last for twenty years. Not in L.A. or Phoenix. And car tires aren't 200. a pop like up here.
Shops at half the price? All right, but you "vote with your dollar" and if you want to give your money to the underground economy then that just means you'll be paying that much more in taxes.
Why skimp on brakes and tires? They're the cheapest part of the car and the items that will save you and your family.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-05-2010, 10:45 AM
 
Location: So. of Rosarito, Baja, Mexico
6,571 posts, read 17,944,907 times
Reputation: 5919
As a former mechanic have seen some duzzy tires come into my shop when doing brake work. I would politely tell the owners of a need to replace a specific tire and of course received a nod of the head and a strange look on their faces. Some listened and some did not.

I once spotted a nail and pulled it out causing the tire to go flat and thus cost me the price of a flat repair out of my own pocket. After that I would mark the sidewall with a white piece of chalk to show the location and informed the owner accordingly.

As to repairing a sidewall by a tire shop...they are in the business and are more knowledged then the consumer/customer. A two ply sidewall that flexes constantly is nothing to mess with when considering a repair...when in doubt...throw it out.

I knew of two places...New car dealer and a machine shop that turned a rotor/brake drum past the legal limits and the cars were involved in an accident. CHP in Calif investigated both cases.

Tire shop or Auto repair makes NO difference when liability is involved.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-05-2010, 11:45 AM
 
10,139 posts, read 22,404,584 times
Reputation: 8239
Did someone post a case of a sidewall repair.where there was liability? I must have missed it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-05-2010, 12:31 PM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
4,464 posts, read 9,630,498 times
Reputation: 2819
Quote:
Originally Posted by wilson1010 View Post
Did someone post a case of a sidewall repair.where there was liability? I must have missed it.
No, but someone posted ample information to help you understand why fixing a sidewall isn't as easy as fixing the contact surface.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-05-2010, 01:06 PM
 
Location: Pomona
1,955 posts, read 9,197,283 times
Reputation: 1531
Quote:
Originally Posted by wilson1010 View Post
You were called on it and haven't produced squat except a spelling correction.
... and yet, all along, you haven't provided any evidence that such a repair is safe. So while I haven't produced "squat", that's still more than what you've produced out of your opinion.

Opinion | Define Opinion at Dictionary.com

Quote:
You have nothing. So take your theory back to your tire store or wherever you heard it.
Back at ya.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheViking85 View Post
Isn't it common sense?

There's a lot of strain on the tire side wall and it's not nearly as reinforced as the driving surface is.
"Rate this post positively" clicked on for the truth. Sadly, common sense isn't so common these days.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wilson1010 View Post
Tires do not fail because of holes in the sidewalls. Think of polymer tire cording as more like a blanket than a balloon. You stick a pin in a blanket. Does it hurt the fabric? Of course not.


If you sever a thread, the fabric is damaged. Not to mention you FAIL to realize that a blanket doesn't need to hold air ... or support thousands of pounds of weight ... or sustain being thrown around and around in a circular motion hundreds of times a minute for hours on end. And last I check, death wasn't an issue if your blanket has a hole in it.

If you don't believe me, get a piece of fabric, poke a hole in it, and stretch it. Guess what - the hole is the weak part now. Stretch it farther, and that hole turns into a tear.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wilson1010 View Post
There is no risk other than not selling you a new tire. there has never been a successful claim against a tire store for a sidewall repair failure, and they have insurance.
Insurance is not there to cover the STUPIDITY of doing an ill advised repair in the first place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wilson1010 View Post
Did someone post a case of a sidewall repair.where there was liability? I must have missed it.
I must have missed the part where you've proven a sidewall repair is safe ...

You're arguing against several of us now, and have yet to provide any evidence of how such a repair can be properly made. SHOW US THE PROOF! ANY PROOF that a passenger car radial tire can be properly repaired with damage on the sidewall. We're waiting ...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-05-2010, 01:09 PM
 
6,368 posts, read 13,342,993 times
Reputation: 5858
Quote:
Originally Posted by AntonL View Post
Tire store people are crooks. And, the goofballs they have servicing the most important safety item on the car, the tires, is a disgrace.
What tire store did you get fired from?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-05-2010, 01:16 PM
 
10,139 posts, read 22,404,584 times
Reputation: 8239
I'm still waiting If you picked some nutcake idea like the steering wheel getting stuck or the gas pedal on the floor or the wheels falling off, you could cite me a dozen cases where someone got sued or someone had a wreck. But this interesting theory about a sidewall blowout from a repair just seems to elude you. I wonder why that is? Oh, I have an idea. Maybe its because it doesn't happen.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-05-2010, 01:23 PM
 
8,780 posts, read 16,240,408 times
Reputation: 5219
Quote:
Originally Posted by narfcake View Post
you're arguing against several of us now, and have yet to provide any evidence of how such a repair can be properly made. Show us the proof! Any proof that a passenger car radial tire can be properly repaired with damage on the sidewall. We're waiting ...

+3.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Automotive
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top