1960 to early 1980's Large American Cars(Non-Customized) cars Thread (CV, seats, BMW)

[Vinsanity]

Originally Posted by Fleet

I mentioned that a '95 Town Car could do 0.79 g on the skid pad. Compare with these 1996 and 1997 cars (from Motor Trend, Dec., 1997):

Lateral Acceleration, g:

'96 Chevrolet Cavalier------------- .79
'97 Ford Escort LX---------------- .70
'97 Honda Civic EX Coupe---------- .75
'96 Honda Accord LX-------------- .79
'98 Honda Accord LX-------------- .77
'96 Volkswagen GTI VR6----------- .80
'96 Audi A4----------------------- .77
'97 Lexus ES 300------------------ .79
'97 Audi A8 Quattro--------------- .79

Those are just simple roadholding figures; they only indicate the approximate point of steady-state cornering at which the tires begin to lose grip. They indicate extremely little regarding how nimble a car is, how well it transitions between turns, the quality of feedback from the chassis, the precision of the steering, the tuning of the suspension, and I think you get my point.

[harald]

not to be a prick here, but do detroit only make lincolns and cadilacs ? he.he.ve have alot of those over her,but not as much of the other fullsisers as pontiac bonneville from early 60 ies,and that sort of cars

[CrownVic95]

Originally Posted by Vinsanity

Those are just simple roadholding figures; they only indicate the approximate point of steady-state cornering at which the tires begin to lose grip. They indicate extremely little regarding how nimble a car is, how well it transitions between turns, the quality of feedback from the chassis, the precision of the steering, the tuning of the suspension, and I think you get my point.

I get your point. You don't understand or appreciate the qualities of the great American cars referenced in the thread title. So you're here to bash and belittle them and argue with those of us who understand that the Crown Vic needed the Taurus's "innovations" like you need a bed bug infestation.

[Blackandgold51]

Originally Posted by Vinsanity

well the Crown Vic and Town Car sure ride and drive like land barges.

it's also a little bit ingenuous to compare an SUV to a passenger car, no? In any case, the Panther cars are big compared to other passenger cars. (unless you want to keep being ingenuous and bring a Rolls Phantom into the argument)

The Crown Victoria drives like a land barge?

Really?

If that's the case then why do police angencies across America like them so much? Matter of fact I have a few buddie Police officers, a couple for the NOPD(New Orleans Police Department) and the Arlington, Virgina Police and they tell me that they prefer the Crown Vic over the Impala and Dodge Charger, especially since they have a more space room than those cars for a job that is almost everyday.

Also, if the Crown Vic handles "like a land barge" then you've failed to mention about the Mercury Marauder;



This car has the Mustang Cobra R Engine and can perform just as much as Mustang.

The Crown Vic, Lincoln Town Car, and Grand Marquis use the same Modular V8 engine that used in the Mustang GT.

[Fleet]

Originally Posted by Vinsanity

Those are just simple roadholding figures; they only indicate the approximate point of steady-state cornering at which the tires begin to lose grip. They indicate extremely little regarding how nimble a car is, how well it transitions between turns, the quality of feedback from the chassis, the precision of the steering, the tuning of the suspension, and I think you get my point.

Sure, and if the Town Car's figures was something like 0.65 g, you would say, "See they can't handle!" It's happened on other forums I visit... members would praise a car's g reading and when I use the same figure for an American car, they say, "those are just simple roadholding figures!"
Those figures would mean something or they would not run the test!

Look at this 1998 Town Car (RWD) compares to a 1998 Cadillac DeVille Concours...

---------------------- '98 Town Car------ '98 DeVille

Lateral acceleration--- 0.79 g------------- 0.73 g
Speed though 600-ft
slalom--------------- 59.3 mph----------- 59.3 mph

And from the text:
'Decent handling to boot'
"So how do these barges really handle? The short answer, pretty well for their size. In fact, our test numbers would seem to indicate virtually no difference between a large, American rear driver with body-on-frame design and a large, American front-driver on a unibody platform. Both of these cars are nicely balanced. And given enough room, they can be driven quite aggressively with good results and reasonable precision." (Kind of the opposite of what you claimed.)

Also, the 59.3 mph in the slalom (again) is very close to or equals many smaller cars.

[Fleet]

Excellent point, Blackandgold51. I have seen many police chases and those Crown Vics are put through plenty of emergency maneuvers and corning. They do quite well for a 17-foot long, 2-ton car.

When I put my Town Car through a corner or curve, it almost feels light (probably because I own two Cadillacs which weigh much more and are 1 to 3 feet longer).

[Blackandgold51]

Originally Posted by Vinsanity

well the Crown Vic and Town Car sure ride and drive like land barges.

it's also a little bit ingenuous to compare an SUV to a passenger car, no? In any case, the Panther cars are big compared to other passenger cars. (unless you want to keep being ingenuous and bring a Rolls Phantom into the argument)

Videos of the the performance of the Mercury Marauder, since you said Crown Vics handles land barge;
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...Marauder-1.jpg


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2OhI...5A9D6F&index=7


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nc3S6...eature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9C7Ci...eature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PMtU6feomQ

And here's the Crown Vic;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bskjs...eature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1aQ7...eature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YsPnE...eature=related

P71 Police Interceptor;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2r60...eature=related

[Blackandgold51]

Originally Posted by Fleet

Excellent point, Blackandgold51. I have seen many police chases and those Crown Vics are put through plenty of emergency maneuvers and corning. They do quite well for a 17-foot long, 2-ton car.

When I put my Town Car through a corner or curve, it almost feels light (probably because I own two Cadillacs which weigh much more and are 1 to 3 feet longer).

Matter of fact, check out this video performance of the 95' TC(including my videos above in my last post);


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Li0viXg3EB4


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RdJ0...eature=related

[Fleet]

Thanks for posting those videos, Blackandgold51. I was trying to find some like those. Some people would be surprised just how hard those "barges" can (safely) be driven!

[73-79 ford fan]

I owned one of those Marauders for a short time.