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Old 03-28-2011, 07:27 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
5,996 posts, read 13,293,567 times
Reputation: 4005

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
Of course the cars are safe, when new. But the median age of cars on the US roads is 8 years. And the drivers may not be safe at 85. A car going 90 travels 50% further in the same reaction time than one going 60. Freeway drivers are tired, bored, distracted, and often those driving the fastest are the ones with limited driving experience and maturity.

Motor vehicle safety inspections are several times more rigorous in Europe, where high speeds are tolerated. American cars capable of those speeds often have badly worn or improperly inflated tires, misaligned front ends, dubious brakes. I don't feel comfortable on a highway where some cars are going 15-20 mph faster than others, necessitating frequent lane changes.

I-95 at Ridgeland is only two lanes each way, which means there is no 3rd lane for high speeds, and no escape lane if a driver changes lanes unexpectedly. If you're going 85, and somebody going 75 pulls out to pass someone going 70, where do you go? Most likely you'll hit the brakes, and then you've stirred in the ingredient for angst or impatience, if not road rage. With trucks in the right lane and cruising cars at 75 in the left, exactly where do you think you can maintain your thrills at 85?
I'm not sure what thrills have anything to do with driving 5mph faster than the typical flow of traffic in my area (traffic conditions permitting). Not much thrill to be found in getting to work a little early.
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Old 03-28-2011, 10:47 PM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,668 posts, read 71,574,557 times
Reputation: 35864
Quote:
Originally Posted by iTsLiKeAnEgG View Post
I'm not sure what thrills have anything to do with driving 5mph faster than the typical flow of traffic in my area (traffic conditions permitting). Not much thrill to be found in getting to work a little early.
Fast drivers, for the most part, drive fast because they like the rush of driving fast. Some can't tolerate the humiliation of thinking someone else is faster than they are. Many just want other to see how fast they can, or dare to go, and imagine others being awed by their car or their driving skill or their smug daring. Some enjoy winning a race against people who don't even know they are racing. A few are more important than other people. Quite a few more just think they are.

Having said all that, I have doubts about the morality and the constitutionality of the devices. The speedy trial provision of the constitution give a person a right to know that he is charged with a crime without several weeks of administrative BS impeding the process. Due process is denied if a delay of weeks impedes the freshness of opportunity to assemble witnesses and prepare a defense. Justice is not served if a suspect is allowed to travel thousands of miles and then be told he must return to defend himself at expense far in excess of the penalty. The Sixth Amendment right to be confronted with the witnesses against you is a sham when the witness is a machine that cannot be cross examined. Summary judgment follows, if the defendant cannot be found to be lawfully served with a warrant.

And most important of all, a finding that all of the above is constitutional, the citizenry will become ripe for the plucking by unimaginably venal machines of a future that is awesome to behold.

Let's visualize what could happen. The police develop a machine that can detect the tire pressure of every car that passes. They then decide that a car with improperly inflated tires is being driven "recklessly, in unsafe condition". On a section of commuter freeway, 100,000 cars pass every day, and virtually all of them are out of some arbitrary tolerance. Every driver is fined $10 for each infraction, which is a million dollars a day. This continues for two months, surreptitiously, and the drivers are then sent summonses. $50 million in fines, assessed when they renew their license, if not pleaded to in response to a summons. Drivers can defend themselves only by appearing in traffic court (on a work day) and proving that on every single one of those days, their tires were within the unspecified inflation tolerances, as deemed at the discretion of an highway patrol officer (a power they already have, and apply widely if they think they might find drugs in the car). Traffic court requires only "preponderance of evidence" for a finding of "responsibility" for an infraction.

Last edited by jtur88; 03-28-2011 at 11:19 PM..
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Old 03-28-2011, 10:48 PM
 
Location: Out in the Badlands
10,395 posts, read 8,349,307 times
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Folks in the UK/Europe have the answer to these money raising/taxing cameras. see: Speed Cameras (http://www.speedcam.co.uk/gatso2a.htm - broken link)
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Old 03-29-2011, 07:25 AM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,668 posts, read 71,574,557 times
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You guys don't know how technologically close you are to having a GPS factory-installed in your car, that can be used to log every single moving violation over the course of a year. When you go in for license renewal, your log is read, and you are assessed a fine for each infraction, that has to be paid before you get your new sticker. And if your accumulated fine total reaches a certain point, your car simply shuts down until it is paid.
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Old 03-29-2011, 07:28 AM
 
Location: Northern MN
3,869 posts, read 12,509,221 times
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They were found to be unconstitutional in MN.
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Old 03-29-2011, 09:12 AM
 
Location: Pikesville, MD
5,229 posts, read 11,490,489 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
Of course the cars are safe, when new. But the median age of cars on the US roads is 8 years. And the drivers may not be safe at 85. A car going 90 travels 50% further in the same reaction time than one going 60. Freeway drivers are tired, bored, distracted, and often those driving the fastest are the ones with limited driving experience and maturity.
My car is 12 years old and is safe at 80-90+ mph. Of course, it was bred on the autobahn for sustained speeds above 150.

And the fact is, most accidents happen at relatively low speeds, pretty close to home. High speed interstate accidents are actually fairly rare, even though high speeds ON interstates are not rare.

Quote:
you think you can maintain your thrills at 85?
THis is a misnomer brought on by introverted peopel that think ANYTHING outside theri own comfort zone is about thriollseeking. Little clue, in relatively modern cars, or older cars like mine, speeds of 80-90 mph arne't thrilling, only a slighly faster blurring of scenery on the sides. 80 in an MG Midget it terrifyingly fast. 80 in a BMW 740iL is just slighly above boring.
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Old 03-29-2011, 09:25 AM
 
10,963 posts, read 7,757,793 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
Seventy is a pretty liberal speed limit, and the camera tickets only cars going over 80, which is a very generous tolerance. There is no earthly reason for anyone to be driving on US highways faster than 80 mph, and doing so elicits a justified ticket in any jurisdiction in the USA, Canada or Mexico. Anyone who does so is in serious noncompliance with the ambient speed of the cars around him, which is a principal cause of accidents at any speed.

If the speed limit is 70, and all the other traffic is going in the 65-75 range, a driver who has an irresistible compulsion to go 80 should get more than just a ticket. He should be court-ordered to undergo psychiatric evaluation, to address his speed addiction, his narcissism, his delusions of grandeur, or his antisocial behavior issues.
Quote:
Anyone who does so is in serious noncompliance with the ambient speed of the cars around him, which is a principal cause of accidents at any speed.
I would suggest you get out more. In many states in this country you will get past like you are standing still if you drive 70 miles an hour unless you are in an extremely congested urban area.
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Old 03-29-2011, 09:26 AM
 
Location: San Antonio Texas
11,435 posts, read 15,949,388 times
Reputation: 5224
Quote:
Originally Posted by plwhit View Post
You live in Texas where the speed limit (daytime) is 80 MPH and DPS doesn't bat an eye unless you are doing over 90 MPH.....

Get real....

Drive from Houston to San Diego doing what you consider "safe".....

You'll be brain dead within the first 400 miles.....

These speed cams are to pay for bloated city budgets..... not for safety reasons....
You got that right. I've only seen 80 MPH on the desolate roads of West Texas. Most highways here in Tex are 70 daytime. 80-85 seems very reasonable to me when driving those roads (W Texas), espec when you consider that there are few other motorists sharing the road. If there is zero traffic on a highway, I feel like the limits should be adjusted upward. 75-80 is easy and OK on the other roads as well, imo.
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Old 03-29-2011, 11:18 AM
 
Location: Poway, CA
2,698 posts, read 9,527,131 times
Reputation: 2206
I'm reminded of an old George Carlin line that went something along the lines of this:

'Ever notice that anyone going slower than you is an idiot, but anyone going faster is a maniac?'

Funny, but true.

Mike
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Old 03-29-2011, 11:55 AM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,668 posts, read 71,574,557 times
Reputation: 35864
Quote:
Originally Posted by Merc63 View Post

And the fact is, most accidents happen at relatively low speeds, pretty close to home. High speed interstate accidents are actually fairly rare, even though high speeds ON interstates are not rare.
And most accidents occur in the home. But that doesn't make the your home the most dangerous place in the world, nor does it mean you will live longer if you never go home. It just means you spend more time there and therefore have more exposure.

Most accidents occur at speeds that are above what would be appropriate for the circumstances. A car going 10 mph in a busy shopping mall parking lot can cause an accident owing to excessive speed for the driving conditions, even though you would call it "low speed". Would it be safer to drive through the parking lot at 85?

Where the speed limit is 70, what do you think ought to be the tolerance? 85? 90? 100? 125? Or do you think there ought to be no limit, and if YOU want to drive 125 on a 4-lane highway in South Carolina, YOU ought to be allowed to, as long as YOU think your car is safe at that speed. Every drunk thinks he can drive, because it is human nature to overestimate one's own capabilities.

I would call it thrill-seeking (among other things that might violate the TOS) to insist on the right to drive "outside the comfort zone" of an overwhelming majority of the drivers that you share the road with, who have a reasonable expectation of regulated safety and an orderly traffic environment. As well as the false sense of security that nobody will suddenly appear in their mirror going 20 mph faster than everybody else, flashing their bank of Bosch driving lights at them to get them out of the way.

Last edited by jtur88; 03-29-2011 at 12:04 PM..
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