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Old 04-18-2011, 01:50 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnytang24 View Post
Is that the normal method of looking at 'best selling cars?' Looking at the total number of vehicles produced over the lifetime of the vehicle? If someone made a car that sold 10,000,000 units this year, they wouldn't be the top selling car?

Here's one that has cars ranked by country (no exact figures). But to be #1 in 28 countries vs 2 for the F-Series.

World 2010: Toyota Hilux #1 in 28 countries « Best Selling Cars – Matt's blog



From Ford press release:

* Ford’s F-Series is America’s best-selling truck for 33 straight years, outselling its nearest rival by 97,000 units, largest margin in three years

don't you think they would say world's best selling truck if it were so?
Well, it is based on total units sold. For all time the F-series is ranked number 2 behind the Corolla globally. However, it was actually 2006 not 2008, that the F-series became the best selling vehicle in the world based on single year sales.

Top 5 World’s Most Successful Cars Ever

Quote:
It is almost unbelievable that the second ranked in total sale is a pick-up vehicle. Even more impressive information is that this vehicle reached such a score only on North American territory. However, the most surprising is the fact that Ford’s F series is at present the best selling car in the world. Every year Ford sells almost a million cars, that is almost one vehicle every 30 seconds. So far, 25 million vehicles of the F series were sold.
All the manufacturers twist the numbers to suit what they want. For instance, the F150 is the best selling single nameplate TRUCK in America for 33 years. It is also the best selling single nameplate VEHICLE in America for the past 28 years. GM can also claim the top spot on occasion as Silverado and Sierra sales combined eclipsed F150 sales in several years, hence why GM can claim they make the "best selling truck in America". Of course, Ford can then fire back by rolling all F-series sales (150, 250, 350, 450, 550, 650) in and they would again gain the top spot.

The article you linked simply counted which vehicle took top honors in individual countries. Here is the list for the Hilux:

Quote:
Angola, Benin, Botswana, Burkina Faso, Cameroon, Central African Rep, Chad, RD Congo, Congo (Rep), Cote d’Ivoire, El Salvador, Eritrea, Ethiopia, Gabon, Iraq, Laos, Liberia, Malawi, Mali, Mauritania, Mozambique, Nicaragua, Panama, Senegal, South Africa, Sudan, Thailand, Yemen
Just how many cars do you think they sell every year in Angola? How about El Salvador? How about Eritrea and Ethiopia? How about in Mauritania and Mozambique? My guess is not too many.

Globally the Hilux sells about 500k units annually. Unfortunately I can't find exact year over year numbers:

Toyota Hilux - South Africa's benchmark one-ton pick-up | The Toyota Blog

By comparison the F150 sells an average of 766k units annually with a low of 413k in 2009 (a global low point for all manufacturers) and a high of 939k in 2004 and current sales of 626k units in 2010.

Ford F-Series - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Old 04-18-2011, 01:56 PM
 
Location: Birmingham
11,790 posts, read 12,639,398 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maria2388 View Post
Appreciate the numbers. I'll assume they accurate, but that only tells a small piece of the picture, as you know.
Ha ha, that's funny. What other picture is there? Now you have to back off that "mostly junk" statement because a Ford would be better then any Toyota according to warranty claims.

Here, I'll give you another piece of the picture. If Honda were to get into the heavy truck game, hell if they just built something with balls - a high torque V8 with RWD, their warranty claims would go up. Toyota is right in the middle of the domestics because they practically build a competitive model for everything the domestics build, except for an HD pickup.

HD pickups, sports cars, high power vehicles tend to have more severe duty cycles and thus more warranty claims. Once Honda steps out of their comfort zone, they'll face challenges too. Ask anybody who's had trouble with their transmission in a V6 powered Honda product - or better yet google it. Its easy to be squeaky clean if all you build is low torque FWD 4 cylinders.
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Old 04-18-2011, 01:57 PM
PDD
 
Location: The Sand Hills of NC
8,776 posts, read 14,142,640 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by outafocus View Post
The Japanese are going to have a very hard time cracking the redneck pick-em-up truck love affair with anything Detroit. The Japanese trucks are superior in every way to their Detroit counterparts. It will take YEARS, maybe decades, of great word of mouth to get it through the skulls of the typical Detroit truck owner. At least the mechanics are making money off these top selling junkers. If I were Toyota or Nissan, I'd let them have their junk, and not waste money trying to get those who refuse to see get something better. Besides, tobacco juice on the side of a Toyota door doesn't look as normal as on a Chevy or Ford.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion even when they are wrong.
I will give Toyota credit for producing the only truck that can pull 10,000 lbs up a spiral roadway while flames are surrounding the cab.

I'll put that on my list when I need a truck to do that.
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Old 04-18-2011, 02:01 PM
 
Location: Birmingham
11,790 posts, read 12,639,398 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJGOAT View Post
Just how many cars do you think they sell every year in Angola? How about El Salvador? How about Eritrea and Ethiopia? How about in Mauritania and Mozambique? My guess is not too many.
I saw a thread on an import fan site where some of the posters actually bragged about how most of the technicals (improvised fighting vehicles) in Middle Eastern and African countries were Toyota Hilux (although I see plenty of Mitsubishi Triton and Nissans too). I doubt there are too many Detroit3 dealers in those parts of the world, and no push to establish any. They don't have to deal with salt on the roads either and there have been many complaints about rust eating up older Toyota trucks.

That part of the world tends to prefer a smaller frame truck, so the next Ranger/F100 and Colorado seem designed specifically for those markets and may not be sold here at all, leaving the Tacoma the defacto winner of the smaller then fullsize segment.
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Old 04-18-2011, 02:18 PM
 
2,073 posts, read 3,678,744 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJGOAT View Post
Well, it is based on total units sold. For all time the F-series is ranked number 2 behind the Corolla globally. However, it was actually 2006 not 2008, that the F-series became the best selling vehicle in the world based on single year sales.

Top 5 World’s Most Successful Cars Ever



All the manufacturers twist the numbers to suit what they want. For instance, the F150 is the best selling single nameplate TRUCK in America for 33 years. It is also the best selling single nameplate VEHICLE in America for the past 28 years. GM can also claim the top spot on occasion as Silverado and Sierra sales combined eclipsed F150 sales in several years, hence why GM can claim they make the "best selling truck in America". Of course, Ford can then fire back by rolling all F-series sales (150, 250, 350, 450, 550, 650) in and they would again gain the top spot.

The article you linked simply counted which vehicle took top honors in individual countries. Here is the list for the Hilux:



Just how many cars do you think they sell every year in Angola? How about El Salvador? How about Eritrea and Ethiopia? How about in Mauritania and Mozambique? My guess is not too many.

Globally the Hilux sells about 500k units annually. Unfortunately I can't find exact year over year numbers:

Toyota Hilux - South Africa's benchmark one-ton pick-up | The Toyota Blog

By comparison the F150 sells an average of 766k units annually with a low of 413k in 2009 (a global low point for all manufacturers) and a high of 939k in 2004 and current sales of 626k units in 2010.

Ford F-Series - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
That first link is another where they list the total number of cars sold.

I can't find any solid numbers for the hilux, which is unfortunate, cause I'd really like to know. It may sound odd, but I think the numbers for some of those countries may be pretty high -- they don't have a choice. Buy the Hilux, or don't buy a truck. For example, in Thailand alone (2010), they sold 144,000 units:

Thailand Full Year 2010: Toyota Hilux leads with 144,000 sales « Best Selling Cars – Matt's blog

That's only 1 out of 28 countries. even if they only average 20,000, that's over 500,000 in the just the countries where the hilux is #1.

I guess it's hard to say without hard data from Toyota (which I'm still trying to find)
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Old 04-18-2011, 02:38 PM
 
Location: Central CT, sometimes NH.
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I've had Toyotas, Mitsubishis and Isuzus. I towed a small boat (under 2000 lbs package) and I can tell you that with frequent towing it taxed all of those vehicles even though I had them set up with the tow package for the boat.

I had a Ranger with the 4.0 liter, a Dodge Caravan, A Cherokee, and a Grand Cherokee. Each of those were like night and day above the other three. When driving my Dodge Ram 1500 with the 5.7 Hemi you don't even feel it behind you. No comparison.
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Old 04-18-2011, 02:43 PM
 
14,777 posts, read 34,507,040 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnytang24 View Post
That first link is another where they list the total number of cars sold.

I can't find any solid numbers for the hilux, which is unfortunate, cause I'd really like to know. It may sound odd, but I think the numbers for some of those countries may be pretty high -- they don't have a choice. Buy the Hilux, or don't buy a truck. For example, in Thailand alone (2010), they sold 144,000 units:

Thailand Full Year 2010: Toyota Hilux leads with 144,000 sales « Best Selling Cars – Matt's blog

That's only 1 out of 28 countries. even if they only average 20,000, that's over 500,000 in the just the countries where the hilux is #1.

I guess it's hard to say without hard data from Toyota (which I'm still trying to find)
The first link was talking about total sales, but included the line:

Quote:
Even more impressive information is that this vehicle reached such a score only on North American territory. However, the most surprising is the fact that Ford’s F series is at present the best selling car in the world.
I thought that would be proof enough, given that it was an outside source. I also provided numbers on the Hilux where the site I linked (a Hilux fansite BTW) quoted annual sales averaging around 500k units. I then provided the average F-series sales of 766k units per year and their year-to-year breakdown.

The Hilux is a strong selling vehicle, but despite it's "global" popularity more Americans and Canadians buy F-series trucks than the rest of the world buys Hilux's. It's really not so far-fetched if you think of the large number of businesses and industries in North America that depend upon the F-series as it is the basic work truck chassis until you move into the 19,500+ pound GVWR range.
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Old 04-18-2011, 03:06 PM
 
Location: Eastern NC
18,097 posts, read 16,629,431 times
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I would love to see the F150 total sales minus fleet sales. Ford has always used fleet sales to bolster their numbers.
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Old 04-18-2011, 03:18 PM
 
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
4,486 posts, read 14,922,691 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trlhiker View Post
I would love to see the F150 total sales minus fleet sales. Ford has always used fleet sales to bolster their numbers.
As does every other manufacturer...
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Old 04-18-2011, 03:26 PM
 
Location: Birmingham
11,790 posts, read 12,639,398 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trlhiker View Post
I would love to see the F150 total sales minus fleet sales. Ford has always used fleet sales to bolster their numbers.
What vehicles do you think companies in Japan buy for their fleets?
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