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Old 02-07-2012, 09:49 PM
 
809 posts, read 1,455,227 times
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Hyundai's are not cheaper. A base Elantra cost like 15k, but that's a model without AC for gods sake. Bump the price up to about 17k with.
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Old 02-07-2012, 11:03 PM
 
3,129 posts, read 5,141,528 times
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Hyundai= fluff. For people that don't know **** about cars that want to "look" like they own something special. They copy to death, Moderator cut, Offensive term and warranties to sell cars.

Last edited by SOON2BNSURPRISE; 02-08-2012 at 11:45 AM..
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Old 02-08-2012, 12:59 AM
Status: "Rocktober...well that was fast. :-(" (set 17 days ago)
 
Location: Fredericksburg, VA
10,285 posts, read 10,442,913 times
Reputation: 13239
Long term quality remains to be seen, I think. Most of their "improved" line of vehicles is 5-6 years old at most, so it's hard to see how this line of vehicles will be holding up at the 10-15 year mark. If you are someone who buys and trades in every 4 years, I suppose long term quality is of little consequence to you. I try to keep my cars for at least 10 years if I buy them new.

Speaking of buying new, I don't see how people can say that Hyundai is "less expensive." Their lineup is blow for blow right in there with the competition's vehicles, and in some cases more expensive.

Lastly, I wonder if/when Hyundai is going to break into the pickup market. Food for though.
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Old 02-08-2012, 09:16 AM
 
14,777 posts, read 34,490,118 times
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Quote:
Long term quality remains to be seen, I think. Most of their "improved" line of vehicles is 5-6 years old at most, so it's hard to see how this line of vehicles will be holding up at the 10-15 year mark. If you are someone who buys and trades in every 4 years, I suppose long term quality is of little consequence to you. I try to keep my cars for at least 10 years if I buy them new.
Your estimate of their improved product quality is right inline with the data I posted a page back. 2006 seems to be the year, Hyundai turned it around on the quality front. Of course, these cars are still relatively young, so we'll see how they hold up. FWIW, the only two mainstream brands that have anything approaching decades plus of consistent reliability, according to actual available data, are Honda and Toyota.

Hyundai is off to a great start, but they still have a few years to go to cement their place as having industry competitive reliability. Some recent missteps though, especially the issue of "pull/wandering" on the new Sonatas that Hyundai has been unable to fix isn't helping the case. I imagine their long term data that will be published in 2014 for the current models, won't look as good as it currently does, but that is the breaks when it comes to all new designs.

Quote:
Speaking of buying new, I don't see how people can say that Hyundai is "less expensive." Their lineup is blow for blow right in there with the competition's vehicles, and in some cases more expensive.
Pretty much, Hyundai gave up their "cheaper than the other guys" strategy a couple years ago. Their cars are easily within a very narrow window of the competitors when similarly equipped. There was a thread on this not too long ago involving midsize sedans that made that point clear. It was a necessary move for them, you can't be considered a succesful mainstream brand if your cars only compete on price. You can't compete on features and quality without spending money, so the prices have to go up.

Quote:
Lastly, I wonder if/when Hyundai is going to break into the pickup market. Food for though.
Hyundai had been considering an entry into the US pickup market as recently as a couple years ago. The plan at the time was that they were going to partner with Chrysler to offer a Ram based Hyundai pickup, but the deal fell apart. Hyundai has a light pickup they sell overseas called the H100 and they also manufacture commercial trucks as well.

Hyundai has announced plans to attempt an entry into the US commercial truck market with their own products within the next decade, but they have continually pushed it off as that market is very hard to break into and the diesel regulations are hard to meet on commercial trucks. The idea was that they needed a pickup to help bridge the gap between their car/SUV portfolio and their planned commercial portfolio.

The problem as Hyundai sees it though is that the foreign brands are virtually also-rans in the US pickup market. When accounting for retail and commercial sales of all light duty pickup truck classes (up to F350 size), foreign trucks make up around 5% of that market, with most going to Toyota. I think Hyundai feels that if Toyota can't really break into that market, it would be a tough move for them as well outside of a broader effort.
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Old 02-08-2012, 10:21 AM
 
Location: Floribama
13,482 posts, read 29,425,055 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJGOAT View Post
When accounting for retail and commercial sales of all light duty pickup truck classes (up to F350 size), foreign trucks make up around 5% of that market, with most going to Toyota. I think Hyundai feels that if Toyota can't really break into that market, it would be a tough move for them as well outside of a broader effort.
Not in my area. A majority of the small trucks I see are Tacomas, and I'd guess maybe about 20% of the newer full size trucks are Tundras or Titans.
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Old 02-08-2012, 10:29 AM
 
Location: Woodland Park, CO
3,133 posts, read 9,101,058 times
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I see more Ford pickups, then GM, then Dodge. Hardly see any Toyotas or Nissans trucks.
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Old 02-08-2012, 10:33 AM
Status: "Rocktober...well that was fast. :-(" (set 17 days ago)
 
Location: Fredericksburg, VA
10,285 posts, read 10,442,913 times
Reputation: 13239
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJGOAT View Post

Pretty much, Hyundai gave up their "cheaper than the other guys" strategy a couple years ago. Their cars are easily within a very narrow window of the competitors when similarly equipped. There was a thread on this not too long ago involving midsize sedans that made that point clear. It was a necessary move for them, you can't be considered a succesful mainstream brand if your cars only compete on price. You can't compete on features and quality without spending money, so the prices have to go up.
True. It is almost as if they manufactured reputation to bridge the gap between their earlier poor quality and the current line up of cars. Created perception, so to speak. I think that a lot of that is in appearance alone. Hyundai's don't LOOK cheap anymore. Now most of their vehicles I think are ugly, none really appeal to me. But they don't look like a cheap "throwaway" car anymore. It's a proven fact that people are visually stimulated. If it LOOKS good, then for most people their decision is all but made. (Consider the 1960 debates between Kennedy and Nixon. Those who listened on the radio said that Nixon won, those who watched on television said that Kennedy won.) At any rate, I think that building cars that do not look cheap is a vital step forward for the company. I'm still probably not a potential Hyundai consumer, but I applaud any company that can improve itself. For the sake of consumers everywhere, I do hope they are as good as advertised.
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Old 02-08-2012, 09:28 PM
 
Location: Ontario, NY
2,589 posts, read 5,881,132 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CowanStern View Post
Every carmaker knows exactly what is wrong with every car they make. They know how well each component is engineered, and how long each component will last. That is why most cars will collectively self-destruct quite rapidly when they reach a certain point in their lifetime.
I don't agree with this. Manufactures sometimes use lesser quality parts to save money, not for some conspiracy that causes your car to break down at a certain mileage or age. It's impossible for engineers to predict how long a given part will last. Different weather conditions, maintenance and driving habits would make far too many variables for any engineer to predict. Someone who living in a area of the country with mild weather, has proper maintenance on there car and drives slower will tend to have less car problems then someone that lives in an extremely hot or cold area of the country, doesn't have regular maintenance performed on there car and drives fast. Engineers try to at least make the parts of the car last long enough to get out of warranty, regardless of weather, maintenance or driving habits.
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Old 02-09-2012, 07:55 AM
 
Location: Pittsburgh N. Hills / Houston-Clear Lake
8,156 posts, read 26,416,529 times
Reputation: 4395
I don't know enough people with Hyunadis to really make any judgment calls. I worked at a shop in '03-05 and even though the interiors were relatively nice, plenty of them failed emissions/OBDII inspections with only 15-20k miles. I do know someone who bought one brand new, bragged about how they got a great deal on a new '07 Sonata but 2 years later realized they got seriously ripped off considering how much was put down, how much the car was worth, and how much they owed. I also know someone who bragged about what a great ('03) Santa Fe it was because it went 100k miles. But at that point it was completely falling apart and was time for a trade in... on another Santa Fe ('09) that broke down and left 'em stranded in the hood when it had about 15k miles. Based on those stories I tend to stay away. I also stay away because then I'd be driving a "Hyundai" and for many reasons that just doesn't set well with me.
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Old 02-09-2012, 07:58 AM
 
Location: Out in the Badlands
10,394 posts, read 8,344,729 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KnownUnknown View Post
After a lifetime of making some of the worst cars on the market that only appealed to people who never heard the phrase, you get what you pay for, they come out with some cars which provide an admittedly nice first impression.

But how does that relate to Hyundai's biggest problem? Reliability? You can put as many bells and whistles into a car as you want, but that has absolutely NOTHING to do with reliability, and with their track record, I wouldn't be surprised if you start seeing bits and pieces of these things falling off after about 50k miles.

Of course, maybe they won't, but all this, they are as good as the leaders in dependability talk, where is that coming from? Based on what? Wanting to justify your gamble that Hyundai has gotten its **** together does not mean the cars have any data to back up your claims.

And again, this is from a company that pretty much has never made a good car. The best thing they've ever made was the previous generation Sonata, which was the most bland, generic, average car ever. Average to mediocre is what Hyundai has always done, and their is no evidence that these new cars will be anything else.

But if you want to be an early adopter of the New Hyundai, by all means, but until the new Hyundai get's a few notches under it's belt, I don't understand all these as good as Honda and Toyota claims.

Oh, and since when were Honda or Toyota ever known for their innovative styling? That's not what appeals in a commuter car. Doesn't matter how good your car looks if it's always in the shop.
You wouldn't by any chance work for Honda or Toyota?
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