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Old 03-26-2012, 02:10 PM
 
Location: Earth Wanderer, longing for the stars.
12,411 posts, read 9,206,992 times
Reputation: 8498
I like the new Prius C. I cannot understand that the Prius has been on the market in this country for so long, and even longer overseas, without the American auto manufacturers able to make a car that competes with it.

Kudos, though, to Ford, for the Fusion hybrid which comes in at only about 10mpg under the Prius.
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Old 03-26-2012, 03:34 PM
 
Location: SW MO
589 posts, read 420,502 times
Reputation: 549
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotQuiteNative View Post
Yes, and this is the 800-lb gorilla in the room.

American kids are growing up in an America that resembles Europe far more than it used to. More and more kids are going to live with their parents into their 30's and even 40's. Why should a kid have a car when he can get driven around by mom or dad? If he gets a license he can borrow the family car if and when necessary. That's how it is among my ex-inlaws in Germany. They don't seem to be suffering.

But speaking of suffering: For those of you who think something is wrong with young people opting not to "work their asses off" to make enough money for car payments and various related expenses: Why do you think this is a bad thing? What good comes from kids working two ****ty jobs so they can make payments on a half-assed Korean subcompact that gives them the opportunity to be taxed and fined?
The problem is that they are not learning to be independent and having a work ethic and instead are learning to be spoiled little brats with an entitlement complex. That "****ty job" that they work to pay for their car (that they then own) is a major life lesson for early adulthood. You learn what work is and learn some responsibilities, and in return get a little new freedom. Not learning that turns us into Europe, just like you said. And how is Europe doing? Last time I checked there were a bunch of people in their 20s in France, Greece, and Italy having major rioting over the "free government money" gravy train slowing down a little bit. Is that really what you want our nation to become?
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Old 03-26-2012, 03:52 PM
 
3,314 posts, read 3,708,820 times
Reputation: 2087
Some young people feel a car interferes with their eco - concious image. They'd rather ride a bike.
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Old 03-26-2012, 04:23 PM
 
5,602 posts, read 6,439,828 times
Reputation: 3449
Quote:
The problem is that they are not learning to be independent and having a work ethic and instead are learning to be spoiled little brats with an entitlement complex.
Well, that's one way to look at it, but considering that the minimum wage in much of the country is $7.25 per hour, and many of those jobs offer only part-time hours and few if any benefits (necessitating travel between two or more jobs to cobble together something approaching full-time hours), how much car can a worker under those conditions really afford?

Well, even if you work full-time, a minimum wage salary is only going to bring in around $14,000 in a year, and that has to pay for everything - including your own health insurance, if you don't qualify for someone else's plan, or the state Medicaid system is overenrolled.

It would be easy to get to a point where the car and its registration/insurance/maintenance/fuel costs are chewing up so much of that meager salary that it makes "savings" impossible (everything has to go to finance current expenditures), and in that case, it would probably make more sense to ditch the car and find a job that doesn't require one, even if that means spending some time out of work.

Because at least then, you may not be making anything, but you also aren't using up your body or putting your health at risk on the job (a major consideration for those without health insurance, or with stingy plans).
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Old 03-26-2012, 04:24 PM
 
Location: Duarte, CA
4,998 posts, read 4,990,568 times
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My 1999 Honda Civic is all paid for, costs very little to drive and insure. I got it new as a gift for my 16th birthday (I'm almost 30 now.) I intend to put at least 200K miles on it before retiring it (hopefully.)

I've carefully calculated the opportunity costs of owning a Prius C which gets 2x the MPG..

The higher insurance already cancels out the saved gas money. And take into account the ~10% returns I'd be getting on the $20K or so that the car costs and the opportunity costs greatly favor the Civic. I have enough money to pay cash for the Prius C but it's simply not worth it at this point.

Now if my Civic is no longer driveable or needs some expensive repair, then I'll be heading to the dealership for a Prius C.
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Old 03-26-2012, 04:48 PM
 
Location: The Plains
5,909 posts, read 4,983,387 times
Reputation: 4144
I think the love affair is over with young people and cars. My father who brought his first car in the 40's was probably the first of that generation when cars were more than some thing your father drove to town in. By the sixties cars still represented fun and recreation for young people. For kids who were born after the 80's a car is part of the drudgery of suburban life when school, work and home are all spread out. My kids as well as most of their friends couldn't care less about what they are seen driving around in. Most are happy to drive their parents hand me down old cars.
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Old 03-26-2012, 11:36 PM
 
Location: Canada
3,552 posts, read 3,242,955 times
Reputation: 2929
Just having any car at all is considered a big deal among the people I know, who are all between 20 and 25. But then again, the cost of living here is high and jobs for people our age are few and far between. Most find themselves going for more school as without education there's really no hope of ever making more than about 2 dollars over the minimum wage. Can't hope to raise a family on that here, it barely gives enough for DINKs to make rent and buy groceries. And the environmentalist angle is a bigger factor than I think many give it credit for. For many, there is a significant stigma attached to the carbon footprint driving cars entails.
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Old 03-29-2012, 07:19 PM
 
Location: Biltmore area of Phoenix
221 posts, read 214,637 times
Reputation: 355
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyover_Country View Post
And how is Europe doing? Last time I checked there were a bunch of people in their 20s in France, Greece, and Italy having major rioting over the "free government money" gravy train slowing down a little bit. Is that really what you want our nation to become?

No, actually I'd like to look forward to America resembling the suburban midwest in the late '60's, where scrappy kids raised by union-member dads of intact families got highschool degrees and started working at the transmission plant making the equivalent of $25/Hr. They bought new Pontiacs off the showroom floor and soon got married, moving into small 3-bedroom starter homes, bowling and drinking beer on Friday nights. They would all smoke Camels and eat Miracle Whip.

That's my fantasy for the future. It's also totally nutso.

The America of the future looks like the UK of today: A welfare state supported by massive taxes on the wealthiest sliver of society, where whatever remains of the middle class tends to work for the government. There are still Brits who mourn the loss of their empire as well.

So, given that future, why the hell should they strain themselves working to pay for a car that represents nothing more than enhanced servitude?
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Old 03-31-2012, 04:34 PM
 
Location: Earth Wanderer, longing for the stars.
12,411 posts, read 9,206,992 times
Reputation: 8498
Those good old days were not made redundant by liberal politics, but by jobs going overseas, competition by better prepared people willing to take a lot less pay.

The jobs that remain here, they are trying to get illegals to do for cheap wages.

Both parties are to blame and are acting against the best interests of the people of this country and only serve to support international businesses.

This current financial downturn, which has affected much of the world, is due to our removing old laws that prevented our financial institutions from acting in ways that precipitated the Great Depression.
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Old 04-01-2012, 08:38 PM
 
Location: US Empire, Pac NW
5,012 posts, read 6,247,226 times
Reputation: 4125
Quote:
Originally Posted by goldengrain View Post
Those good old days were not made redundant by liberal politics, but by jobs going overseas, competition by better prepared people willing to take a lot less pay.

The jobs that remain here, they are trying to get illegals to do for cheap wages.

Both parties are to blame and are acting against the best interests of the people of this country and only serve to support international businesses.

This current financial downturn, which has affected much of the world, is due to our removing old laws that prevented our financial institutions from acting in ways that precipitated the Great Depression.
Actually you contradict yourself here in bold.

The very root, the core, the essence of capitalism is to find the cheapest, most profit-driven method to sell your product. Outsourcing low-skilled jobs to China and India are the very essence of capitalism working its magic. Consumers don't want to spend the extra $, be it $500 or $5 for something American-made. They don't care how it impacts their fellow countryman, they only care how it impacts THEM.

Pols know this, so the pols will stop at nothing to enhance this effect. And we keep electing them based on how folksy they talk. "I'm a hockey mom from Canada starin' down Putin!" Give me a f-ing break. It's scary when a little less than half the nation thinks VP Palin wouldn't be such a bad thing.

So if there's anyone to blame, look in the mirror. Capitalism is also being shown for what it is and the younger generation hates the bullcrap that is shoved down their throats. Yes yes, keep pushing the blame off to others, that's your generation's way of doing things, isn't it?
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