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Old 09-12-2012, 07:08 AM
 
882 posts, read 2,084,196 times
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To be fair, the vast majority of new vehicle buyers trade in, so dealers use the various forms of ADM to "inflate" the used car value. Works for them too, as you can easily find folks willing to boast that they got "$ X,000" for the old jalopy, but have no clue that the balance = close to MSRP.
Oh, and this practice also helps inflate asking prices for used cars on the private market as well...
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Old 09-12-2012, 08:21 AM
 
1,386 posts, read 5,328,300 times
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Not to make assumptions here, but are you in the good or bad part of town?

I find generally, in the bad towns, the dealers have slick salesman, with crappy no good add on fees, pinstriping and door guards that they add huge sums of money for. I think the assumption is that the less well off people coming to those dealerships are less educated in the car buying process and cost of things and therefore easy marks for these ridiculious charges. In the better towns, that doesn't fly, the customer will tell the dealer he's crazy.

IMHO, get educated online, if you know what you want in a car, contact dealers, many different ones, online and get a full quote from them before you set foot in a dealership or pick up a phone. if you want to do it easier..... go to truecar.com and go through them, you might pay more than the best deal, but still under real MSRP and close to invoice.
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Old 09-12-2012, 08:27 AM
 
Location: Central Texas
13,715 posts, read 31,031,321 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malloric View Post
Anything.

There's always $2000-3000 "market adjustment" on the stickers here. Ford, Toyota, Honda, Mazda, Hyundai... doesn't matter. I guess some suckers think they get a good deal when they talk them down to no markup or maybe even pay half of it? No idea, there must be some reason. When I bought my car, they tried to tell me I was getting a great deal since they "forgot to put the market rate adjustment sticker on." I just laughed and offered $2,000 off MSRP. I actually liked that sales guy. Beat the hell out of the Chevy sales manager who called the sales guy dumb for not knowing the product before proceeding to lie because just wanted to push something I didn't want because it was on the lot. Dealers are nuts here.
It must suck to buy new cars in Sacramento if what you say is true.

But in general no one should accept above market pricing. No one should buy "paint protection" or other borderline fraudulent add ons.

I won't fault a dealer for trying to make more money. But just because someone asks for a higher price no one has to accept it. Just say NO!
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Old 09-12-2012, 11:34 AM
 
165 posts, read 893,286 times
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Is there a website where buyer's can share exactly what they paid for their car, including which dealerships they bought from?

This seems like valuable information going in if you can get what others paid for your exact vehicle at the same dealership.
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Old 09-12-2012, 11:37 AM
 
165 posts, read 893,286 times
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Can you elaborate on this, I did not follow. What is ADM?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayess1 View Post
To be fair, the vast majority of new vehicle buyers trade in, so dealers use the various forms of ADM to "inflate" the used car value. Works for them too, as you can easily find folks willing to boast that they got "$ X,000" for the old jalopy, but have no clue that the balance = close to MSRP.
Oh, and this practice also helps inflate asking prices for used cars on the private market as well...
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Old 09-12-2012, 11:43 AM
 
165 posts, read 893,286 times
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What % off MSRP is a good initial offer for new car? What about for used car (would it be different % vs new car?)?
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Old 09-12-2012, 12:20 PM
 
Location: NJ
17,574 posts, read 46,004,591 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cignalife View Post
Is there a website where buyer's can share exactly what they paid for their car, including which dealerships they bought from?

This seems like valuable information going in if you can get what others paid for your exact vehicle at the same dealership.
Edmunds.com has something like this. They call it True Market Value. I really don't know how it is calculated though.
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Old 09-12-2012, 12:51 PM
 
Location: Whittier
3,004 posts, read 6,246,721 times
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I use: Haggle-Free Car Buying Experience from Local Dealers - TrueCar, to find the prices in the area.

Then I would figure a reasonable number for the car. For example: Mustangs usually go for invoice whereas a BRZ will go for at least sticker. So obviously if you try to haggle under sticker for the BRZ you will get laughed at. Conversely if you ask for a little under invoice for the Mustang you might get laughed at, but I think more Ford dealers will accept an offer like this than the Subaru dealers.

With a ballpark number in mind, I would contact the "Internet/Online Sales" directly. I also like to search a dealer's online inventory to see what they have; if the car I want is in stock then I make an offer I think is fair right over the phone. I'd say something like I want to pay XX,XXX out the door. Meaning TTL included.

If they can't do that then I'll call another dealer. Basically they're betting on "suckers" coming in and paying the inflated prices, and then informed "suckers", like me, who know enough to not pay the dealer's advertised price. And sometimes the MSRP is the only deal you'll get and sometimes you'll be happy to pay that.
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Old 09-12-2012, 03:05 PM
 
882 posts, read 2,084,196 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cignalife View Post
Can you elaborate on this, I did not follow. What is ADM?
ADM = industry jargon for "additional dealer markup", especially when used to give added value to trades. For example, MSRP of $20,000, trade in valued @ $5,000. To make the deal sound better, add $1599 ADM, then bump the trade to $6,599.
Yes, I know it sounds silly as the net hasn't changed, but far too many folks are obsessed over what they're getting for their trade.
Ah well

Quote:
Originally Posted by cignalife View Post
What % off MSRP is a good initial offer for new car? What about for used car (would it be different % vs new car?)?
There's so much variation between brands/models/markets that there's no general rule. A plain jane 4 door sedan in a higher end suburban market (not a good seller) might go for 20~25% off. A paint-to-sample Porsche special ordered just for you, er, not so much.
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Old 09-12-2012, 03:47 PM
 
165 posts, read 893,286 times
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For the 2nd part of that... On the brand websites you can "build your own." If you do this, can you still get the same discounts from the dealer who you will buy this from, or is there less room for negotiation?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayess1 View Post
ADM = industry jargon for "additional dealer markup", especially when used to give added value to trades. For example, MSRP of $20,000, trade in valued @ $5,000. To make the deal sound better, add $1599 ADM, then bump the trade to $6,599.
Yes, I know it sounds silly as the net hasn't changed, but far too many folks are obsessed over what they're getting for their trade.
Ah well


There's so much variation between brands/models/markets that there's no general rule. A plain jane 4 door sedan in a higher end suburban market (not a good seller) might go for 20~25% off. A paint-to-sample Porsche special ordered just for you, er, not so much.
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