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Old 04-04-2013, 02:21 PM
 
Location: Wappingers Falls, NY
1,618 posts, read 2,624,854 times
Reputation: 1098

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Beyond a certain point, auto manufacturers need to seriously ask themselves if it's really worth risking the complexity of 9 or 10 or more gears, or should they just stick a CVT in there and program it to simulate them.

Ultimately, CVTs are going to kill the "speeds" argument on automatics, not because they're better (though maybe they are) but because they can be programmed to simulate any number of gears you want, and the shift points can be changed however you like through software, without needing to make and test complex hardware changes.
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Old 04-04-2013, 03:53 PM
 
Location: Cole neighborhood, Denver, CO
1,123 posts, read 3,111,097 times
Reputation: 1254
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sayantsi View Post
I'd say GM is ahead of Honda at least. It's 2013 and Honda is still working without direct injection and with five-speed transmissions.
Huh? The 2013 Accord has DI and a 6-speed.
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Old 04-04-2013, 04:30 PM
 
3,743 posts, read 13,703,450 times
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Originally Posted by dude_reino View Post
Huh? The 2013 Accord has DI and a 6-speed.
Exactly - Honda is just now rolling out technology that the rest of the world has been commonly using for the past five years. Honda is lauding DI and 6-speed transmissions in 2013 when the rest of the world is implementing turbos and 8-speed transmissions - its still behind the curve.

When the 2008 financial crisis hit, Honda pulled way back on R&D and investment in things like motorsports and the effects have been showing. Technology is no longer cutting edge, quality has suffered, and the competition has taken advantage.
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Old 04-04-2013, 05:18 PM
 
4,236 posts, read 8,141,570 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sayantsi View Post
I'd say GM is ahead of Honda at least. It's 2013 and Honda is still working without direct injection and with five-speed transmissions.

And GM is still on government life support.

We should have let GM fail.
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Old 04-04-2013, 05:22 PM
 
19,028 posts, read 27,592,838 times
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Originally Posted by 28173 View Post
For years GM powertrain plants have had banners saying: "Best Powertrains"...

Oh, is it? Isn't that's why they put a pushrod engine on their latest Vette? As retarded as pushrod engines are?

And you know it is very ironic. Truly, GM used to be extremely innovative. They had tons of developments. Until number crunchers took over and it all became "by the numbers" engineering, like Bob Lutz says. With "competitive bidding" on parts prices, and you know how that goes.
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Old 04-04-2013, 05:37 PM
 
3,743 posts, read 13,703,450 times
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Originally Posted by ukrkoz View Post
Oh, is it? Isn't that's why they put a pushrod engine on their latest Vette? As retarded as pushrod engines are?

And you know it is very ironic. Truly, GM used to be extremely innovative. They had tons of developments. Until number crunchers took over and it all became "by the numbers" engineering, like Bob Lutz says. With "competitive bidding" on parts prices, and you know how that goes.
The pushrod design in the corvette allows a lower center of gravity and a better packaging for performance goals while delivering great power and efficiency - two things that an overhead cam engine cannot provide. How exactly is the pushrod engine "retarded"?

I'm far from first in line to support GM, but it as a company does a lot in the way of innovation. The same car that has the "retarded" engine also uses state of the art aluminum and carbon manufacturing for its frame and body and one of the only 7-speed manual transmissions on the market, not to mention a magnetic suspension that Ferrari licenses from GM.
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Old 04-04-2013, 05:39 PM
 
Location: Wappingers Falls, NY
1,618 posts, read 2,624,854 times
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And don't forget the 1.4L turbo, that they managed to get 138 HP out of. Ooh wow....and then Hyundai gets 200+ HP out of a 1.6L.
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Old 04-04-2013, 05:48 PM
 
Location: San Jose, CA
7,688 posts, read 29,152,138 times
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My Ford Five Hundred has a 6-speed auto, and it was built in 2006. Chevy was still making Malibus with a 4-speed auto until 2011.
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Old 04-04-2013, 05:48 PM
 
Location: Wappingers Falls, NY
1,618 posts, read 2,624,854 times
Reputation: 1098
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sayantsi View Post
The pushrod design in the corvette allows a lower center of gravity and a better packaging for performance goals while delivering great power and efficiency - how exactly is the pushrod engine "retarded"?
Pushrods and valve lifters all have mass that has to be moved. These are additional masses that an OHC engine doesn't have to worry about, therefore they can rev higher. Also, having less reciprocating mass allows greater efficiency.

If GM was really worried about COG, they would have grabbed Subaru's flat engine designs while they owned a piece of them. They use a pushrod V8 because it's cheap.
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Old 04-04-2013, 05:49 PM
 
3,743 posts, read 13,703,450 times
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Originally Posted by npaladin2000 View Post
And don't forget the 1.4L turbo, that they managed to get 138 HP out of. Ooh wow....and then Hyundai gets 200+ HP out of a 1.6L.
Hyundai uses a turbo to get 200 hp from that 1.6L engine - not exactly a feat.

If there's been any recent marvel of engineering, its the boxer engine Subaru developed with Toyota's FI technology - 200 hp out of 2L, naturally aspirated.
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