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Old 01-22-2016, 09:57 AM
 
Location: San Diego A.K.A "D.A.Y.G.O City"
1,996 posts, read 4,741,684 times
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As vehicle weights continue to decline due to the EPA, CAFE, and the increase in fuel economy standards, what are manufactures doing besides using acoustic glass, and spray on sound deadeners to lower road, engine, and wind noise? I am talking about cars that don't use noise cancellation tech either.

It's pretty amazing that a 3,200-3,500lb car can be so silent on the roads. Not all cars and trucks are quiet, but the ones made in the last few years from many different automakers, specifically mid-size vehicles, have been getting quieter.

Back in the day, auto manufactures used mass, be it thick heavy gauge sheet metal, thick glass, lots of carpet padding, and a lot of sound deadeners in order to keep the interiors of cars as quiet as possible. But compared to modern cars, all that mass has been removed, but new cars are quieter than most of the old land yachts of the past, so what are the new sound absorber alternatives?

The times I've worked on newish cars, looking underneath the underbody, some don't have any spray on deadeners, some do, but even then, it's not a whole lot and yet they are very quiet to drive.

One car comes to mind is the current Ford Fusion. That car is amazingly quiet for a non luxury car and it rides extremely well. I am sure the chassis and how it is designed makes a difference, and of course tires, but you still need something to deflect sound or to absorb it in the case of unibody vehicles.

And this is my other point, many of the unibody cars today are quieter to drive than the full Body-On-Frame giants of the past. I'm sure if you stripped down the interior of most new vehicles, there isn't a whole lot of anything to absorb noise, no dynamat material and zero carpet padding, yet they drive like being in a tomb.

Even the 2015 Altima I rented for a week, almost a month ago, was pretty quiet to drive, and it only weighs like 3,100lbs. Going over certain older paved streets, and freeways the road noise was more pronounced, but even then, it was tolerable and never intrusive.

The car doesn't feel substantial either, the doors are lightweight, and the car itself felt like a feather while on the road.

So what gives?
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Old 01-22-2016, 10:19 AM
 
Location: NYC
20,550 posts, read 17,489,771 times
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Better technology, computer modeling now can detect and predict where the chasis can use better welding or less welding. Increase rigidity of the car's chassis is the key to keeping the car quiet. More use of sound deadening material and sealing. And good use of suspension to keep the car from making rattles.

I've driven sports cars in the 90s and majority of today's budget to medium family cars can out handle them due to improved suspension and chassis tech.
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Old 01-22-2016, 10:24 AM
 
33,387 posts, read 34,617,896 times
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first off, cars are heavier than they were just a decade ago, not lighter. second, sound deadener being used is a higher technology version of what used to be used making more efficient and lighter. third, there is the design factor as well. for instance the nissan juke(?) had some weird lines built into the headlight lenses to eliminate wind noise around the mirrors.

the automakers have been spending a lot of money and time on noise, vibration, and harshness and the elimination of all three. aero design tricks, extra spot welds, adhesives instead of or working with the more spot welds, bushing materials, bushing design, etc. all work together to make cars much quieter than in years past.

and then there is the design aspects that you dont see. the little clips, bolts, linkages, etc.
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Old 01-22-2016, 12:15 PM
 
Location: Pikesville, MD
2,983 posts, read 3,046,733 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rbohm View Post
first off, cars are heavier than they were just a decade ago, not lighter.
He's comparing the top luxury versions of modern mid size cars to the 4000-6000lb BOF luxury cars of the '60s and '70s. Modern midsizers are miles better than midsizers of that era, and also quieter that the full size luxury cars used to be, as well. And the rest of your post addresses why.
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Old 01-22-2016, 02:11 PM
 
1,209 posts, read 1,803,362 times
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Some of the new V8 American pony and muscle cars such as the Challenger, Mustang, and Camaro are criminally quiet! Plan on going straight from the dealership to a shop specializing in aftermarket exhausts for at least a cat back exhaust upgrade.
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Old 01-22-2016, 05:05 PM
 
Location: Whittier
3,004 posts, read 6,240,127 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rbohm View Post
first off, cars are heavier than they were just a decade ago, not lighter. second, sound deadener being used is a higher technology version of what used to be used making more efficient and lighter. third, there is the design factor as well. for instance the nissan juke(?) had some weird lines built into the headlight lenses to eliminate wind noise around the mirrors.

the automakers have been spending a lot of money and time on noise, vibration, and harshness and the elimination of all three. aero design tricks, extra spot welds, adhesives instead of or working with the more spot welds, bushing materials, bushing design, etc. all work together to make cars much quieter than in years past.

and then there is the design aspects that you dont see. the little clips, bolts, linkages, etc.
Exactly. All of this.

Back in the day, you had steel on steel. Things would rust, rubber was of poorer quality.

And yes, cars today are heavier in the past 20 years or so. A 1992 Civic is probably around 2300 lbs, while a new Civic is about 600lbs heavier. Quieter engines, more sound deadening. And this is one of the lighter cars on the market.

I think the new Miata is around 2400lbs, and is probably one of the lightest new cars being built right now. I wouldn't call it that quiet though.

The larger BMW 7 series, Hyundai Equus, Lexus LS, etc.. are still around 5k lbs.
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Old 01-22-2016, 09:11 PM
 
Location: Montgomery County, PA
16,563 posts, read 15,105,033 times
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My 98 Explorer is dead quiet and rides smooth as glass.
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Old 01-22-2016, 10:05 PM
 
Location: San Diego A.K.A "D.A.Y.G.O City"
1,996 posts, read 4,741,684 times
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What do you guys mean by the spot welds? What does that have anything to do with quieting down the interior?

Some cars have become heavier, but it's all mainly because of all the added tech and safety features that add a lot of weight to the vehicle and not necessarily because of the body itself weighing more. If anything automakers have been lightening up chassis specs for awhile, it's just the safety equipment that has been bringing back the weight gains as new cars become even safer.

If the old luxury cars from 50 years ago were to add all the modern features that exist in new cars, they would probably easily weigh an extra 500-1,000lbs on top of their current curb weight. Just a random guess of course.
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Old 01-22-2016, 10:58 PM
 
33,387 posts, read 34,617,896 times
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a spot weld is just that, a single weld point where the metal is compressed between two electrodes, and a current us passed through the electrodes, through the two sheets of metal, and back through the other electrode. the metal to be welded is heated by the current to its melting point, then the current is shut off after the weld is done.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spot_welding

in the past the factories used a minimum number of spot welds to hold panels together. it worker well enough, but there was panel vibration which can create a buzzing sound. other panels would rattle against each other, etc. so the more spot welds you have holding panels together, the less chances of such things happening, and the quieter the car in question will be. it also creates a more solid feeling to the car as there is less panel flexing, which again also cuts down on the noise.
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Old 01-23-2016, 12:14 AM
 
1,198 posts, read 1,780,427 times
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I've been test driving cars lately, and they all seem to have styrofoam in just about any book and cranny.

I like the quiet. Take that, some nice sunglasses, and a good suspension and I could drive for days on end.
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