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Old 06-18-2008, 04:04 PM
 
Location: Eastern Washington
8,765 posts, read 21,689,520 times
Reputation: 4709
Some FWD are a PITA to work on, some ain't. Most 1980's VW watercooled are pretty easy, well laid-out for maintenance and repair. Water pump is independent of timing belt, you can change one without disturbing the other. Sparkplugs, even valve adjust are a piece of cake, really. The 1980's Toyota Camrys are OK, but the water pump is inside the timing belt, and you have to support the engine and remove one engine mount (not that big a deal, but I can do the VW belt job faster than I can get the belt off the Toy). Honda inline 4's are generally not bad, certainly the plugs on all these import FWD 4-bangers range from easy to real easy.

The bad ones are domestic V-6 FWD cars - for whatever reason everything is in the way of everything else, typically the back 3 plugs are a real PITA. Some are claiming 100K miles on a set of plugs, I personally would not want to be going after those back 3 if they were put in dry (no anti-seize) at the factory 100K miles and 8-10 years ago...

That and some GM factory installations seem to me less well-thought-out than the better engine swaps I have seen...just because you *can* get the engine into the engine bay, does not mean it really *fits* in there. A shame since most of their pre- 1970 vehicles were easy to work on, robust, maybe a little heavy and thirsty and too softly sprung for my taste, but were an OK car/truck/van from the factory and the shortcomings were practical to fix.
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Old 06-19-2008, 08:48 AM
 
Location: AZ
18,945 posts, read 49,532,294 times
Reputation: 7832
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deez Nuttz View Post
Personally I think it sucks.

Just today I was changing oil on our 2007 Honda CRV. While the hood was up and waiting for the oil to drain, I began a component location inside just to pass the time.

As I soon began to find where the alternator, power steering pump, a/c compressor, etc. was, I soon realized if the alternator ever goes out, I'll be spending a weekend, if now two, pulling the engine, just to swap an alternator. That's how cramped it is in there.

So now I am praying none of this stuff goes bad for a long long time. Because I can only see myself having to shell out $$$$$ to have a shop with all the special tools, do the work.

Same thing on my old 95 Cavalier. About the easiest thing to replace was the 02 sensor. Just a simple tune up of changing wires required you to contort in 7 different awkward positions if not throw in the towel and end up paying a shop to do it, knowing you'd be looking at pulling an engine.

Yet my old 93 S-10 you can do all of this stuff within an hour with basic hand tools. Screw FWD vehicles.
Ridiculous post. Ive seen several RWD vehicles that are a complete BEOTCH to work on, including your beloved American vehicles. FWD vehicles CAN be tricky at times to work on, but cmon. I wanna see you replace an alternator on a 300ZX TT or a Fiero, then lets see how bad you whine about your CR-V.
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Old 06-19-2008, 11:10 AM
 
Location: Londonderry, NH
33,264 posts, read 27,533,211 times
Reputation: 15221
I could replace the starter on a '70 econoline van in less than a minute from start to finish. I got a lot of practice until my mother in law had the started ring gear replaced. Changing the alternator on my old Toyota was more complicated than necessary. I have replaced the plugs in my older Buick Wagon with platinum because I do not want to do that job ever again.
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Old 06-19-2008, 11:43 AM
 
Location: Oswego, IL
5,609 posts, read 6,476,176 times
Reputation: 34581
I said the same thing about the 55 Chev when they put a V8 in it, the 63 Chevy II when they put a V8 in it. My 69 Buick Wildcat when I had to change a brake lite bulb. GM X body cars with a V6. Any car with a rubber cam timing belt. Crank trigger ignitions. CCC carbs in 81. The list and special tools go on.
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Old 06-19-2008, 02:50 PM
 
351 posts, read 1,277,614 times
Reputation: 145
It may be a joke to me now, but sooner of later these engineers probly build the engine in a way that we would have to remove a front tire and fender tub to get to the oil filter.
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Old 06-19-2008, 03:31 PM
 
Location: Earth
4,214 posts, read 11,385,263 times
Reputation: 2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve-o View Post
Ridiculous post. Ive seen several RWD vehicles that are a complete BEOTCH to work on, including your beloved American vehicles. FWD vehicles CAN be tricky at times to work on, but cmon. I wanna see you replace an alternator on a 300ZX TT or a Fiero, then lets see how bad you whine about your CR-V.
The only thing that is ridiculous is you.

Try reading all the way thru and getting the whole picture, instead of thinking this is another "domestic vs. foreign" post.

Never said only foreign cars were a PITA to work on and domestics were not. Notice how I mentioned a 95 Cavalier? You know a cheapo american car?

I don't know about a 300 ZX but I'm sure a Fiero is also a nightmare. Not that I care for those cars because I don't.

And yes not all RWD cars are cake either. An LS1/LT1 Camaro comes to mind. But I've never come across a FWD that was cake either.

Maybe I should have been more clearer and instead mentioned "transverse mounted?"

Last edited by Deez Nuttz; 06-19-2008 at 03:43 PM..
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Old 06-19-2008, 03:37 PM
 
Location: AZ
18,945 posts, read 49,532,294 times
Reputation: 7832
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deez Nuttz View Post
The only thing that is ridiculous is you.

Time to stop reading between the lines and instead get the whole picture, instead of thinking this is another "domestic vs. foreign" post.

Never said only foreign cars were a PITA to work on and domestics were not. Notice how I mentioned a 95 Cavalier? You know a cheapo american car?

I don't know about a 300 ZX but I'm sure a Fiero is also a nightmare. Not that I care for those cars because I don't.

Know now that I am not knocking foreign cars and praising domestics. I'm just talking about any car that requires you to remove half of the engine compartment to replace something on the engine, be it Ford, Chevy, Dodge or Honda.

Wished it could be like the old days, when an inline six meant you had all the room to stand in the engine compartment and change plugs with a common set of hand tools if you wanted to.
I didnt turn this into a foreign vs. domestic issue, did I?!?! Where did I say that?!?! Its a FWD vs RWD thread, what didnt you understand about my post? I said Ive seen several RWD cars (including your beloved American rides) that are an absolute beotch to work on. I even went so far as to use a foreign AND domestic model to prove my point, just so you wouldnt jump down my throat (which backfired on me). Please dont put words in my mouth.

On a side note, I have owned several FWD 4 bangers that were easier to work on than any RWD V8. My old Toyota was a PIECE OF CAKE to work on (not that it ever needed work). To do the clutch was about the easiest clutch job we've ever done. Tune ups? Simple as breathing. Alternator? Cake walk. Just an example...
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Old 06-19-2008, 03:41 PM
 
Location: Northridge/Porter Ranch, Calif.
18,193 posts, read 15,429,739 times
Reputation: 4414
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deez Nuttz View Post
Personally I think it sucks.

Just today I was changing oil on our 2007 Honda CRV. While the hood was up and waiting for the oil to drain, I began a component location inside just to pass the time.

As I soon began to find where the alternator, power steering pump, a/c compressor, etc. was, I soon realized if the alternator ever goes out, I'll be spending a weekend, if now two, pulling the engine, just to swap an alternator. That's how cramped it is in there.

So now I am praying none of this stuff goes bad for a long long time. Because I can only see myself having to shell out $$$$$ to have a shop with all the special tools, do the work.

Same thing on my old 95 Cavalier. About the easiest thing to replace was the 02 sensor. Just a simple tune up of changing wires required you to contort in 7 different awkward positions if not throw in the towel and end up paying a shop to do it, knowing you'd be looking at pulling an engine.

Yet my old 93 S-10 you can do all of this stuff within an hour with basic hand tools. Screw FWD vehicles.
It is one reason why I've always owned RWD cars.

On the Dodge Dart I used to own ('66 w/V-8) I could change all of the spark plugs in about 30-40 minutes, including gapping them. Nothing had to be removed to get to them, which is impressive considering that the engine compartment of '66 and earlier Darts were designed for a 6-cylinder engine.

On my Cadillacs, changing the plugs is also easy (very big engine compartment). On both the Dart and Cads, changing the starter does not involve moving anything.

I changed the fuel pump on my '66 Dart (it needed one after 24 years); ridiculously easy! Same thing with the alternator, and the part only cost $20 back in the late-'80s.
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Old 06-19-2008, 03:43 PM
 
Location: AZ
18,945 posts, read 49,532,294 times
Reputation: 7832
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fleet View Post
It is one reason why I've always owned RWD cars.

On the Dodge Dart I used to own ('66 w/V-8) I could change all of the spark plugs in about 30-40 minutes, including gapping them. Nothing had to be removed to get to them, which is impressive considering that the engine compartment of '66 and earlier Darts were designed for a 6-cylinder engine.

On my Cadillacs, changing the plugs is also easy (very big engine compartment). On both the Dart and Cads, changing the starter does not involve moving anything.

I changed the fuel pump on my '66 Dart (it needed one after 24 years); ridiculously easy! Same thing with the alternator, and the part only cost $20 back in the late-'80s.
Go buy a new Caddy CTS and see if you sing the same tune. Modern V8s are waaaay harder to work on than the old V8s.
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Old 06-19-2008, 03:49 PM
 
Location: Earth
4,214 posts, read 11,385,263 times
Reputation: 2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve-o View Post
I didnt turn this into a foreign vs. domestic issue, did I?!?!
Yeah you implied it. Which doesn't surprise me.

And what make/model/year were these FWD 4 bangers you claim are easy as pie?
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