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Old 12-05-2010, 10:13 PM
 
Location: Guangzhou, China
8,200 posts, read 6,502,726 times
Reputation: 8490

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Also, let me weigh in here on the 1.8t.

I'm one of those rare motorheads who doesn't harbor any specific brand loyalty, and who also doesn't get caught up in hating cars from a certain region. The fact of the matter is that there are plenty of cars from basically all the companies out there from every region that are awesome, or have the potential to be.

The 1.8t is a very tunable engine, perhaps abnormally so. Although saying 250hp with intake/exhaust/chip is a bit extreme, saying you can get 190 isn't. Is 190hp a lot of hp for a car as big as a Passat? No, not really. Is it more than 150hp, which is by my definition (and that most of the other people here, I'd wager) anemic for such a heavy car? Yes.

So, if for whatever reason it's not feasible or desirable to this guy to get rid of his Passat, that extra 40hp will make a difference.

The VW 1.8t's were considerably undertuned from the factory and the engineers left a lot of room for improvement. For example, the Audi TT's and A4's had 1.8t's that produced as much as 240hp. Starting in 2002, you could get a 180hp 1.8t in GTI's and Jettas that was a nastier beast and pretty fun to drive.

For the record: when I worked for VW, I had an '04 Passat GLS wagon with the 1.8t and a manual transmission. Halfway through 2002, the hp was bumped to 170hp, which was hardly a gain, but... I figured out very quickly where the boost hit with the engine, and that if I shifted at the right point higher in the revs, I could keep the boost from shift to shift and keep the tires spinning at a 50mph gear change uphill while smoking a modded Integra and Civic that were riding together up Mulholland. In a Passat wagon.

Is this a competetive car on a track against skilled drivers? Hell no. Can it be competetive on the street against other amateurs? Yes, as long as it's got a little bit more guts behind it and the driver knows what s/he's doing. Would I consider owning one? Probably not. Although they share the chassis with the A4 of similar vintage, they're not performance sedans. They're really heavy, they're FWD... right there, my interest in them dissipates. But they're not horrible cars and yes: there are Passats out there with a 1.8t that can smoke a Camaro SS. Some of you may not want to hear it, but it's true.

Here's a link to a few turbo kits for the Passat 1.8t: Turbo-Kits.com - 98 - 05 Volkswagen Passat B5 1.8T Turbo Kit - AWD AWW AWP
One of them claims 333hp and costs just over $2100. That's not a bad deal for an increase in HP of over 100%. They also sell an ECU upgrade that claims 200hp/243lb-ft stock for $400. These are just kits; if you were to actually take it into a tuning shop and get some custom work done, you can get over 400hp.
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Old 12-06-2010, 08:12 AM
Status: "The Union forever! Down with the traitors." (set 1 day ago)
 
13,619 posts, read 17,206,640 times
Reputation: 11745
A lot of the potential depends on which 1.8T he has. At first I thought he may have an AWM, with the hybrid KO3S turbo that uses some K04 parts and VVT. I think however, he has either an AEB or ATW depending on when the car was built. In that case, 250 crank is being a little too hopeful. Still, with a full exhaust, intake and tune 220-240 at the crank isn't out of the realm of reason, but you will be pretty much maxing out the injectors at that point. My comments were really more about what's possible, versus what most people would get or even want.
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Old 12-06-2010, 11:56 AM
 
Location: Vancouver, B.C., Canada
9,285 posts, read 12,913,467 times
Reputation: 3980
Quote:
Originally Posted by 415_s2k View Post
Also, let me weigh in here on the 1.8t.


Is this a competetive car on a track against skilled drivers? Hell no. Can it be competetive on the street against other amateurs? Yes, as long as it's got a little bit more guts behind it and the driver knows what s/he's doing. Would I consider owning one? Probably not. Although they share the chassis with the A4 of similar vintage, they're not performance sedans. They're really heavy, they're FWD... right there, my interest in them dissipates. But they're not horrible cars and yes: there are Passats out there with a 1.8t that can smoke a Camaro SS. Some of you may not want to hear it, but it's true.

Here's a link to a few turbo kits for the Passat 1.8t: Turbo-Kits.com - 98 - 05 Volkswagen Passat B5 1.8T Turbo Kit - AWD AWW AWP
One of them claims 333hp and costs just over $2100. That's not a bad deal for an increase in HP of over 100%. They also sell an ECU upgrade that claims 200hp/243lb-ft stock for $400. These are just kits; if you were to actually take it into a tuning shop and get some custom work done, you can get over 400hp.
the thing is a nice 98-02 LS1 Z28 6-speed Camaro can be had for 10K in decent shape and with 5K-6K in mods/tuning it can be a 450HP daily driver muscle car that still gets decent mpg on the freeway

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbwM64KTGoc
you can have something like this bad machine

the thing I learned isif you are goin g to buy a car for performance the best bet is to buy the most powerful car you can afford that is stock which tends to be 4th gen LT1/LS1 camaro's and 99-04 mustang GT's then build the car up from stock to where you want it.

A 333HP FWD passat is going to have terrible torque steer and would actually be hard to drive fast in corners as the steering wheel will try to twist out of the drivers hand in hindsight it will actully make the driver less sure about pushing the car and the amount of money to build the stock tranny and drive train up to handle that power the op could go pick up a 98-02 camaro SS/Trans-am Ws6 that already pumps out 345HP stock.

Last edited by GTOlover; 12-06-2010 at 12:09 PM..
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Old 12-08-2010, 01:51 PM
 
3,130 posts, read 3,036,108 times
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Not on most newer cars. They help with older cars and it helps with sound.
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Old 12-09-2010, 05:14 AM
 
Location: Guangzhou, China
8,200 posts, read 6,502,726 times
Reputation: 8490
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTOlover View Post
the thing is a nice 98-02 LS1 Z28 6-speed Camaro can be had for 10K in decent shape and with 5K-6K in mods/tuning it can be a 450HP daily driver muscle car that still gets decent mpg on the freeway

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbwM64KTGoc
you can have something like this bad machine

the thing I learned isif you are goin g to buy a car for performance the best bet is to buy the most powerful car you can afford that is stock which tends to be 4th gen LT1/LS1 camaro's and 99-04 mustang GT's then build the car up from stock to where you want it.

A 333HP FWD passat is going to have terrible torque steer and would actually be hard to drive fast in corners as the steering wheel will try to twist out of the drivers hand in hindsight it will actully make the driver less sure about pushing the car and the amount of money to build the stock tranny and drive train up to handle that power the op could go pick up a 98-02 camaro SS/Trans-am Ws6 that already pumps out 345HP stock.
All this is true. My first car was an '86 Saab 900 SPG hatch that I slapped a bigger turbo, intercooler, and injectors on... it put down, oh, something like 250whp (being liberal here). At the time, I had no clue what "torque steer" was, but I became quite well-acquainted with it when I was entering turns with my foot on the gas while the turbo was in the boost range I managed to correct every single time, but had a few close calls.

I agree wholeheartedly, and at my (comparatively) sagely 27-years old have schooled a lot of my younger cohorts on the value of buying a car that was actually built for speed versus one that was built for economy.

Here's the down-low: if I wanted to, right now, I could cash out my savings. There's a 1988 Civic DX on Craigslist for $2000 that has a working "B18" (probably out of a USDM Integra GSR, figure 180bhp) swap. Say I get that, and then get an eBay turbo kit, spend an afternoon with a friend, a six pack, and a toolbox and walk away with 250bhp on a 2200lb car. Now, I can smoke a stock 80's or early 90's V8 Camaro or Mustang. Suck it, biatches!

Now, I take it to the track and I pull ahead of all those Mustangs and Camaros, and I hit the first turn. Now, I know what it's like when all my weight and torque are in the front. I hit that first turn, and I give it a bit much gas and my passenger's side wheel is eating dirt. The Mustangs and Camaros are a bit closer. Next turn, I lay off the gas a little bit, aaaaand... the Mustangs and Camaros are on my bumper. Third turn, and there are a couple cars ahead of me.

Then, an S2000, a Boxster, a C5 Corvette and an RX7 FD come and eat them all... even though they have comparable-if-not-lower HP and torque than all the other cars on the track. Why? The Civic is an econobox that has a powerful engine in it: hell, back when the thing was designed, the Japanese ministry of transportation reported that the average speed of a car on the freeways of Tokyo was 25mph. Stability at 80+ mph in a tiny car that was designed to get 40mpg with a trunk full of tonkatsu and a 90-lb girl in the front seat just doesn't jive. It wasn't a priority.

Camaros and Mustangs were designed to be inexpensive, fast cars. They are made of pressed steel and use engines and drivetains that are interchangable with cop cars and pickups. They're tanks. There's a reason that while you'll see ads offering "fully built" Japanese cars for a song because, uh, youknowtheenginegrenadedwheniwasracingthisdudeonse pulvedasoyeah check out the rims, you very rarely will see the same for a Stang or a camaro. The caveat is that they handle like pigs. When I say this, I want all you musclecar fans to keep in mind the following:

1. Were I to win the lottery, one of my top priorities would be a gloss black 80's El Camino with a built, turbocharged 502, a red velour interior just like my parents' old '85 Delta 88 (RWD, not the worthless FWD) had, and some matte black American Racing 5-spokes;

2. A gloss black '59 El Camino with the same engine, a red leather interior, and some chrome American Racing 5-spokes;

3. An early 80's Camaro Berlinetta with a fully-built and blueprinted big-block from hell and whatever could be bolted on it to make it inexcusably fast... chassis rewelded with a full cage to make it stable in the twisties, and a decent stereo to blast "Panama" by The Halen as I tore down the Autobahn with a Corsican model in the passenger's seat leaned over my lap... preferably, it would be gloss white.

But barring a hell of a lot of work, they handle like crap. I've driven them. It's true. They cruise beautifully, but they don't handle much better than that Civic, just with all their torque at one end rather than the other.

A Passat of this vintage can be had for about $2500 here in the Bay Area, due in part to the fact that they're electonic nightmares. There are probably five on the whole continent that don't have a CEL light on right now because of a MAF glitch or because their power window switch has a bad ground that makes the thing think it's running 81 octane in 130 degree weather. But, that said, you can get a turbo that'll make the thing go in a straight line like a stock Camaro SS of the same vintage in much more comfort with more space for groceries and friends for less money. It'll probably die off a lot faster, and it also handles like a piggy in the twisties, but thanks to the fact that you can buy cheap-ass Chinese-made turbo kits off eBay for a song, it'll probably win in a straight line for less.

You can file it under that whole "it's like winning the Special Olympics" folder, though...
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Old 09-02-2012, 10:34 AM
 
1 posts, read 1,673 times
Reputation: 10
Question Worried about gas mileage

I am considering buying a used 2001 Toyota Tundra for my new work truck. The seller mentioned that this truck has a K&N Typhoon Air Intake. I have no need for increased horsepower, torque, growl, etc., on a work truck, so I could care less about that, but I am concerned about fuel economy as my gas costs are one of my largest business expenses. Also if the previous owner didn't take care of this Air Intake properly could there be damage to the engine? Any advice you can give is appreciated.
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Old 09-02-2012, 10:44 AM
 
2,529 posts, read 2,916,591 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by High Springs Gator View Post
A turbo would kill my gas mileage. No thanks. I am currently avg 38 to 44 mpg. Appreciate the info.
Buy a faster car or get a bike
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Old 09-02-2012, 10:48 AM
 
2,393 posts, read 1,898,787 times
Reputation: 4016
Cold air intakes are a huge waste of money. Has anyone ever watched a car being dynoed with one installed? Have you noticed anything?

The hood is always open! Close the hood and watch that newfound single digit HP increase go bye bye with your new hot air intake.
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Old 09-02-2012, 10:49 AM
 
Location: NJ
17,580 posts, read 20,825,036 times
Reputation: 15414
A CAI is on my list. But it is part of a bigger plan that includes a new exhaust and some other mods. I also like the look of it better.
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Old 09-02-2012, 02:13 PM
 
Location: Ohio
3,440 posts, read 2,467,334 times
Reputation: 2568
After you put all that crap on your car, don't forget the stickers, THAT is where the real power comes from.
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