What can be done to improve American cars? (muscle car, traction control, fuel)

[ryanek9freak]

Have any of you guys actually been inside a Honda engine? The way they are engineered is nothing short of genious.

Each rod and main bearing in the bottom end is individually custom assembled to THAT perticular engine. No two are alike. Honda does this so the engine is perfectly balanced and lasts forever.

The Americans just slam the engines together on an assembly line as fast as they can. It works, but not as long as a japanese car. It's just pure mehcanics. Also Honda uses forged steel crankshafts, as opposed to cast steel, like the americans.

It's stuff like that that gave Honda the reputation it has. They didn't HAVE To build their cars like that. They went the extra mile because they wanted to have a product they could stand behind.

[1979]

Originally Posted by Bydand

I have had several American vehicles that have made it past the 300k mark quite easily. Right now am driving an 89 with 280k on it 140 miles round trip every day. Good old American Iron made right in Flint, Michigan. Best was a 77 Mercury Cougar that I sold with 200k+ miles on it and the guy I sold it to ran it for 5 years and another 150k miles before the body wouldn't pass inspection anymore. I personally know of 8 Dodge Caravans that have made the 300k mark without major problems (usually a $1000 transmission job at 70k then good to go the rest of their lives.) One of which ran the original plugs and wires for 160k with nothing more than oil and filter (air and oil) changes.

American cars DO go well over the 300 or 400k mark on a regular basis.

You can keep dreaming. I have never heard anyone brag about the reliability of an American made car. And actually, it's not going to matter much, because the Big 3 are going. They might get their 25B from the Obama administration, but its only life support while they die a slow....and agonizing death....once they lost the market, they lost if for good. Unless, they go non-union and slash prices by about 40%....maybe.

[f_m]

They should also spend more time focusing on engineering. Mostly they are marketing and sales companies selling a product. There is a reason companies compete in Formula 1 racing and other types of engineering challenges, so they can learn. Even when Diamler owned Chrysler, they wanted the US and the company to have more exposure to Formula 1. That is where R&D is tested out.

[ryanek9freak]

Where do you think Honda tested all of the technology that's used in it's cars today?

[f_m]

Originally Posted by ryanek9freak

Where do you think Honda tested all of the technology that's used in it's cars today?

That's the point, they used Formula 1 and Indycar, MotoGP etc... to design engines. Part of the reason they have engines for every market (lawn mowers, jet engines, etc...). None of the Big 3 participate in Formula 1, in the past Ford, and the others may have. They even gave up Indycar.

[JTraik]

Originally Posted by ryanek9freak

Have any of you guys actually been inside a Honda engine? The way they are engineered is nothing short of genious.

Each rod and main bearing in the bottom end is individually custom assembled to THAT perticular engine. No two are alike. Honda does this so the engine is perfectly balanced and lasts forever.

Listen to you drivel, "Each rod and main bearing in the bottom end is individually custom assembled to THAT perticular engine" What the hell does that mean lol... can I get one of the assembly line worker's signature on my bearing caps? I got news for you, all engines are internally balanced... you sound like one of those ricer kids who slaps on a cold air intake and then gushes about all the bits and pieces of information they hear about the engine.

Originally Posted by ryanek9freak

The Americans just slam the engines together on an assembly line as fast as they can. It works, but not as long as a japanese car. It's just pure mehcanics. Also Honda uses forged steel crankshafts, as opposed to cast steel, like the americans.

Did you know that the Americans taught the Japanese how to mass produce? Whats pure mechanics?.... what does that even mean? Are you an engineer? Whens the last time you have seen a snapped crank outside of a stock application?

[JTraik]

Originally Posted by 1979

You can keep dreaming. I have never heard anyone brag about the reliability of an American made car. And actually, it's not going to matter much, because the Big 3 are going. They might get their 25B from the Obama administration, but its only life support while they die a slow....and agonizing death....once they lost the market, they lost if for good. Unless, they go non-union and slash prices by about 40%....maybe.

You must have a hard time seeing...

Originally Posted by JTraik

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[ryanek9freak]

Originally Posted by JTraik

Listen to you drivel, "Each rod and main bearing in the bottom end is individually custom assembled to THAT perticular engine" What the hell does that mean lol... can I get one of the assembly line worker's signature on my bearing caps? I got news for you, all engines are internally balanced... you sound like one of those ricer kids who slaps on a cold air intake and then gushes about all the bits and pieces of information they hear about the engine.



Did you know that the Americans taught the Japanese how to mass produce? Whats pure mechanics?.... what does that even mean? Are you an engineer? Whens the last time you have seen a snapped crank outside of a stock application?

Just the other day on a Saturn Astra. There's your answer.

And yes, Honda engines ARE built that way. I've assembled many of them, both automotive and marine. Each rod journal has a letter stamped into it, and there is a 5 digit number combination on the block end. You cross reference the letter and number and you get a "color" on a chart.

Each color, red, yellow, green or brown, is a different bearing clearance.

Like I said, no two engines, even ones that are right next to each other at the factory, are assembled alike, with regards to bearing clearances.

Did I answer your stupid questions?

[f_m]

Originally Posted by JTraik

You must have a hard time seeing...

This list isn't that useful, because it's like seeing all the people that live over 100 years old. There are always a few, but most people are interested in the typical life expectancy. Since the typical life expectancy for humans has been going up, that is more important to people than the few that are beyond that range. Typical is typical. What is the typical life expectancy for a car? That's what people want to know. It's a percentage issue, not an outlier issue. Just like quality is a percentage issue.

Many places teach the Toyota Production System and other related manufacturing terms and processes. That was the purpose of Nummi, for GM to learn it.

[drjones96]

Originally Posted by f_m

That's the point, they used Formula 1 and Indycar, MotoGP etc... to design engines. Part of the reason they have engines for every market (lawn mowers, jet engines, etc...). None of the Big 3 participate in Formula 1, in the past Ford, and the others may have. They even gave up Indycar.

F1 is to Europe and European Manufacturers (and Honda) what NASCAR is to the US and the Big 3.

NASCAR is just a cheaper billboard to advertise....by a long shot. Plus they are successful at it.

Imagine if the big 3 wanted to just jump into F1 in a couple of years. It could be a decade before they got their first win because they are so far behind the curve. Not just in engine developement...but technology for the event across the board.

Toyota jumped into NASCAR Cup series last year. They sucked. Pretty much across the board they were terrible. They were only as good as they were because they used the Truck series as a springboard to develop their technology. They were sucessful this year because they were able to get Joe Gibbs Racing to drive Toyotas!