congress to dictate what you drive (vehicles, 2009, auto, fuel)

[sailordave]

Harkin wants ethanol measures in climate bill | DesMoinesRegister.com | The Des Moines Register
Sen. Tom Harkin said he wants Congress to use a climate bill to force auto companies to make new cars and trucks capable of running on 85 percent ethanol as well as conventional gasoline.

"We own the automobile companies. Why not? I think that will be an easy one," Harkin said Thursday, referring to the government interests in Chrysler and General Motors.

Energy Secretary Steven Chu said recently that all new vehicles should be equipped to run on E85. GM, Chrysler and Ford have been voluntarily making some E85-capable cars and trucks for years but have resisted being required to fit all cars for the fuel.

[sailordave]

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/***/byfueltype.htm (broken link)
comparison of gasoline and e85 mpg from the exact same vehicles.

[Grandpa Pipes]

Originally Posted by sailordave

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/***/byfueltype.htm (broken link)
comparison of gasoline and e85 mpg from the exact same vehicles.

link not found

[sailordave]

I'll try again

[sailordave]

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/***/byfueltype.htm (broken link)

[sailordave]

Looks like it won't allow the exact link. just go to www.fueleconomy.gov and look for alternative fuels.

[minibrings]

Id rather give my money to an American farmer growing corn for ethanol than to someone in the Middle East that potentially hates me.
I dunno.. is it wrong to feel that way?

[southernnaturelover]

I think most vehicles now are already capable of running on E85, although I doubt very many people use actually use it. A family member bought a new Lucerne a few weeks ago and I noticed the "flex fuel" logo on it.

[caution]

Originally Posted by minibrings

Id rather give my money to an American farmer growing corn for ethanol than to someone in the Middle East that potentially hates me.
I dunno.. is it wrong to feel that way?

You're free to have that opinion, but I disagree. The sheer lunacy of burning food in my gas tank driving up prices of everything else corn is connected to is just maddening.

How about we quit playing with corn, solar, batteries, tidal and wind and get on with the hard, expensive work of finding a real alternative. The only reason why we're not breaking through is a combination of laziness, brain drain and lobby groups with elected officials by the short hairs.

We need a real advance in energy and I'd be happy to see my tax money spent on subsidizing the risk associated with finding it now. Then the market can really screw over the 4th century nutjobs who like to pretend they matter.

[sailordave]

Originally Posted by minibrings

Id rather give my money to an American farmer growing corn for ethanol than to someone in the Middle East that potentially hates me.
I dunno.. is it wrong to feel that way?

It is when you consider it takes more fuel to grow and harvest corn than the fuel that is made from corn. Combine that with the amount of vehicles on the road in this country and you realize that there isn't enough corn fields in this country to fill this need. Then compound that with the extreme rise in the cost of food for people around the world if such a plan was put into place. You want to cut the amount of money we send to the middle east then have congress open up drilling off the coast of Florida and California as well as drilling in other parts of Alaska. Also have more refineries built since the last refinery built was 30 years ago. They could even the playing field for American oil companies by making an agreement that foreign oil companies must adhere to US OSHA and EPA standards before exporting their oil into our country. If foreign nations had to meet OSHA and EPA standards then they'd have to also raise their prices and give US oil companies a fighting chance. My dad retired from the oil industry. He's also traveled outside the US and was horrified by some of the oil rigs run in other parts of the world. Enviromentalist would go into shock if they saw the oil rigs run by some foreign nations. Pits dug into the soil and filled with waste oil and chemicals was common.