hybrids (idle, credit, mileage, engine)

[Perkins Well]

Originally Posted by RedNC

Not when you can go down to the local VW dealer and get a TDI which will cost less and deliver better "real world" fuel mileage than any hybrid. And you will easily get over 200k miles out of it and never have to worry about batteries other than the occasional battery that starts it.

The TDI only gets great highway mileage. In the city/suburbs type of driving that most people do, the hybrid is far superior. I'm averaging 59.6 MPG combined in my 2010 Prius.

The TDI also emits more harmful junk into the air than the gasoline Jetta.

[hoffdano]

Originally Posted by Steve-o

Hybrids are for suckers, end of story. Theyre not as economical as everyone thinks they are, and the damage they do to the environment just to make their stupid batteries has been said to be more damaging than most other vehicles on the road. The best route to take is a small gas or diesel engine in a lighter car if you TRULY want to be green. Because in the end, when the car is broken down and scrapped, only ONE battery will go into the earth from a normal car, hybrids will have to dump several more. Gee, how "earth-friendly".

Not as economical as everyone thinks? From what I read - Prius owners regularly get high 40s and 50s in the city. That is damned good. A friend has a 3 yr. old Escape hybrid and he regularly gets over 30 MPG in city driving. Excellent for a small SUV.

As for batteries in the earth - all current hybrid batteries are recycled, not thrown away.

And the hazards involved in making the batteries has been overstated - the nickel mines damage occurred years ago - before hybrids existed. Those sites are NOT causing any damage today. Current and future manufacturing is "clean" and will be more so.

FWIW - I don't own a hybrid and simply follow the technology - to see how far they can take it.

[Perkins Well]

Originally Posted by Steve-o

Hybrids are for suckers, end of story. Theyre not as economical as everyone thinks they are, and the damage they do to the environment just to make their stupid batteries has been said to be more damaging than most other vehicles on the road. The best route to take is a small gas or diesel engine in a lighter car if you TRULY want to be green. Because in the end, when the car is broken down and scrapped, only ONE battery will go into the earth from a normal car, hybrids will have to dump several more. Gee, how "earth-friendly".

This has been debunked numerous times.

Prius vs. HUMMER: Exploding the Myth - PriusChat Forums

It's not just about being "green." Some of us just want to support the technology and get 55+ MPG in the city.

My company gave me $4000 to get a Prius. Many other corporations do the same.

[Perkins Well]

Originally Posted by everwinter

Wrong on all accounts.

New Price - Prius $22,000, Jetta $22,270

EPA gas mileage - Prius 51/48, Jetta 30,37
From regular drivers - Prius 38/60, Jetta 34/55

Reliability for the Prius is excellent & on other message boards there are threads of 200,000 mile club with Prius still going strong.

Jetta, I admit I have not looked at the reliability for, but I've never seen a Volkswagen rated with good reliability.

Good post, but the Prius gets better mileage in the city compared to the highway. More like 50-60 city, 45-55 highway.

[Steve-o]

Originally Posted by hoffdano

Not as economical as everyone thinks? From what I read - Prius owners regularly get high 40s and 50s in the city. That is damned good.

MPGs for the Prius are NOT great, especially compared with cars overseas. There are standard petrol cars in the UK that get 60+ mpg! Even the ol Geo Metros would get upwards of 50mpg and not require battery materials to be mined in Canada, flown elsewhere for processing, then flown to Japan, then shipped back to the USA for sale. Completely uneconomical! Funny how Toyota NEVER mentions that. Funnier still was my old, beat up Toyota Paseo with a 1.5L that, even with 130K miles on the odo, would still kick out almost 40 mpg on the highway and over 30 in the city.

[Steve-o]

Originally Posted by Perkins Well

This has been debunked numerous times.

Prius vs. HUMMER: Exploding the Myth - PriusChat Forums

It's not just about being "green." Some of us just want to support the technology and get 55+ MPG in the city.

My company gave me $4000 to get a Prius. Many other corporations do the same.

I dont see any links to their proclamations on that thread. Top magazines and auto shows have shown the processes involved in building a Prius, and theyre hardly economical. In one totally off-the-wall episode of Top Gear, they even drove a Prius on a racetrack at full throttle where it averaged 17 laughable mpgs. I know, I know, theyre not meant for racetracks, but it just goes to show that petrol engines, especially nowadays, are more economical than hybrids if theyre developed properly.

[Perkins Well]

Originally Posted by Steve-o

I dont see any links to their proclamations on that thread. Top magazines and auto shows have shown the processes involved in building a Prius, and theyre hardly economical. In one totally off-the-wall episode of Top Gear, they even drove a Prius on a racetrack at full throttle where it averaged 17 laughable mpgs. I know, I know, theyre not meant for racetracks, but it just goes to show that petrol engines, especially nowadays, are more economical than hybrids if theyre developed properly.

You didn't scroll down very far. haha

http://www.pacinst.org/topics/integr...r_vs_prius.pdf

Toyota factory | Mail Online

Prius easily beats Hummer in life-cycle energy use, “Dust to Dust” report has no basis in fact « Climate Progress

http://www.rmi.org/images/PDFs/Trans...DustToDust.pdf

Tips for new car shoppers, drivers and owners. Prius Versus HUMMER: Exploding the Myth - The Car Connection

Hybrid Battery Toxicity | Hybrid Cars

Mr. Green's Web-Only Mailbag - November/December 2007 - Sierra Magazine - Sierra Club

[Packersnut21]

This maybe be a bit off topic but aren't the batteries covered under the warranty?

[Perkins Well]

Originally Posted by Packersnut21

This maybe be a bit off topic but aren't the batteries covered under the warranty?

15-year/150,000-mile Hybrid-related Component Coverage (applicable states are: CA, MA, NY, NJ, VT, CT, ME, NM and RI) with the exception of the hybrid battery. The hybrid battery is warranted for 10 years/150,000 miles.

http://pressroom.toyota.com/pr/tms/t...pdf?ncid=12067

[Drover]

Some of these mileage claims are dubious at best. It used to be people exaggerated about how much horsepower their cars have. I guess that's passé and now the en vogue thing is to exaggerate about is fuel economy.