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Old 01-19-2010, 06:33 PM
NSX
 
877 posts, read 2,163,868 times
Reputation: 714

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Quote:
Originally Posted by car54 View Post
I agree.

This thread is all about the Detroit diehards praying that this Toyota flaw will be the salvation of the domestic car companies...two of which wouldn't even exist today if not for massive infusions of tax dollars.

Don't hold your breath(s)!
I think johnfrisco was kidding when he said that. If not, it's pretty sad. You're right about GM and Chrysler, but Ford is healthier than ever (take a look at all of the latest news and $/share appreciation). Quality is up to Toyota levels, and the vehicles are much more fun.

Hopefully Toyota's loss in market share will also result in some loss of arrogance from them.
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Old 01-19-2010, 06:47 PM
 
Location: The beautiful Rogue Valley, Oregon
7,785 posts, read 18,780,877 times
Reputation: 10783
In the market to buy a wagon/cute ute size vehicle, and I've driven: GM (Equinox, Terrain), Ford (Edge, Escape), Jeep, Subarus (Forester and Outback), Honda (Element, CRV), VW (Tiguan, Jetta Sportwagon TDI), Nissan, Mitsu, Suzuki, Hyundai, Toyota (Venza and RAV4).

I chose the Toyota Rav4, which I pick up from the dealer Thursday. By FAR the best build quality and especially drivability and for a good price.

Do I think the problem in some vehicles is just a floor mat? No, I'd be willing to bet it's also an ECU firmware problem, fairly easily fixed, as well as an issue with the Smart Key (which I'd have preferred NOT to have, but it was on everything I looked at).
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Old 01-19-2010, 07:14 PM
 
4,709 posts, read 12,648,776 times
Reputation: 3813
Quote:
Originally Posted by NSX View Post
I think johnfrisco was kidding when he said that. If not, it's pretty sad. You're right about GM and Chrysler, but Ford is healthier than ever (take a look at all of the latest news and $/share appreciation). Quality is up to Toyota levels, and the vehicles are much more fun.

Hopefully Toyota's loss in market share will also result in some loss of arrogance from them.

Ford borrowed $23 billion in 2006...putting up ALL their assets as collateral. That's the only reason Ford isn't on life support with the other two. Ford is in hock up their eyeballs.

I hope they make it though...we can't quit making everything here in the U.S.!
(plus I inherited a few thousand shares of Ford that I'd hate to have to wallpaper my garage with!)

How is Toyota "arrogant"? Have they run ads gloating over the Big-3's troubles? Arrogance is not part of the Japanese psyche. Ever watch a baseball game in Japan? It's a different game altogether...things like running up the score on an opponent is considered "unsportsmanlike".
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Old 01-20-2010, 07:22 AM
NSX
 
877 posts, read 2,163,868 times
Reputation: 714
Quote:
Originally Posted by car54 View Post
Ford borrowed $23 billion in 2006...putting up ALL their assets as collateral. That's the only reason Ford isn't on life support with the other two. Ford is in hock up their eyeballs.

I hope they make it though...we can't quit making everything here in the U.S.!
(plus I inherited a few thousand shares of Ford that I'd hate to have to wallpaper my garage with!)

How is Toyota "arrogant"? Have they run ads gloating over the Big-3's troubles? Arrogance is not part of the Japanese psyche. Ever watch a baseball game in Japan? It's a different game altogether...things like running up the score on an opponent is considered "unsportsmanlike".
I have great respect for the Japanese culture, so I guess I should have clarified my post. I think it's more Toyota North America and the dealerships with the arrogance. Toyota dealerships are extremely snobby around here and salespeople have been known to drive away potential buyers with their rudeness. I have several colleagues who have went right from the Toyota dealership to the Ford one because they felt snubbed.

Also, Toyota is making buyers "qualify" to buy their new sportscar, the Lexus LF-A. Not qualify financially, but the dealership has to decide that you're the "right" type of person before you can purchase the car. If that's not arrogance, I'm not sure what is...
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Old 01-20-2010, 07:35 AM
 
132 posts, read 429,594 times
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I wonder why people still purchase GM vehicles??
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Old 01-20-2010, 07:47 AM
 
78,016 posts, read 60,232,230 times
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The quality gap has closed, people tend to pay a bit of a premium for Toyota's due to their past history and that ties into them holding their value pretty well too.

Basically, we the consumer are in the envious position where a number of manufacturers are building a variety of quality vehicles.
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Old 01-20-2010, 07:51 AM
NSX
 
877 posts, read 2,163,868 times
Reputation: 714
Quote:
Originally Posted by BCBGirl View Post
I wonder why people still purchase GM vehicles??
Because they make vehicles with soul, one thing Toyota has never had, and certain buyers want more than just an appliance to get from point A to B.

What does Toyota produce that even comes close to the Corvette? Nothing.
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Old 01-20-2010, 07:53 AM
 
78,016 posts, read 60,232,230 times
Reputation: 49415
Quote:
Originally Posted by BCBGirl View Post
I wonder why people still purchase GM vehicles??
I bought a GM about a year and a half ago. Z06 corvette which pretty much destroys other sports cars unless you spend twice as much on them. (And they hold their value.)

I also bought a Toyota Highlanger about a year ago and am very happy with it as it was the only car out there that met my specific needs.

Too many people tied into brand loyalty and team mindset. Things change, every company makes some good vehicles and some not as good.

There is a wealth of quality information out there, make your own choices and good luck.
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Old 01-20-2010, 07:55 AM
 
Location: United States
2,497 posts, read 7,461,826 times
Reputation: 2270
I've also heard of a decline in Toyota's quality. I would still own a Toy over a GM product though.
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Old 01-20-2010, 08:37 AM
NSX
 
877 posts, read 2,163,868 times
Reputation: 714
I wonder how many vehicles Toyota is still pumping out with faulty throttle mechanisms.

I'd hate to spend $350K on the new LF-A and have the gas get stuck at 202mph
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