News, Missing French jet hit thunderstorms over Atlantic. (Boeing)

['M']

Originally Posted by oldtoiletsmkgdflrpots

Can someone explain how a plane that size can disappear? With the technology we have today how is it possible?

JFK Jr's plane evidently crashed on the water, and at first they had a difficult time finding the debris...it seems similar to this jetliner's scenario.

[jhlcomp]

You can not compare the two. JFK's was a small aircraft (a single engine Cessna?? not sure) in shallow water. Sorry - just no comparison at all - not even close.

[South Range Family]

This is a picture of an ELT (emergency location transmitter). It is activated by salt water. The silver rod on the side is an antenna that needs to be inserted into the end of the unit. It is only about 20 inches long. I don't know how how effective it would be without the antenna. My airline carries 2 on every A320. One is on the class divider behind the last 1st class seat. The other is located on the wall behind the last row of seats. They are both on the left hand side of the aircraft. https://commerce.honeywell.com/wcsst...SE_800x800.jpg


This is a picture of the black box. There are two on board. One records flight data. The other records noises in the cockpit. The gold colored cylinder on the front is the pinger. The pinger is activated by water, and is slightly larger than a shotgun shell. We change the pinger battery on a regular basis. http://www.aviationexplorer.com/av_i...t_recorder.jpg


Those are some very small objects that they are trying to find in the entire South Atlantic.

There are no radar stations out there. There are no air traffic controllers out there. They were on their own. Voice communication is through HF radios. Planes sometimes have to transmit 2, or 3 times before somebody hears them on HF.

VHF radios are used over land. They are for shorter ranges. Here's a weird thing. When I call ground control at an airport, they can hear me, and I can hear them. I can hear them when they are talking to other airplanes, but I cannot always hear the other airplane. It depends on how close they are to me, where their antennas are located on the fuselage, and how powerful their transmitter is.

It will take our spy satellites, and our submarines to help them locate what they are looking for. It might be mentioned in passing, or it might not be mentioned at all, but it IS how they will be found.

***One other thing I forgot to mention*** The ELT is a radio transmitter. It needs to be on the surface to operate. The black box pingers send out sound for a sonar signal. The pingers are how they will locate them.

[GCSTroop]

I see that all, if not most, of the vertical stabilizer was recovered. That is a huge find, in my opinion. In fact, as soon as I saw that, I was reminded of the aircraft that crashed in Queens shortly after 9/11. If memory serves me correctly that was an A300. I have not worked on the A330, and to be honest, I'm not very familiar with it at all but my general understanding is that structurally it is very similar to the A300 except that it is 'lengthened.'

The cause of the A300 crash in Queens, again if memory serves me correctly, was the first officer's repeated overcorrection of the rudder to try and overcome turbulence. Eventually, the rudder snapped right off...

Of course, the vertical fin could have snapped off on impact but that's for the investigators to determine. And, based on the flight level they were flying at, I would imagine that the crash well exceeded the structural integrity of the aircraft and the vertical fin may have broken off as a result of that.

Nonetheless, it's a good find in what has been a rather dismal investigation thus far. I have a lot of confidence they'll find the 'black boxes' but it's not going to be easy.

[Magnum Mike]

Originally Posted by GCSTroop

I see that all, if not most, of the vertical stabilizer was recovered. That is a huge find, in my opinion. In fact, as soon as I saw that, I was reminded of the aircraft that crashed in Queens shortly after 9/11. If memory serves me correctly that was an A300. I have not worked on the A330, and to be honest, I'm not very familiar with it at all but my general understanding is that structurally it is very similar to the A300 except that it is 'lengthened.'

The cause of the A300 crash in Queens, again if memory serves me correctly, was the first officer's repeated overcorrection of the rudder to try and overcome turbulence. Eventually, the rudder snapped right off...

Of course, the vertical fin could have snapped off on impact but that's for the investigators to determine. And, based on the flight level they were flying at, I would imagine that the crash well exceeded the structural integrity of the aircraft and the vertical fin may have broken off as a result of that.

Nonetheless, it's a good find in what has been a rather dismal investigation thus far. I have a lot of confidence they'll find the 'black boxes' but it's not going to be easy.

Yes, the aircraft you're talking about that was involved in the Quees crash in November of 2001 was an Airbus A300. The second officer was trying to trying to over-correct the yaw that resulted from wake turbulence from a Boeing 747 that was a few miles ahead of the A300, which snapped the vertical stabilizer off, another unfortunate tragedy.

[wheelsup]

Originally Posted by Magnum Mike

Yes, the aircraft you're talking about that was involved in the Quees crash in November of 2001 was an Airbus A300. The second officer was trying to trying to over-correct the yaw that resulted from wake turbulence from a Boeing 747 that was a few miles ahead of the A300, which snapped the vertical stabilizer off, another unfortunate tragedy.

Where do you get this stuff? It was the F/O and wake turbulence doesn't make you yaw it makes you roll. Seriously stop. You're making yourself look like an idiot.

[Magnum Mike]

Originally Posted by wheelsup

Where do you get this stuff? It was the F/O and wake turbulence doesn't make you yaw it makes you roll. Seriously stop. You're making yourself look like an idiot.

Why are you making a big deal out of every comment that I make about aviation? I wish you'd stop those critical comments and at least be civil about it. Nobody's going to be 100% right with everything they post on here.

Okay, so it was a mistake on my part, is that a reason to call somebody an "idiot"?

If you can't exchange messages in a civil way, then don't bother replying to my messages.

[wheelsup]

Originally Posted by Magnum Mike

Why are you making a big deal out of every comment that I make about aviation? I wish you'd stop those critical comments and at least be civil about it. Nobody's going to be 100% right with everything they post on here.

No they won't but you're 100% wrong. You bash the media for getting stuff wrong yet look at the stuff you write.

[AlfredB1979]

Originally Posted by njkate

I totally rule that out, because if it was a terrorist group they would be boasting about it by now..they want you to KNOW what they are capable of

This became 100% the rule when?

[njkate]

Originally Posted by AlfredB1979

This became 100% the rule when?

I said I totally rule out terrorism, I'm entitled to my own thoughts & opinions thank you very much!
Was not at all saying it was some 100% rule, that said it usually doesn't take long after some horrid act of terrorism for the group responsible to let the world know