Baltimore VERY Dangerous. Do NOT live there (Columbia, Bethesda: apartments, to rent)

[mrboltonman]

It seems like a lot of the people murdered are the lower class living in the ghetto and that's why a lot of people think that they are because of criminal activity. I would think that some are random. Add that on top of the murders that are obviously random and the rate has to be high.

[westsideboy]

We know some are random, that Hopkins student, that guy at the bus stop. Those are just the ones that jump to my mind in the last year from this forum. I have no doubt there are many more, that don't get the PR.

Even 6 random murders a year would equate to a 1-100,000 chance of random violent murder/death/kill. I am sure this number would be MORE than enough to put the city out of the running for inclusion in a "lowest random murder rate" list.

[NCOriolesfan]

Originally Posted by westsideboy

Now, now, remember the bet is that "Baltimore has one of the LOWEST RANDOM MURDER rates in the country." Do you believe that? I don't.

Look at all those Craigslist hookers getting killed in New York. That is random. Columbine? That crazy white dude in Salt Lake City shooting up the mall?
That doesn't happen in Baltimore. Give me that list of random killings in Baltimore. You can't.

[KLynch10]

I was talking to some people from southern California last night who were in town promoting the volleyball event, and they said they couldn't believe how nice Baltimore is. It's cause of stupid threads like this and the wire that the mindset exists. All cities have their problems but Baltimore has some beautiful scenery and damn cool stuff. It you take the amount of people passing through this city every year, which has to be close to 10 million (3 mill from the stadiums alone) and the amount of violent crimes to regular people, it's an extremely low percentage.

[westsideboy]

Originally Posted by NCOriolesfan

Look at all those Craigslist hookers getting killed in New York. That is random. Columbine? That crazy white dude in Salt Lake City shooting up the mall?
That doesn't happen in Baltimore. Give me that list of random killings in Baltimore. You can't.

Just because the killings aren't "high profile" on the national scene doesn't mean they don't exist. In fact, as I said before, it is the opposite in Baltimore, everyone just assumes every black guy found dead must of have been "asking for it" somehow, rather than waiting for the details to emerge.

As for finding a list of random killings, your right, I doubt it exists. I could try to research every one of the 200+ odd murders each year in the city and try to tease out the random from the motivated, but it isn't worth the time.

Just remember what we are discussing, it isn't the overall ratio of motivated/unmotivated murders, or risk of random crime. It is your claim that "Baltimore has one of the lowest random murder rates in the country" Given the high murder rate overall for the city when compared to the rest of the cities in the country ( I will estimate B-more's murder rate at roughly 1 per 3,000 residents), it is incredibly unlikely, almost bordering on absurd, that Baltimore would rank well in this catagory. Remember even if just 6 of the 200+ murders are random that would put the random murder rate at 1 in 100,000 which is higher than the overall murder rate for many cities in the country.

I also don't see even the most Pro-Baltimore posters here backing you up. I understand you like the city, but come on, this claim is too over the top, even with rose-colored glasses on.

[HandsUpThumbsDown]

Originally Posted by westsideboy

I also don't see even the most Pro-Baltimore posters here backing you up. I understand you like the city, but come on, this claim is too over the top.

I think you're busting him on verbage, WSB. The point has been made.

[westsideboy]

is good advise for me sometimes. Thanks.

[remstone]

Originally Posted by westsideboy

Remember even if just 6 of the 200+ murders are random that would put the random murder rate at 1 in 100,000 which is higher than the overall murder rate for many cities in the country.

Really? Name one city. I'll even make it easy for you:
Uniform Crime Reporting Statistics

The national average is between 5 and 6 (per 100k) and you think there are "many" cities below 1? Who's over-the-top now? The poster was making an interesting but unprovable claim. I'd like to back her up but my gut isn't able to provide those stats.

[westsideboy]

Originally Posted by remstone

Really? Name one city. I'll even make it easy for you:
Uniform Crime Reporting Statistics

The national average is between 5 and 6 (per 100k) and you think there are "many" cities below 1? Who's over-the-top now? The poster was making an interesting but unprovable claim. I'd like to back her up but my gut isn't able to provide those stats.

Well, here are some murder totals for 2009 as reported by law enforcement agencies in PA, MD, and VA, many of which are city police forces. Anything that says "0" means no murders, which would be a murder rate of 0 per 100,000 which is less than one. I say the results of this limited search include "many cities." and this is just 3 states out of 50. Thanks for the link.

Abington Twp (Montgomery Co) Police Dept PA 2
Aliquippa City Police Dept PA 5
Allentown City Police Dept PA 13
Altoona City Police Dept PA 1
Amity Twp (Berks Co) Police Dept PA 0
Aston Twp Police Dept PA 0
Baldwin Boro Police Dept PA 0
Bensalem Twp Police Dept PA 0
Berwick Boro Police Dept PA 0
Bethel Park Police Dept PA 1
Bethel Twp (Delaware Co) Police Dept PA 0
Bethleham Twp (Northampton Co) Police Dept PA 0
Bethlehem City (Northampton Co) Police Dept PA 1
Bloomsburg Town Police Dept PA 1
Boro Of State College Police Dept PA 0
Bristol Twp Police Dept PA 1
Buckingham Twp (Bucks Co) Police Dept PA 0
Butler City Police Dept PA 0
Butler Twp (Butler Co) Police Dept PA 1
Caln Twp Police Dept PA 0
Carlisle Boro Police Dept PA 1
Cecil Twp Police Dept PA 0
Center Twp (Beaver Co) Police Dept PA 2
Cheltenham Twp Police Dept PA 0
Chester City Police Dept PA 14
City Of Greensburg Police Dept PA 0
Coal Twp Police Dept PA 0
Coatesville City Police Dept PA 0
Colonial Regional Police Dept PA 0
Columbia Boro Police Dept PA 0
Cranberry Twp (Butler Co) Police Dept PA 0
Cumru Twp Police Dept PA 0
Derry Twp (Dauphin Co) Police Dept PA 0
Douglass Twp (Montgomery Co) Police Dept PA 0
Doylestown Twp Police Dept PA 0
Dunmore Boro Police Dept PA 0
East Brandywine Twp Police Dept PA 0
East Cocalico Twp Police Dept PA 0
East Hempfield Twp Police Dept PA 0
East Lampeter Twp Police Dept PA 0
East Norriton Twp Police Dept PA 0
East Pennsboro Twp Police Dept PA 0
East Whiteland Twp Police Dept PA 0
Easton City (Northampton Co) Police Dept PA 1
Easttown Twp (Chester Co) Police Dept PA 0
Elizabeth Twp (Allegheny Co) Police Dept PA 0
Elizabethtown Boro (Lancaster Co) Police Dept PA 0
Emmaus Boro Police Dept PA 0
Erie Police Dept PA 4
Exeter Twp (Berks Co) Police Dept PA 0
Fairview Twp (York Twp) Police Dept PA 1
Falls Twp (Bucks Co) Police Dept PA 0
Ferguson Twp (Centre Co) Police Dept PA 0
Forks Twp (Northampton Co) Police Dept PA 0
Franconia Twp Police Dept PA 0
Franklin Park Boro (Allegheny Co) Police Dept PA 0
Hampden Twp (Cumberland Co) Police Dept PA 0
Hampton Twp (Allegheny Co) Police Dept PA 0
Hanover Boro (York Co) Police Dept PA 0
Hanover Twp (Luzerne Co) Police Dept PA 0
Harrisburg City Police Dept PA 16
Harrison Twp (Allegheny Co) Police Dept PA 1
Hatfield Twp Police Dept PA 0
Haverford Twp Police Dept PA 1
Hazleton City Police Dept PA 2
Hermitage City Police Dept PA 0
Hilltown Twp Police Dept PA 0
Hopewell Twp (Beaver Co) Police Dept PA 0
Horsham Twp Police Dept PA 1
Indiana Boro Police Dept PA 0
Jeannette City Police Dept PA 0
Kingston Boro Police Dept PA 0
Lancaster City (Lancaster Co) Police Dept PA 9
Lancaster Township PA 1
Lansdale Boro Police Dept PA 0
Lansdowne Boro Police Dept PA 0
Lebanon City Police Dept PA 2
Lehigh Twp (Northampton Co) Police Dept PA 0
Logan Twp (Blair Co) Police Dept PA 0
Lower Allen Twp Police Dept PA 0
Lower Burrell City Police Dept PA 0
Lower Gwynedd Twp Police Dept PA 0
Lower Makefield Twp Police Dept PA 0
Lower Merion Twp Police Dept PA 0
Lower Moreland Twp Police Dept PA 0
Lower Paxton Twp Police Dept PA 0
Lower Pottsgrove Twp Police Dept PA 0
Lower Providence Twp Police Dept PA 0
Lower Salford Twp Police Dept PA 0
Lower Saucon Twp Police Dept PA 0
Lower Southampton Twp Police Dept PA 0
Manheim Twp (Lancaster Co) Police Dept PA 0
Manor Twp (Lancaster Co) Police Dept PA 0
Marple Twp Police Dept PA 0
Mccandless Twp Police Dept PA 1
Mckeesport City Police Dept PA 8
Middletown Twp (Bucks Co) Police Dept PA 0
Mifflin County Regional Police Dept PA 0
Monroeville Municipality Police Dept PA 0
Montgomery Twp (Montgomery Co) Police Dept PA 1
Moon Twp Police Dept PA 0
Mount Joy Twp Police Dept PA 0
Mt Lebanon Twp Police Dept PA 0
Muhlenberg Twp Police Dept PA 0
Munhall Boro Police Dept PA 0
Murrysville Municipality Police Dept PA 0
Nanticoke City Police Dept PA 1
Nether Providence Twp Police Dept PA 0
New Britain Twp (Bucks Co) Police Dept PA 0
New Kensington City Police Dept PA 0
Newberry Twp (York Co) Police Dept PA 0
Newton Twp (Delaware Co) Police Dept PA 0
Newtown Twp (Bucks Co) Police Dept PA 0
Norristown Boro Police Dept PA 10
North Codorus Twp Police Dept PA 0
North Huntingdon Twp Police Dept PA 0
North Lebanon Twp Police Dept PA 1
North Middleton Twp Police Dept PA 0
North Strabane Twp Police Dept PA 0
North Versailles Twp Police Dept PA 0
Northampton Twp (Bucks Co) Police Dept PA 1
Northeastern Berks Regional Police Dept PA 0
Northeastern Regional Police Dept PA 0
Northern York County Regional Police PA 0
Oil City Police Dept PA 0
Palmer Twp (Northampton Co) Police Dept PA 1
Patton Twp (Centre Co) Police Dept PA 0
Penn Hills Twp Police Dept PA 4
Penn Twp (York Co) Police Dept PA 0
Pennridge Regional Police Dept PA 0
Peters Twp (Washington Co) Police Dept PA 0
Philadelphia Police Dept PA 302
Pine-Bradfordwoods-Marshall Joint Police Dept PA 0
Pittsburgh PA 39
Plains Twp Police Dept PA 1
Plum Boro Police Dept PA 0
Plumstead Twp Police Dept PA 1
Plymouth Twp (Montgomery Co) Police Dept PA 0
Pocono Mountain Regional Police Dept PA 1
Pocono Twp Police Dept PA 0
Pottstown Boro (Montgomery Co) Police Dept PA 0
Pottsville City (Schuylkill Co) Police Dept PA 1
Radnor Twp Police Dept PA 0
Reading City (Berks Co) Police Dept PA 12
Richland Twp (Cambria Co) Police Dept PA 0
Ridley Twp Police Dept PA 1
Robinson Twp (Allegheny Co) Police Dept PA 0
Ross Twp (Allegheny Co) Police Dept PA 0
Rostraver Twp Police Dept PA 1
Salisbury Twp (Lehigh Co) Police Dept PA 0
Sandy Twp Police Dept PA 0
Scott Twp (Allegheny Co) Police Dept PA 0
Scranton City Police Dept PA 1
Sharon City (Mercer Co) Police Dept PA 2
South Fayette Twp Police Dept PA 0
South Park Twp Police Dept PA 0
Southwest Mercer County Regional Police Dept PA 0
Spring Garden Twp Police Dept PA 2
Spring Twp (Berks Co) Police Dept PA 2
Springettsberry Twp Police Dept PA 1
Springfield Twp (Delaware Co) Police Dept PA 0
Springfield Twp (Montgomery Co) Police Dept PA 1
St. Mary'S Boro Police Dept PA 0
Stroud Twp Police Dept PA 2
Susquehanna Twp (Dauphin Co) Police Dept PA 1
Swatara Twp (Dauphin Co) Police Dept PA 1
Towamencin Twp Police Dept PA 0
Tredyffrin Twp Police Dept PA 0
Uniontown City (Fayette Co) Police Dept PA 0
Upper Allen Twp Police Dept PA 0
Upper Chichester Twp Police Dept PA 0
Upper Darby Twp Police Dept PA 1
Upper Dublin Twp Police Dept PA 0
Upper Gwynedd Twp Police Dept PA 2
Upper Merion Twp Police Dept PA 0
Upper Moreland Twp Police Dept PA 0
Upper Providence Twp (Delaware) Police Dept PA 0
Upper Providence Twp (Montgomery) Police Dept PA 0
Upper Saucon Twp Police Dept PA 0
Upper Southampton Twp Police Dept PA 0
Upper St Clair Twp Police Dept PA 0
Upper Uwchlan Twp Police Dept PA 0
Uwchlan Twp Police Dept PA 0
Warminster Twp Police Dept PA 0
Warrington Twp (Bucks Co) Police Dept PA 0
Warwick Twp (Lancaster Co) Police Dept PA 0
Washington City (Washington Co) Police Dept PA 2
Washington Twp (Franklin Co) Police Dept PA 0
West Chester Boro Police Dept PA 1
West Deer Twp Police Dept PA 0
West Goshen Twp Police Dept PA 0
West Hempfield Twp Police Dept PA 0
West Hills Regional Police Dept PA 0
West Lampeter Twp Police Dept PA 0
West Manchester Twp Police Dept PA 0
West Mifflin Boro Police Dept PA 0
West Norriton Twp Police Dept PA 0
West Whiteland Twp Police Dept PA 0
Westtown/East Goshen Twps Police Dept PA 0
Whitehall Boro (Allegheny Co) Police Dept PA 0
Whitehall Twp (Lehigh Co) Police Dept PA 0
Whitemarsh Twp Police Dept PA 0
Whitpain Twp Police Dept PA 0
Wilkes Barre City Police Dept PA 10
Wilkinsburg Boro Police Dept PA 8
Williamsport City (Lycoming Co) Police Dept PA 2
Willistown Twp Police Dept PA 0
Wyomissing Boro Police Dept PA 0
Yeadon Boro Police Dept PA 0
York City Police Dept PA 10
York Twp Police Dept PA 2
Richland Township PA 0

Aberdeen Police Dept MD 1
Annapolis Police Dept MD 4
Anne Arundel County Police Department MD 12
Baltimore City Police Dept MD 238
Baltimore County Police Department MD 32
Bel Air Police Dept MD 0
Calvert MD 0
Cambridge City Police MD 0
Cecil County Sheriff Department MD 1
Charles County Sheriff Office MD 7
Cumberland Police Dept MD 1
Easton Police Dept MD 0
Elkton Police Dept MD 1
Frederick County Sheriff Department MD 4
Frederick Police Dept MD 1
Garrett County Sheriff Office MD 0
Greenbelt Police Dept MD 0
Hagerstown Police Dept MD 0
Harford County Sheriff Office MD 3
Havre De Grace Police Dept MD 0
Howard County Police Department MD 2
Hyattsville Police Dept MD 0
Laurel Police Dept MD 1
Montgomery County Police Department MD 13
Ocean Pines MD 0
Prince Georges County Police Department MD 86
Queen Anne'S County Sheriff Office MD 0
Salisbury Police Dept MD 2
St. Marys County Sheriff Department MD 0
Takoma Park Police Dept MD 0
Washington County Sheriff Department MD 0
Westminster Police Dept MD 0
Wicomico County Sheriff Department MD 3

Accomack County Sheriff Office VA 1
Albemarle County Police Department VA 0
Alexandria Police Dept VA 5
Amherst County Sheriff Office VA 0
Arlington County Police Department VA 2
Augusta County Sheriff Office VA 1
Bedford County Sheriff Office VA 1
Blacksburg Police Dept VA 0
Botetourt County Sheriff Office VA 0
Bristol Police Dept VA 0
Campbell County Sheriff Office VA 4
Caroline County Sheriff Office VA 0
Carroll County Sheriff Office VA 1
Charlottesville Police Dept VA 0
Chesapeake Police Dept VA 12
Chesterfield County Police Department VA 2
Christiansburg Police Dept VA 2
Colonial Heights Police Dept VA 0
Culpeper County Sheriff Office VA 0
Culpeper Town Police Dept VA 0
Danville Police Dept VA 8
Dinwiddie County Sheriff Department VA 3
Fairfax (City) Police Dept VA 0
Fairfax County Police Department VA 10
Falls Church Police Dept VA 0
Fauquier County Sheriff Office VA 2
Fluvanna County Sheriff Department VA 0
Franklin County Sheriff Office VA 2
Frederick County Sheriff Office VA 3
Fredericksburg Police Dept VA 2
Front Royal Police Dept VA 0
Gloucester County Sheriff Office VA 0
Halifax County Sheriff Department VA 2
Hampton Police Dept VA 11
Hanover VA 0
Harrisonburg Police Dept VA 0
Henrico County Police Dept VA 12
Henry County Sheriff Office VA 5
Herndon Police Dept VA 1
Hopewell Police Dept VA 4
Isle Of Wight County Sheriff Office VA 0
James City County Police Department VA 0
Leesburg Police Dept VA 2
Loudoun County Sheriff Office VA 2
Louisa County Sheriff Office VA 2
Lynchburg Police Dept VA 0
Manassas Park Police Dept VA 0
Manassas Police Dept VA 2
Martinsville Police Dept VA 0
Montgomery County Sheriff Office VA 2
Newport News Police Dept VA 20
Norfolk Police Dept VA 34
Orange County Sheriff Office VA 0
Petersburg Police Dept VA 6
Pittsylvania County Sheriff Office VA 1
Poquoson Police Dept VA 0
Portsmouth Police Dept VA 17
Powhatan County Sheriff Office VA 0
Prince George County Police Department VA 1
Prince William County Police Department VA 11
Radford Police Dept VA 1
Richmond (City) Bureau Of Police VA 37
Roanoke (City) Police Dept VA 9
Roanoke County Police Department VA 1
Rockingham County Sheriff Department VA 2
Salem Police Dept VA 0
Shenandoah VA 1
Spotsylvania County Sheriff Office VA 4
Stafford County Sheriff Office VA 8
Staunton Police Dept VA 2
Suffolk Police Dept VA 6
Tazewell County Sheriff Office VA 4
Vienna Police Dept VA 2
Virginia Beach Police Dept VA 18
Washington County Sheriff Office VA 1
Waynesboro Police Dept VA 0
Williamsburg Police Dept VA 1
Winchester Police Dept VA 0
Wise County Sheriff Office VA 0
York County Sheriff Office VA 1

[sl0622]

Baltimore (238) and Philly (302) are on par. The rest of that list is useless for comparison purposes. Not even Richmond or Pittsburgh can be considered comparable cities. (Good to see there were no murders in my teeny little home township of Buckingham, PA!)