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Old 09-28-2009, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by JMadison View Post
They didn't "leave the blight". They left the city. The remaining residents blighted it.

As for moving back to the cities. That's a bad idea.

The correct idea is to move the non-polluting industries out into the burbs in well designed complexes. Thus getting rid of the mess and traffic that concentrating everything into a central city creates.

The idea is to make everywhere look like upper class nieghbohoods, not return to the 'hood. DOH!
How could this idea possibly ease traffic woes? Seems like most of the horrible traffic is already in the congested burbs of the states. Very bad idea. Given the eventual rise of gas prices (Remember almost 4 bucks a gallon-it will be back); the smarter idea would be to centralize work places with good transportation options. The cities already have the infrastructure for that goal. Why create more sprawl?
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Old 09-28-2009, 01:09 PM
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Thanks all for a fascinating thread. My daughter is a senior at Loyola so over the last four years I have been able to visit and experience Baltimore. I love to take the walking history tours and experience various neighborhoods. She currently lives in Homeland.

Last spring, I saw a very different side of the city while spending a week with a group of 106 high schoolers from Connecticut who were working for Habitat for Humanity in Sandtown. We actually slept on the floor of a neighborhood school and left the neighborhood only one evening to attend an Orioles game.

I love reading all of your posts and learning more about the history of what I think is a very misunderstood city.
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Old 09-28-2009, 08:30 PM
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Default No legend

Something like that happened in Park Heights. There are many reasons for blight in Baltimore. Absentee-owned houses, often part of some unsettled estate or owned by a person who is institutionalized, are a big factor. Not in My Neighborhood talks about Pimlico in great detail. The origins of the current mess are these: Pimlico was in the midst of racial change when the 1978 riots came. As a result of the unrest, Jewish exodus accelerated. But so did remaining white Catholic. And African American . The latter was caused by the FHA introducing nothing-down mortgages that attracted a lower socio-economic group of blacks to Pimlico. Existing black homeowners, who belonged to a more middle-class group, fled to Liberty Road. To make things worse, the city and HUD dumped people from urban renewal areas to Pimlico.
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Old 09-29-2009, 07:44 AM
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Default When did Italians, Irish and Jews become white?

This, it seems, is a good time to introduce another dimension. Lots of ethnicities that today are regarded as white were not necessarily so just a few decades ago. There is a growing body of "whiteness" literature that tracks the gradual acceptance of Jews, the Irish and Italians. One of the leading academic theoreticians is David R. Roediger, whose books include How Race Survived U.S. History, The Wages of Whiteness and Towards the Abolition of Whiteness. Karen Brodkin is the author of How Jews Became White Folks: And What That Says About Race in America. Eric L. Goldstein, The Price of Whiteness: Jews, Race, and American Identity ; Noel Ignatiev, How the Irish Became White .
A practical example was Beverly Beach, near Annapolis in Anne Arundel County. “Membership limited to gentiles only,” a big sign declared at the entrance gate in the 1940s and 1950s. “Positively NO DOGS permitted.” Such juxtaposition – documented in several old photographs at the Jewish Historical Museum of Maryland -- was so common that people later claimed to remember that signs at Beverley Beach and elsewhere had actually said “No Jews, no dogs.” Jews were not the only excluded group. Italians also were among those not desired. “Our restrictions are more extensive than against the Jewish people only, and include gentiles of South European, African, Asiatic and Indian ancestry, again not because of any feeling of superiority but merely because of a desire for congeniality,” Beverley Beach club manager Edgar R. Kalb explained.

Last edited by barante; 09-29-2009 at 08:03 AM..
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Old 09-29-2009, 08:53 AM
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Originally Posted by barante View Post
Something like that happened in Park Heights. There are many reasons for blight in Baltimore. Absentee-owned houses, often part of some unsettled estate or owned by a person who is institutionalized, are a big factor. Not in My Neighborhood talks about Pimlico in great detail. The origins of the current mess are these: Pimlico was in the midst of racial change when the 1978 riots came. As a result of the unrest, Jewish exodus accelerated. But so did remaining white Catholic. And African American . The latter was caused by the FHA introducing nothing-down mortgages that attracted a lower socio-economic group of blacks to Pimlico. Existing black homeowners, who belonged to a more middle-class group, fled to Liberty Road. To make things worse, the city and HUD dumped people from urban renewal areas to Pimlico.
That is why I am only cautiously optimistic that Pimlico/lower Park Heights will ever be redeveloped.. They are making strides.. several large tracts of properties have been "bundled" together on Pimlico Road are being put out for redevelopment. The commercial core at Park Heights Ave and Coldspring is being quietly purchased by the City for what is being proposed as a new anchor grocery store with retail and possibly a library. Then you have the Race Track which, according to the City's Plan, could be redeveloped into thousands of units, retail space, and even some commercial office.. if the track is relocated. If all of this comes to pass, that will definately have an impact, but I still see the adjoining areas that are untouched by the redevelopment remaining. Unlike Canton and Patterson Park.. I dont see the spill over effect that has happended/happening in those areas which is likely due to their proximity to the Harbor and proximity to Downtown happening in the adjacent areas to the proposed redevelopments in Park Heights.These new developments in Pimlico/Park Heights could become "islands" unto themselves or "oasis" in the middle of the blight.

The second issue.. is what you just mention. Where are these folks going to go? Some may get incorporated into the new developments but Baltimore is running out of places to "displace in mass" people without disrupting other neighborhoods,.... that are stable or have been recently "revitalized". The City's block by block approach in park heights may prohibit this type of massive relocation. Moving into the County ,for some, may be out of the question due to cost and the issue of transportation.. so the City is still the more viable option for these residents.

I have read about some of the challenges occuring in East Baltimore around Hopkins.. some residents may be incorporated back into the development others are moving to NE Baltimore presumably to stay connected with their eastside roots and to access many of the current transit options that they currently use to get to/from work shopping etc. The challenge that I am hearing is that with every good element, you also have a bad one which often then shift some of their negative behaviors to their new digs. So redevelopment, displacement, and gentrification in the city become a shell game that is often difficult to master.

Baltimore has many challenges and opportunities and I still believe that it is making progress and better years are still ahead.
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Old 09-29-2009, 05:58 PM
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Default Two institutions

We moved from Union Square eleven years ago. Got rid of a wonderful, mansion-sized ante-bellum rowhouse (with a brick privy in the backyard) and bought a 1960s rancher with half an acre in Cheswolde. We are now downsizing and thinking of buying a 1960s condominium in Upper Park Heights. We are not Jewish but like all the amenities that the Jewish Community Center offers to community residents regardless of religion.
Pimlico will be a tough nut to crack in terms of redevelopment. But it can be done. The area is central, with easy car access to downtown plus the Metro and the interstates nearby. In fact landlords tell me that houses in good condition are in great demand by working families who, despite all the minuses, recognize the area's pluses.
I was one of the first residents of Coldspring New Town so I have been watching this corner of Northwest Baltimore for some 30 years. I sense a real possibility for redevelopment and stability. Key to the area above Northern Parkway are Orthodox families, many originally from New York or New Jersey. They are buying up aging ranchers from families who often built them themselves some 40-50 years ago and never moved away. Some of the ranchers are razed. In fact, we in Cheswolde live in a somewhat surreal world: While the rest of the country suffers from economic malaise, big new houses are being built in our community on speculation. All have sold.
The dilemma south of Northern Parkway is acute. But the solution is easier than the controversial relocation around the new Hopkins expansion sites in East Baltimore. That's because relatively few homeowners remain in Pimlico. Instead, much of the run-down housing is occupied by a revolving-door of rock-bottom renters with a plethora of social problems from drug addiction to mental illness. They keep moving constantly anyway. So while solving their problems is difficult, evicting them is not. They will simply become another neighborhood's problem, if large-scale redevelopment begins.
North of Northern Parkway the situation is easier. The changeover of the high school at Park Heights and Northern Parkway into a fire academy has strengthened that area. Today I noticed that the old Baltimore Hebrew University (which merged with and moved to Towson University) is surrounded with a fence. The building will be coming down and redeveloped.

Last edited by barante; 09-29-2009 at 06:09 PM..
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Old 09-30-2009, 09:01 AM
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Originally Posted by barante View Post
We moved from Union Square eleven years ago. Got rid of a wonderful, mansion-sized ante-bellum rowhouse (with a brick privy in the backyard) and bought a 1960s rancher with half an acre in Cheswolde. We are now downsizing and thinking of buying a 1960s condominium in Upper Park Heights. We are not Jewish but like all the amenities that the Jewish Community Center offers to community residents regardless of religion.
Pimlico will be a tough nut to crack in terms of redevelopment. But it can be done. The area is central, with easy car access to downtown plus the Metro and the interstates nearby. In fact landlords tell me that houses in good condition are in great demand by working families who, despite all the minuses, recognize the area's pluses.
I was one of the first residents of Coldspring New Town so I have been watching this corner of Northwest Baltimore for some 30 years. I sense a real possibility for redevelopment and stability. Key to the area above Northern Parkway are Orthodox families, many originally from New York or New Jersey. They are buying up aging ranchers from families who often built them themselves some 40-50 years ago and never moved away. Some of the ranchers are razed. In fact, we in Cheswolde live in a somewhat surreal world: While the rest of the country suffers from economic malaise, big new houses are being built in our community on speculation. All have sold.
The dilemma south of Northern Parkway is acute. But the solution is easier than the controversial relocation around the new Hopkins expansion sites in East Baltimore. That's because relatively few homeowners remain in Pimlico. Instead, much of the run-down housing is occupied by a revolving-door of rock-bottom renters with a plethora of social problems from drug addiction to mental illness. They keep moving constantly anyway. So while solving their problems is difficult, evicting them is not. They will simply become another neighborhood's problem, if large-scale redevelopment begins.
North of Northern Parkway the situation is easier. The changeover of the high school at Park Heights and Northern Parkway into a fire academy has strengthened that area. Today I noticed that the old Baltimore Hebrew University (which merged with and moved to Towson University) is surrounded with a fence. The building will be coming down and redeveloped.
Thanks for your insightful post.. I agree that progress particuliarly in upper Park Heights is occuring.. Bancroft Village Townhomes on Park Heights Ave is a testment to that community's resilence in maintain stable neighborhoods surrounding many of the synagogues. It is a mid range priced community that I believe is being developed by CHAI that you have mention is one of your posts.. and it looks like they are selling fairly well even in todays market.
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I do hope that development can trickle down to the lower end of Park Heights.. the area is "bookended" with positive activities. Druid Hills Park/Mondawmin on the south.. upper park heights on the north, Woodbury and Coldspring Newtown on the east and Ashburton and several transit hubs on the west.

The Social Security Administration's new offices near Reisterstown Plaza should be a huge benefit as well. I have heard that the MTA may be selling off portions of its ocean sized parking lots at Rogers Ave and W. Coldspring and Reisterstown Stations for transit oriented types of office, retail and residential development which should be a plus.

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Old 10-02-2009, 06:48 PM
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An interesting post that mirrors the history and plights of many an american city, my Philly is no exception.

For simple bullets;

Remember hindsight: someone highlighted studies of Whiteness. Interesting as so few people today seem to remember how Greeks, Irish, Italians and Jews were denigrated by Anglo-Saxon elites in cities originally. Those fractures seemed to heal in collective fear of more foriegn blacks and hispanics.

I guess what I am pointing out here is that everything is cyclical. It is true that racism is somewhat tied to the growth of suburbia but that can be and IS frequently overstated. Suburbia was growing well before the race riots and such. Denigrating suburbs does no good, look at Detroit for example.

As for the states of cities like Baltimore, well from what I see Baltimore seem okayyyyyyy. It's simliar to Philly but unlike Philly does not seem to have as robust, well rounded or influential an economy. Also Philly despite not being as wealthy or educated as Boston or DC on average still held on to a certain amount of wealthier whites the city is about half and half these days.
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Old 10-03-2009, 12:23 AM
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Default Suburbia in Baltimore context

Historically, suburbanization in Baltimore has been driven by two major factors: the economic benefit in moving out and race. A number of other forces were at work as well. They included the increased mobility of the wealthy segment of the population due to cars. Strong initial pushes toward suburbanization were the 1904 Great Fire and the fact that Baltimore, the seventh largest city, was without a sewer system until one was completed in stages by 1917. The low-lying areas of the city literally stank.
Antero Pietila's Not in My Neighborhood contains a detailed study of this. Let me deal first with the economic benefit aspect. After the city annexed in 1888 areas that contained the earliest suburbs, homeowners in the annex until 1910 were taxed one fourth the rate charged in the "old" city. This was a great early period of suburban growth. It accelerated in 1910 after a black lawyer's purchase of 1834 McCulloh Street raised such concerns about "Negro invasion" that the City Council enacted a law segregating each residential block according to the majority of residents. The law (or laws because several were struck down in courts) did not stop the expansion of West Baltimore's overcrowded black district. Enabling racial change was the fact that whites had abandoned many areas for reasons too complicated to explain here. The result was that the "white" neighborhoods on both sides of Pennsylvania Avenue had more uncoccupied houses -- some 1,400 altogether -- than any other of eight districts surveyed.
The second great suburbanization began with World War II. The cause was the war, as could be seen from the growth of Essex and Middle River, near the Glenn L. Martin bomber factories which employed 53,000 men and women. In 1944, after blacks crossed West Baltimore's customary racial demarcation line, white flight began. Feeding it was white families' ability to secure taxpayer-subsidized FHA loans or GI mortgages in the suburbs where no black housing was constructed. By contrast, no bank financing was available for blacks who had to get 100 percent financing at high cost from speculators known as blockbusters. The federal government aided the suburban exodus by financing the interstate highway system. It enabled the construction of beltways and made commuting easier. So again the reasons were a combination of economic factors and race.
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Old 10-04-2009, 07:55 AM
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Good point. Especially pointing out that in many times during history cities were always hard scrabble rough places to live, not to mention dirty. Particularly if you were a working class Irish or Italian ethnic among others.
It's really too bad that the peak of Afro American numbers in cities coincided with heavy deindustrilization, thus erasing the comparatively easy avenue to the middle class that doesn't exist in high numbers today.


Cities can attract new residents unbound by the past as long as they don't have children. Unfortunetly educating children in city public schools is unfavorable by comparison to sububrbs.
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