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I followed every game of the Milwaukee Braves ( via newspaper) ftom the mid 50's and went to a neoghbor's house if the Braves were on tv. ( lived in Minnesota, we didn't have a tv)
What else is unique about Spahn is that his 20 win seasons involved many innings pitched.
My favorite pitching staff was the 57 Braves with Spahn, Bob Buhl, and Lew Burdette.
------"Spahn and Sain and a day of rain"---
I believe that quote came from the manager of the Boston Braves when asked his pitching plans with a limited staff.
As a youngster, my favorite lefty was Whitey Ford. I feel that he did not win 300 games for two reasons: 2 years in the military and Casey Stengel's 5-man pitching rotation, which was uncommon in that era. As an 8-year starter under Stengel Ford averaged 15.5 wins. After Stengel's departure he won 99 games over the next 5 seasons.
I love Whitey as well Ridgerunner. 1961 was his year, 25-4. Sadly, his arm started to go in 1965 and by 1967 he was done. He could have pitched 5 more seasons with today's medical advancements. I wish people would consider that before you talk about who is the best ever. You have to take everything into consideration, from rotation strategy to health to time in the military. A lot of the old guys are being left out of discussions like this and shoudn't be.
Another great left hander with a very short career was Herb Score of the Cleveland Indians. He went 16-10 in his rookie season (1955) and struck out 245 batters.
His next year he went 20-9 .
Mickey Mantle called Herb score the best left handed pitcher he ever faced in the American League. Yogi Berra named Herb Score to his all time team.
In 1957, Herb Score took a line drive to the face breaking many bones and was never the same.
Herb Score said it actually was an arm injury after coming back that altered his motion and he lost his effectiveness.
Herb Score died last year on Nov 11.
RIP----------Herb Score.
( I realize such a short career is not an automatic bid for greatness, but I posted this more as a --------"what might have been"-----if not for the injuries )
Lefty Grove was definitely the best LHP ever. He was just as dominant as Sandy Koufax was, for a longer period of time. (His stats don't look as good because he pitched in a hitters' era in pretty good hitters' parks, unlike Koufax who had his best years in a pitchers' era in a big-time pitchers' park. Grove also played in the minors with the Baltimore Orioles for a number of years when he was a major league quality pitcher but the Orioles' owner Jack Dunn did not want to sell him to a major league club, so Grove missed some years that would have further boosted his win total. However, Grove's ERA was 48% better than the league average during his career, while Koufax' was "only" 31%, which is still spectacular.) Actually, Connie Mack used Grove as both his ace starter AND his closer, which is pretty damn amazing. Finally, Grove's career record is 300-141, a better winning percentage than any other 300 game winner (left-handed or right-handed).
My rankings for left-handed pitchers:
1) Robert "Lefty" Grove
2) Warren Spahn
3) Randy Johnson
4) Sandy Koufax
5) Steve Carlton
Honorable mentions: Carl Hubbell, Whitey Ford, Tom Glavine, Eddie Plank
Marmac is right on Herb Score. He had such SUCH a future ahead of him. The guy who hit the ball was the Yankees Gil McDougald. I've read a few stories about this incident and everything points to this; if Herb Score couldn't come back from this injury and play baseball again, McDougald would retire the day Score would announce his retirement. Sadly, Score was never the same; had to change his pitching motion, wasn't the same pitcher as a result, and eventually retired. McDougald, on the other hand, retired after only playing 10 seasons of ball. I'm not so sure the incident deflated him as well. He was picked up in the 1961 expansion draft by the Washington Senators, but retired instead. He was only 31 when he retired.
Marmac is right on Herb Score. He had such SUCH a future ahead of him. The guy who hit the ball was the Yankees Gil McDougald. I've read a few stories about this incident and everything points to this; if Herb Score couldn't come back from this injury and play baseball again, McDougald would retire the day Score would announce his retirement. Sadly, Score was never the same; had to change his pitching motion, wasn't the same pitcher as a result, and eventually retired. McDougald, on the other hand, retired after only playing 10 seasons of ball. I'm not so sure the incident deflated him as well. He was picked up in the 1961 expansion draft by the Washington Senators, but retired instead. He was only 31 when he retired.
I think the incident greatly affected McDougald. I've read that soon thereafter he told a teammate, "If he loses his vision I'll quit." He had a good year in '57 but his production tailed off dramatically after that. Up until then his stats would indicate that he was a potential HOFer. He had received MVP votes in 5 seasons and could play three infield positions. As for Score, I doubt that any other pitcher was better in the first 2 seasons.
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