Yankee's Payroll - Should America expect any less? (cards, ball, games)

[BringTheContent]

That book was a major flop. Regardless, A-Rod probably did use steroids as a Yankee, and in fact I would be shocked if he didn't. For all we know, he may be using HGH this morning. I don't put anything past any player.

I would be willing to bet that the number of players in MLB who used steroids was somewhere in the neighborhood of 80-85%.

As a group we'd be better off just debating things like payroll, since there isn't one fan here who can take the high road on the steroids argument. Every team had more than enough players who cheated, and you can be sure there are plenty who still are cheating.

[ditchlights]

Originally Posted by BringTheContent

So you correctly name six players, get one completely wrong, and of the six you got right three have been with the team for at least four years; and none of these players have brought the Yankees a world championship in the time they've been with the team. Yeah, this is really a horrible problem for the game. They keep buying championships, only they haven't won since 2000. Yep, this is a non-issue.

Thank you all for your input. There are some good discussions brewing.

Just to clarify the issue I intended to present with this thread. I am not saying that they buy championships. Once a team reaches the playoffs, I do believe it's anybody's game.

What is evident, though, is that in MLB, divisional play constitutes close to 50% of all teams' season games. So it is safe to say, if you dominate your division foes each and every year, your odds of making the postseason and going all the way are astronomical, since only 3 division winners and a wild card advance every year. The Yankees only divisional compitition almost every year is Boston, who are #4 on the payroll list. Coincidence, I think not.

Now, this occurs in every division to some extent, but none so as much as in the AL East. If you are a Yankee's fan, you probably consider this argument to be written by a whining hater. If you are a fan of ANY OTHER team, this argument may just make sense. That's OK though, as we humans are naturally biased.

[Lancet71]

Originally Posted by Upton

You actually believe A-Roid's story that he never used while a member of the Yankees? lol..I didn't think anyone, even Yankee fans, went for that.

Well, I guess if you'll be happy with a BOUGHT championship, a cheating third baseman shouldn't bother you either.

A-Rod took steroids while with Yankees, and as teen, claims new book

Even though i'm a Yankee fan Arod is not one of my favorites.I've always preferred more of a blur collar type guy like Swisher,Mattingly,or even a guy like Tex.I don't know if Arod was on anything while he was a Yankee but I do know that he isn't now,but he still puts up the numbers and if you want to be fair,then they should have released all the names.The fact is if you analyze all the Yankee games they never are favored by umps and even before Arod hit the HR, the first 2 pitches were out of the strike zone(they showed it on the fox pitch by pitch) and the third pitch he put over the right field fence.They also analyzed all the plays at second by the shortstop and on all others that day he at least touched the bag but not even close on that one.
As far as bought championship,if we had the same team as last year and acomplished this with Giambi,Pavano and others---would you complain then? We just traded their salaries for better players and even saved a few bucks.I agree with one of the previous posters. What if your team won with Bonds? Would that have been cheating? I'm sorry it's not the Yankees,so it must be okay!

[Lancet71]

Originally Posted by ditchlights

Thank you all for your input. There are some good discussions brewing.

Just to clarify the issue I intended to present with this thread. I am not saying that they buy championships. Once a team reaches the playoffs, I do believe it's anybody's game.

What is evident, though, is that in MLB, divisional play constitutes close to 50% of all teams' season games. So it is safe to say, if you dominate your division foes each and every year, your odds of making the postseason and going all the way are astronomical, since only 3 division winners and a wild card advance every year. The Yankees only divisional compitition almost every year is Boston, who are #4 on the payroll list. Coincidence, I think not.

Now, this occurs in every division to some extent, but none so as much as in the AL East. If you are a Yankee's fan, you probably consider this argument to be written by a whining hater. If you are a fan of ANY OTHER team, this argument may just make sense. That's OK though, as we humans are naturally biased.

Finally a somewhat valid point that I also previously stated.I am a Yankee fan and do agree.If we were in the AL Central or ML central or west our payroll could be much lower because of the weaker competition in our division and also competition in acquiring free agents.It's one thing going after talent but they have to mesh with the others.The Yankee scouts did a GREAT job when it came to who we should go after.A guy like Swisher was a great addition in the clubhouse and also for his versatility. If you look around the league most teams are about 50% free agent and 50% home grown when it comes to players and especially the larger market teams.Mid markets do well because they all receive revenue sharing $$$. The problem is the specific small market teams that don't put it back into their team.I would love for it to be a balanced playing field because our farm system has shown how good their development is in the past and present.The only problem is that without revenue sharing I could probably name about 10 teams that would do the same thing as the Expos----and disappear within the next 3 years.

[Lancet71]

Originally Posted by BringTheContent

That book was a major flop. Regardless, A-Rod probably did use steroids as a Yankee, and in fact I would be shocked if he didn't. For all we know, he may be using HGH this morning. I don't put anything past any player.

I would be willing to bet that the number of players in MLB who used steroids was somewhere in the neighborhood of 80-85%.

As a group we'd be better off just debating things like payroll, since there isn't one fan here who can take the high road on the steroids argument. Every team had more than enough players who cheated, and you can be sure there are plenty who still are cheating.

I think 60% might be more accurate and with the amount of testing now i'd say it's probably 5% or less.I do think ARod might have used as a Yankee but if he did,then where did that get us?We know Manny did, Papi, and many others and you're right probably most major HR hitters were using.Back in the 50's and 60's there might have been other forms used as well but who knows.The fact is that we just need to move on,do frequent testing now,and any positive test should be an automatic 1 year suspension.A second positive should be a lifetime ban.

[BringTheContent]

Originally Posted by ditchlights

If you are a Yankee's fan, you probably consider this argument to be written by a whining hater. If you are a fan of ANY OTHER team, this argument may just make sense. That's OK though, as we humans are naturally biased.

Just for the record since you replied to my post, even though I don't believe this last part was directed at me I'll say it anyway; I'm not a Yankee fan. I'm in NY and have been to a few playoff games this year, but have no horse in this race. Last year I wanted to see Tampa Bay win it all and didn't lose any sleep over the Yankees not making the playoffs. This year I'd get a pretty big kick out of seeing Torre's Dodgers beat the Yankees in the Bronx.

[Lancet71]

Originally Posted by BringTheContent

Just for the record since you replied to my post, even though I don't believe this last part was directed at me I'll say it anyway; I'm not a Yankee fan. I'm in NY and have been to a few playoff games this year, but have no horse in this race. Last year I wanted to see Tampa Bay win it all. This year I'd get a pretty big kick out of seeing Torre's Dodgers beat the Yankees in the Bronx.

I am a Yankee fan and also supported Tampa Bay last year.Considering they had never won one and Florid has,I thought it would be nice for them.As far as Torre and the Dodgers,I do hope we play them too,so we can finally put the Torre name to rest and the second guessing of fans and the organization of whether getting another manager was the correct move;it was!

[BringTheContent]

Originally Posted by Lancet71

I think 60% might be more accurate and with the amount of testing now i'd say it's probably 5% or less.I do think ARod might have used as a Yankee but if he did,then where did that get us?We know Manny did, Papi, and many others and you're right probably most major HR hitters were using.Back in the 50's and 60's there might have been other forms used as well but who knows.The fact is that we just need to move on,do frequent testing now,and any positive test should be an automatic 1 year suspension.A second positive should be a lifetime ban.

I worked at one time in a field that had a major drug-culture, and everyone knew it. I wasn't a major player in the field, and wasn't doing any drugs, but it was pretty clear what was going on. So anyway, I was one of the maybe 10% who didn't do drugs. Everyone suggested the numbers were not as high as people thought they were, but I knew from being around that it was every bit of 90%. That's the only thing I have to go by, but I could see first hand that people would put anything in their bodies if they thought they could get away with it and actually gain something for it. So maybe the number is lower (I can't prove otherwise), but from my own experience in another field I have to go with my gut feeling that the number is actually more than likely higher than people think.

[BringTheContent]

Originally Posted by Lancet71

I am a Yankee fan and also supported Tampa Bay last year.Considering they had never won one and Florid has,I thought it would be nice for them.As far as Torre and the Dodgers,I do hope we play them too,so we can finally put the Torre name to rest and the second guessing of fans and the organization of whether getting another manager was the correct move;it was!

I have no problem with Girardi and believe that it was time for the Yankees to move on from Torre, maybe even a few years earlier than they did. I disagree that the Yankees should ever want to put Torre's name to rest. A manager is never as great as he looks when things are going great, and they're never as bad as they look when things are going wrong. But Torre did a great job with this organization. He was never a great X's and O's manager before, but he knows how to manage PEOPLE. The way he bridged the gaps between George and the Players, media and the organization, the organization and its fans, and sometimes even the players amongst themselves was just plain brilliant. But it was time for everyone involved to move on, and from the looks of things everyone gained something from doing just that.

[Lancet71]

Originally Posted by BringTheContent

I worked at one time in a field that had a major drug-culture, and everyone knew it. I was one of the maybe 10% who didn't do drugs. Everyone suggested the numbers were not as high as people thought they were, but I knew from being around that it was every bit of 90%. That's the only thing I have to go by, but I could see first hand that people would put anything in their bodies if they thought they could get away with it and actually gain something for it. So maybe the number is lower (I can't prove otherwise), but from my own experience in another field I have to go with my gut feeling that the number is actually higher than people think.

I'm doing the same thing and maybe you are right.I know growing up as an athlete how many people touched enhancements and I also know that even if you were in a certain group like a good friend of mine doesn't mean that you will give in to peer pressure.My friend seamed like he was on drugs but was the only one that I know that never did a drug,smoked,or drank so sometimes people do what they want and don't give in to the pressure.The drinking and smoking is what I specifically was referring to.