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Old 02-07-2011, 11:51 AM
 
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Last year I was suggesting that the Lakers trade Artest and Odom to Toronto for Chris Bosh.

Artest is just taking up space in the Laker rotation and his best days are probably behind him - plus he has always been a head case... What team in their right mind would take RonRon and his huge contract?
Odom is playing the best ball of his career - but can he maintain the schedule requirements after playing all summer for the US National Team? Lamar does many things well - when he feels like it, that is...
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Old 02-07-2011, 12:16 PM
 
Location: spring tx
7,912 posts, read 8,196,988 times
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Originally Posted by Greg1977 View Post
In theory there's plenty of scoring but that's not where the Lakers issues lie. It's on the defensive side of the ball where they have problems. Needed moreso than a replacement for Bynum is an upgrade at the point guard spot. This doesn't address that,and frankly while I like Birdman, he's not going to be a difference maker in a hypothetical matchup with the Celtics like a healthy Bynum.
i agree on the PG part, this is why i suggested the andre miller trade. miller is rumored to be ready to go and portland is rumored to be willing to deal him. he has the size, speed and his defense isnt to bad. he isnt the fastest guy at his position BUT he is as fast/faster then fisher/blake combined.

as for bynum being a better defender then birdman...... in short bursts yes, over a 7 game series MAYBE, for a season, no for the simple fact that bynum is more of an injury risk. birdman has had his share lately but all in all if you can keep him off the coke he is pretty healthy and a very good defender, especially weak side. he is kind of a pour mans camby.

the trade machine doesnt reflect picks in the trade scenarios (only $$$) but a trade of bynum, and artest for miller and camby would work dollars wise. throw in a pick or 2 and portland bites i think. other then the whole rival thing.
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Old 02-07-2011, 01:33 PM
 
Location: Earth
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Originally Posted by rigas View Post

as for bynum being a better defender then birdman...... in short bursts yes, over a 7 game series MAYBE, for a season, no for the simple fact that bynum is more of an injury risk.
Yes but again, defensively the Lakers' main vulnerability is perimeter defense at the point, not interior defense. The Lakers have made 3 straight finals primarily with minimum contributions from Bynum. Not only does Bynum provide more size than Birdman in a Celtics matchup, he also provides low post offense, which Birdman does not. Of course, it really depends on Bynum's health but if I was the Lakers, I would address defensive concerns on the perimeter and gamble that Bynum will be there at the end. Because just about every elite team they'll face has a point guard that will burn Fisher all night long, which puts the onus on Kobe to defend these lightning quick point guards and score 30 a night throughout the playoffs.

Also given Portland's history with LA, it's not likely they're going to deal with a division rival.
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Old 02-07-2011, 01:41 PM
 
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Originally Posted by rigas View Post
i agree on the PG part, this is why i suggested the andre miller trade. miller is rumored to be ready to go and portland is rumored to be willing to deal him. he has the size, speed and his defense isnt to bad. he isnt the fastest guy at his position BUT he is as fast/faster then fisher/blake combined.

as for bynum being a better defender then birdman...... in short bursts yes, over a 7 game series MAYBE, for a season, no for the simple fact that bynum is more of an injury risk. birdman has had his share lately but all in all if you can keep him off the coke he is pretty healthy and a very good defender, especially weak side. he is kind of a pour mans camby.

the trade machine doesnt reflect picks in the trade scenarios (only $$$) but a trade of bynum, and artest for miller and camby would work dollars wise. throw in a pick or 2 and portland bites i think. other then the whole rival thing.
How do you think your fans would react if you are Denver or Portland etc. and you hand the struggling Lakers' a sweet-heart deal to help them defend thier title?

Both of these teams are fighting for the playoffs too so it's not like their seasons are tanked already. So you make a major trade and fall out of playoff contention....OMG the fans would burn you in effigy.

The types of gift deals be bandied about have only happened rarely in the NBA, involve a *bad* team and generally the player doesn't stay in the same division.

I think there is a whole lot of wishful thinking flying about here. Again, maybe Miami will give you Lebron for Walton and Artest?
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Old 02-07-2011, 01:43 PM
 
Location: spring tx
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Originally Posted by Greg1977 View Post
Yes but again, defensively the Lakers' main vulnerability is perimeter defense at the point, not interior defense. The Lakers have made 3 straight finals primarily with minimum contributions from Bynum. Not only does Bynum provide more size than Birdman in a Celtics matchup, he also provides low post offense, which Birdman does not. Of course, it really depends on Bynum's health but if I was the Lakers, I would address defensive concerns on the perimeter and gamble that Bynum will be there at the end. Because just about every elite team they'll face has a point guard that will burn Fisher all night long, which puts the onus on Kobe to defend these lightning quick point guards and score 30 a night throughout the playoffs.

Also given Portland's history with LA, it's not likely they're going to deal with a division rival.
this is the reason i say a bynum/birdman swap is a wash. bynum adds a bit more offensively, and can be better defender at times but birdman was a top 5 defender just 2 years ago (in the DPOY voting anyway) and he has less risk of injury which translates to better overall production. in other words would you take andersons limited offense and good defense for a full playoffs or bynums better offense and comparable to lesser defense for a single series?

i agree portland isnt keen on trading with LA but the trades make sense to both teams. i could see it if portland wasnt in the hunt for a playoff spot.
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Old 02-07-2011, 01:49 PM
 
Location: spring tx
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Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
How do you think your fans would react if you are Denver or Portland etc. and you hand the struggling Lakers' a sweet-heart deal to help them defend thier title?

Both of these teams are fighting for the playoffs too so it's not like their seasons are tanked already. So you make a major trade and fall out of playoff contention....OMG the fans would burn you in effigy.

The types of gift deals be bandied about have only happened rarely in the NBA, involve a *bad* team and generally the player doesn't stay in the same division.

I think there is a whole lot of wishful thinking flying about here. Again, maybe Miami will give you Lebron for Walton and Artest?
trust me, no wishful thinking on my part, i am a spurs fan so i LOVE the lakers struggles. just throwing out possibilities in accordance with the topic of the thread.

so since you dont like western conf teams and/or playoff teams in the mix, how about a mo Williams for artest and blake or fisher (blake would go 1st.) cleveland would get artest who they could waive or keep on name recognition alone, and blake a serviceable PG on a team in need of rebuilding. then throw in an extra pick to sweeten the deal.

the lakers get a good upgrade at the PG spot and get rid artests cancer attitude and contract.
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Old 02-07-2011, 02:53 PM
 
51,934 posts, read 41,798,494 times
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Originally Posted by rigas View Post
trust me, no wishful thinking on my part, i am a spurs fan so i LOVE the lakers struggles. just throwing out possibilities in accordance with the topic of the thread.

so since you dont like western conf teams and/or playoff teams in the mix, how about a mo Williams for artest and blake or fisher (blake would go 1st.) cleveland would get artest who they could waive or keep on name recognition alone, and blake a serviceable PG on a team in need of rebuilding. then throw in an extra pick to sweeten the deal.

the lakers get a good upgrade at the PG spot and get rid artests cancer attitude and contract.
Point taken.

Why this would suck for Cleveland....

1) They still have to pay Artests contract and have to eat the cap room. That's 2 more years after this one I believe.

2) The Lakers current deep 1st round draft picks aren't worth much unless you get them to give you a 2015 or 16 pick and hope it's worth something then. If the pick is far enough out then maybe Cleveland bites....heck maybe they could trade Luke Walton and some picks etc.

P.S. They aren't trading Fisher. He's not that expensive and the organization has class and loyalty so Fish isn't going anywhere and will retire a Laker IMO.
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Old 02-07-2011, 03:17 PM
 
Location: spring tx
7,912 posts, read 8,196,988 times
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Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
Point taken.

Why this would suck for Cleveland....

1) They still have to pay Artests contract and have to eat the cap room. That's 2 more years after this one I believe.

2) The Lakers current deep 1st round draft picks aren't worth much unless you get them to give you a 2015 or 16 pick and hope it's worth something then. If the pick is far enough out then maybe Cleveland bites....heck maybe they could trade Luke Walton and some picks etc.

P.S. They aren't trading Fisher. He's not that expensive and the organization has class and loyalty so Fish isn't going anywhere and will retire a Laker IMO.
was just reading the lakers dont have a 2011 first rounder (traded to NJ), but they have 3 second round picks from other teams plus their own. (NYK, miami, and chicago)

i agree i dont think they trade fisher out of pure respect. though he did leave them for more money at one point.

including walton is place of artest would work $$ wise but not sure his name is recognizable as artests. there was even some talk of artest going to the rockets in a deal for brooks, i dont like that for rockets.
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Old 02-07-2011, 04:06 PM
 
Location: Earth
3,653 posts, read 3,879,801 times
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Originally Posted by rigas View Post
in other words would you take andersons limited offense and good defense for a full playoffs or bynums better offense and comparable to lesser defense for a single series?
It depends. There's only a few teams where the Lakers would essentially need Bynum, chiefly the Celtics, and I don't see Anderson having the impact in that series that Bynum would if healthy. Otherwise, the Lakers are fine against just about every other team inside with Gasol, Bynum, and Odom, in terms of size it's almost an embarrassment of riches. If I were GM, I would be seeking a PG upgrade, particularly defensively.
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Old 02-07-2011, 04:34 PM
 
Location: spring tx
7,912 posts, read 8,196,988 times
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Originally Posted by Greg1977 View Post
It depends. There's only a few teams where the Lakers would essentially need Bynum, chiefly the Celtics, and I don't see Anderson having the impact in that series that Bynum would if healthy. Otherwise, the Lakers are fine against just about every other team inside with Gasol, Bynum, and Odom, in terms of size it's almost an embarrassment of riches. If I were GM, I would be seeking a PG upgrade, particularly defensively.
if i liked the lakers i would agree 1005 the pg spot is their biggest weakness. , i couldnt care less if bynum is gone or stays. dont get me wrong i would take bynum to the spurs but i wouldnt start him or pay him the money he is getting.
actually with his history i would be on the fence if offered bynum or birdman to the spurs.

now if the lakers where to get a gift it would be billups. he is the perfect fit at the PG spot and a trade of ratliff, artest and blake would work. put billups on the lakers, get barnes healthy and the lakers would be all but unbeatable.
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