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Old 03-08-2011, 03:47 AM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
14,330 posts, read 19,545,592 times
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1) I don't think LeBron James and Wade should be on the same team. You can't win games with only two players.

2) Chris Bosh is incredibly overrated.

3) Erick Dampier is the starting center, 'nuf said.

4) Who the hell is this coach?

5) Team chemistry is suspect.
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Old 03-08-2011, 06:55 AM
 
Location: Earth
3,653 posts, read 3,880,422 times
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There doesn't appear to be anything particularly innovative about their offensive sets. The logic seems to be 'well we've got 2 of the top 3 players in the league, they'll just figure it out'. The final play from the Bulls game where Lebron isolated at the top of the key and missed that awkward left-hand layup over Noah, exemplifies the issue. Teams can see what's coming, and good defensive teams like Boston and Chicago can defend those kinds of plays.

I don't see Lebron and Wade being 'similar' players as the issue. Jordan and Pippen by all accounts did many of the same things. The problem I see moreso is that the James-Wade duo is a manufactured relationship, of two alpha-male superstars used to having the ball in their hands ALL THE TIME having to subjugate to each other from one game to the next. There was a clear established pecking order with Jordan and Pippen. Jordan was the alpha male, the dominant scorer, the established superstar who Pippen grew alongside and produced one of the greatest duos in NBA history. Saying you are willing to make the sacrifices is easy, in practice however we're seeing it's not quite so easy, especially when you've got guys so established in their own games and tendencies.
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Old 03-08-2011, 07:06 AM
 
51,940 posts, read 41,806,773 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg1977 View Post
There doesn't appear to be anything particularly innovative about their offensive sets. The logic seems to be 'well we've got 2 of the top 3 players in the league, they'll just figure it out'. The final play from the Bulls game where Lebron isolated at the top of the key and missed that awkward left-hand layup over Noah, exemplifies the issue. Teams can see what's coming, and good defensive teams like Boston and Chicago can defend those kinds of plays.

I don't see Lebron and Wade being 'similar' players as the issue. Jordan and Pippen by all accounts did many of the same things. The problem I see moreso is that the James-Wade duo is a manufactured relationship, of two alpha-male superstars used to having the ball in their hands ALL THE TIME having to subjugate to each other from one game to the next. There was a clear established pecking order with Jordan and Pippen. Jordan was the alpha male, the dominant scorer, the established superstar who Pippen grew alongside and produced one of the greatest duos in NBA history. Saying you are willing to make the sacrifices is easy, in practice however we're seeing it's not quite so easy, especially when you've got guys so established in their own games and tendencies.
Jordan and Pippen had something like 4 years playing together before they won their first championship. Lebron and Wade have had <1. I know there was a lot of hype when they got this crew together but the team even on paper is flawed and that's not even touching the chemistry issue.

All I'm seeing with the Heat is the somewhat expected result for the first season and their future success will be dictated by free agency and resolving chemistry.

P.S. Boston will decline on their own so I see the big battles in the future being Bulls vs. Heat, maybe the Knicks and Orlando too.
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Old 03-08-2011, 07:48 AM
 
Location: Earth
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Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
Jordan and Pippen had something like 4 years playing together before they won their first championship. Lebron and Wade have had <1.
Indeed, my main point about the Jordan-Pippen dynamic is that it was a naturally evolving partnership, Jordan was the established star, Pippen drafted alongside him, and the rest is history. Jordan had the alpha personality, Pippen did not, which certainly helped with chemistry. Wade and Lebron are two 8 year veterans, both used to being 'the guy' on their team, brought together at the apex of their careers to try and figure out how they'll compliment each other. My point wasn't speaking moreso to the amount of time each duo has played, but moreso that the dynamic of their relationships are completely different. Mainly I raised Jordan and Pippen because I've heard people on other forums make a comparison to Wade-Lebron, when I don't think the comparison is accurate for a few reasons. I don't see Wade and Lebron after 4 years having the kind of chemistry Jordan-Pippen did. With the 90's Bulls, there was no issue over who was getting the last shot. Jordan was always the first option. With this Heat team, one game it's Lebron, next game it's Wade, so I can see why chemistry and consistency has become a huge issue, when you're having to tailor your gameplan from one game to the next in order to soothe the egos of two superstars who are used to getting their way( before joining up).
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Old 03-08-2011, 09:27 PM
 
1,426 posts, read 2,541,394 times
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Quote:
All I'm seeing with the Heat is the somewhat expected result for the first season
This wasn't the expected result. Preseason expectations were that the Heat would be an unstoppable power house and win a championship this year. Heck, ESPN talked as if the Heat would be 82-0 this year. With all the preseason hype I remember asking myself why even play a season, just give the Heat the trophy.

Once again, ESPN and the NBA will cry as they still don't have the Kobe vs Lebron matchup in the finals.

The Heat are beginning to implode. It may be lack of chemistry. But if too much damage is done this season, will these 3 egos ever be able to play together?
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Old 03-09-2011, 02:42 AM
 
Location: Southeastern Tennessee
711 posts, read 978,062 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brill View Post
This wasn't the expected result. Preseason expectations were that the Heat would be an unstoppable power house and win a championship this year. Heck, ESPN talked as if the Heat would be 82-0 this year. With all the preseason hype I remember asking myself why even play a season, just give the Heat the trophy.

Once again, ESPN and the NBA will cry as they still don't have the Kobe vs Lebron matchup in the finals.
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Old 03-09-2011, 03:06 AM
 
Location: Ohio
2,178 posts, read 8,078,965 times
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I think one of the problems is LB wants to show off his athletic ability at times when he should be playing team concept ball and keep a good team flow going.
And he ain't no point guard and shouldn't be used as one. He should be receiving the ball from a true point guard who can feed athletic players who can finish.
The BIG 3 of the Heat may not win as many games as the Cavs did last year with the BIG ONE.
I love it.
They seem to me to playing as individuals instead of a true team machine.
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Old 03-09-2011, 06:33 AM
 
51,940 posts, read 41,806,773 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brill View Post
This wasn't the expected result. Preseason expectations were that the Heat would be an unstoppable power house and win a championship this year. Heck, ESPN talked as if the Heat would be 82-0 this year. With all the preseason hype I remember asking myself why even play a season, just give the Heat the trophy.

Once again, ESPN and the NBA will cry as they still don't have the Kobe vs Lebron matchup in the finals.

The Heat are beginning to implode. It may be lack of chemistry. But if too much damage is done this season, will these 3 egos ever be able to play together?
ESPN is full of crap most of the time just like any talk radio....they sell hype and hyperbole. Most REASONABLE basketball writers felt the Heat had talent but were more cautious in their predictions. I think that Boston has been the leading eastern team since the start of the season in most eyes and they still are.

Frankly, I don't think you will EVER see a Kobe - Lebron finals, at least not when they are at their peak abilities.
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Old 03-09-2011, 07:11 AM
 
Location: Earth
3,653 posts, read 3,880,422 times
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Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post

Frankly, I don't think you will EVER see a Kobe - Lebron finals, at least not when they are at their peak abilities.
Thinking the same... I think 2009 was probably the last year to have seen both at their peaks simultaneously. Though Kobe can still bring it, of course....
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Old 03-09-2011, 07:53 AM
 
Location: Fort Mill, SC
2,532 posts, read 2,946,399 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
ESPN is full of crap most of the time just like any talk radio....they sell hype and hyperbole. Most REASONABLE basketball writers felt the Heat had talent but were more cautious in their predictions. I think that Boston has been the leading eastern team since the start of the season in most eyes and they still are.
ESPN is filled with people like you and I who comment on who we think is better, etc. They are fans just like you and I; they just get paid to judge. I can't think of once that Desmond Howard didn't pick Michigan to win their games (even though he knew they would get killed in some). Look how much Erin Andrews gushes over Florida. It's not that they are full of crap; its just that they are fans like you and I and have high expectations for players/teams.

Personally, I think the East is a lot closer than the ranking shows. I think both Orlando and Atlanta could shock some of these favorite teams in playoffs (i.e. Boston/Miami/Chicago). I think at this point the leading team in the East is the Baby Bulls.
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