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Old 06-28-2011, 10:13 PM
 
Location: Moose Jaw, in between the Moose's butt and nose.
4,969 posts, read 7,317,717 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 719inhere View Post
Here is a link to the story about the 22 teams losing money.
League says 22 teams to lose money, $300 million total this season | ProBasketballTalk
I think that's as bad or worse, than the NHL, when they locked out in 04-05.
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Old 06-29-2011, 05:00 PM
 
Location: spring tx
7,912 posts, read 8,195,031 times
Reputation: 1982
this is pretty bad news
Spurs Nation Ľ Mike Monroe: It only gets harder for owners, players

a piece of the article

Quote:
Here’s the truly bad news: Once the lockout begins, the standoff is going to get nastier.

According to NBA executives familiar with the league’s strategies, once the lockout is in place, the owners will push for a hard salary cap of $45 million, the elimination of guaranteed contracts and ask that the players swallow a 33 percent salary cut.

The concessions made in recent weeks, including the "flex cap" of $62 million and a guarantee of $2 billion in annual player payroll, will be off the table.
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Old 06-30-2011, 02:28 PM
 
Location: spring tx
7,912 posts, read 8,195,031 times
Reputation: 1982
looks like its official, lock out is on, coaches are not allowed to contact players.

NBA to lock out players, Spurs coaches can't contact players
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Old 06-30-2011, 04:02 PM
 
Location: Fishers, IN
6,495 posts, read 10,799,437 times
Reputation: 4060
I think the owners are pretty dug in. This could result in a lost season, ala the NHL of a few years back.
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Old 06-30-2011, 08:21 PM
 
Location: spring tx
7,912 posts, read 8,195,031 times
Reputation: 1982
peter holt says the players union wants average salaries of 6 mil in the next 6 years and 7 mil in the next 7 years. considering the players average now is about 4.79 mil, 6 in 6 isnt to far off BUT the fact the players want it to go up another mil in one year? i also think an AVERAGE salary of 6 mil is NUTS! players are greedy as hell! cant blame the owners for wanting to keep numbers more reasonable. think about it this way, depending on the report, 17 to 22 teams LOST money with current salaries. now the players want to raise those same salaries, the players would have to raise ticket prices thus causing games to be less affordable for the average person not making 6 mil a year. i mean its like raising taxes in a recession, its just stupid economics!
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Old 06-30-2011, 10:22 PM
JL
 
7,351 posts, read 11,880,681 times
Reputation: 7198
I think the season will be saved, but not till January or February. That is fine with me though. The long season can be a drag at times. I'm hoping next season will be around 40-45 games with the players probably a bit more fresher for the playoffs.
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Old 06-30-2011, 10:55 PM
 
Location: In San Antonio
1,673 posts, read 2,721,398 times
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Let em strike. If they cant share Millions, then flip em!!
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Old 07-03-2011, 03:46 PM
 
920 posts, read 1,530,572 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rigas View Post
this is typical UNION behavior regardless of the union. unions USED to serve a purpose, now they do nothing but try to break the owners back with out the foresight to know that if you break the owners you break yourself. unions are a huge part of why the cost of living is so high, and a huge reason the owners/league are losing money. think about it in a more local/personal level, if the unions didnt push for higher wages mostly under the pretense of "cost of living" then cost of living would not be so high. truckers unions raise prices to deliver food, UAW raises wages on the manufacture of said truck (as well as cars), pipe fitters, cement, masons and so on all raise their wages via unions all for "cost of living" but the owners dont eat it, they turn it over to the customer, and a lot of those customers complain that prices are to high, a lot of those customers being UNION employees, thus the union employees go to the union reps saying "the cost of living is to high i need more money" and the wages get raised starting the cycle over again.

now this is not the full case of the NBAPU exactly, though some players (im looking at you spreewell, pat ewing) will claim they cant afford the cost of living thus needing/justifying higher salaries. those salary increases dont equate to the owner losing money but higher ticket prices. the players (like most employees and especially union members) believe the owners are making a killing. this is not necessarily the case, while few owners make their living solely off the team, a few do. those who do dont make much more then "a living" this is why the owner of the hornets sold out to the league, he had no other income and CP3 needed 20 mil or what ever. now if the owners raised ticket prices every year like most nba salaries or the salary cap then very few of us would be attending games.
its funny, about 3 yrs ago i sold about $14,000,000 in business, now one of my employees saw the number and was like "HOLY CRAP" your making a killing! he didnt understand that his salary, my other employees salaries, office, insurance, phones, trucks, fuel, materials (i own a concrete construction company) and so on and so forth all have to come out of that money. he only knew the 14m was a huge number and his $35,000 salary was not nearly as big. he also didnt realize that after taxes, and over head and such i would be LUCKY to make the national average in my industry of 2-3%. think about it, $200,000 to $300,000 sounds nice, until you realize that it is only a small part of the $14,000,000 you started out with.

see i have zero sympathy for unions who would like to make that 2-3% closer to 1% or less. i have no sympathy for unions what so ever. i do have sympathy for employees, and for those who do what they can to live within their means. nba players do not live within their means more often then not, and they would break the owners if they could. the owners and the fans IMO are one in the same in this dispute.

This is flat ridiculous. At their greatest, unions amounted to about 37% of the private workforce, currently it's 7%. Rank and file have collapsed about 5x from its peak in 1975, and yet the economic situation is far worse than it has ever been in the last 50 years. Furthermore there are states that make union membership almost nil because collective bargaining isn't allowed. Yet those states aren't in any better economic position than those that are closed shop states. This general hate of unions is irrational and stupid. Furthermore, the nonunion sector of the economy, the FIRE portion (finance, insurance, real estate) was the sector that also had to be bailed out by the taxpayer. NONE of those industries are unionized yet there they are, demanding that the FEDS give them untold amounts of money otherwise the economic efficacy of the US would be destroyed. I don't remember unions saying that or causing any of that.

And if you think that players are breaking the NBA, this is wrong as well. A strike occurred back in 1998 and it was the players who didn't maintain solidarity when most of them realized that what was being negotiated was primarily for the benefit of the top 20 players, and not for the rest of the rank and file. When the bulk of those players realized what was at stake the strike came to an end quickly. None of those players had any intention of breaking owners, but in this case its not just about a few players, they realize that whats on the table simply isn't acceptable.
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Old 07-03-2011, 04:21 PM
 
Location: spring tx
7,912 posts, read 8,195,031 times
Reputation: 1982
Ok so since you have no idea of the numbers then the rest of your post I will consider miss informed as well.

The earliest union % data available is from the year 1983, where union % of the wage/salaried earning work force was about 20%, compared to last year (the most recent avalable) was down to about 11.5%. Furthermore, Wisconsin is currently the only state that I know of that is not a right to work (none union) that does not allow collective bargaining, and that right was only taken from the teachers union because they are a govt based union with ridiculously expensive benefits paid with tax payer benefits. Even chris christy has not been able to break unions collective bargaining rights in new jersey, and trust me he is surely and rightfully trying!

I have personal business experience with unions and I whole heartedly say screw those greedy pricks!
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Old 07-06-2011, 12:55 AM
 
920 posts, read 1,530,572 times
Reputation: 955
Quote:
Originally Posted by rigas View Post
Ok so since you have no idea of the numbers then the rest of your post I will consider miss informed as well.

The earliest union % data available is from the year 1983, where union % of the wage/salaried earning work force was about 20%, compared to last year (the most recent avalable) was down to about 11.5%. Furthermore, Wisconsin is currently the only state that I know of that is not a right to work (none union) that does not allow collective bargaining, and that right was only taken from the teachers union because they are a govt based union with ridiculously expensive benefits paid with tax payer benefits. Even chris christy has not been able to break unions collective bargaining rights in new jersey, and trust me he is surely and rightfully trying!

I have personal business experience with unions and I whole heartedly say screw those greedy pricks!
The earliest data IS NOT from 1983, unless you're too lazy to do any kind of research. Use a bit of common sense, the Labor Department has been collecting data for years. You think that they began their work in 1983! And you seem to not understand that I said PRIVATE industry workers, not government workers. I deliberately said that because the NBA is a private business. The number you cited, 12%, includes BOTH private and government unions. The number of 35% was from 1975 and was almost exclusively private industrial workers, government service unions were only just beginning to be formed. And again you can't seem to follow the logic. Even by your flawed data, union membership has fallen. If unions were greedy pricks, and their numbers have fallen, then we should be seeing an increasing economic prosperity as the rank and file continues to fall. And I can't help but notice that you ignored the fact that the largest sector of the economy is nonunion services, including the FIRE economy (finance, insurance and real estate), which was in such poor shape that they needed to be bailed out by the taxpayer, so much so that Ben Bernanke refused to answer a congressional hearing request to name which banks and just how much was needed of taxpayer money in order to keep them somewhat solvent. But according to your logic, it's those greedy union pricks that are the problem. Yeah, right...

And if Wisconsin is the only right to work state that you know of, then you sure don't know much. I would suggest you begin your education by looking at open shop states in the Deep South. You've sure have a lot to learn...

Last edited by loloroj; 07-06-2011 at 01:04 AM..
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