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Old 04-06-2012, 07:43 AM
 
Location: Earth
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John23 View Post

Wade? I think you saw a bunch of incarnations similar, KJ? Mitch Richmond?
Mitch Richmond? My memory must be shaky but I don't see the comparison. Richmond was much more of a shooter, wasn't nearly the slasher and, well, his game just doesn't resemble Wade's. Wade's game doesn't really remind me of anyone's in particular, in the sense that it contains traces of other players but not one person I can really specify.
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Old 04-06-2012, 08:48 AM
 
Location: The "Rock"
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg1977 View Post
Wade's game doesn't really remind me of anyone's in particular, in the sense that it contains traces of other players but not one person I can really specify.
Not sure of your age... but Did you ever see Ron Harper play his first couple years in the league with the Cavs prior to his knee injuries?

They are not just a like but those first couple of years, he's the "closest" person I can even think to say his game is like... Wade is a much better defender and has a better J for sure though.
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Old 04-06-2012, 06:45 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles, Ca
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Originally Posted by Greg1977 View Post
Some odd names you picked out, but generally I agree with the premise. Bynum doesn't hold a candle to the great centers of the 80's and 90's i.e Kareem, Moses,Hakeem, Admiral, Ewing, Shaq etc. I wouldn't put him on equal footing with Mourning either, who was a beast in his prime.
Bynum hasn't seen any hard centers, very physical. Remember when Parish karate chopped Laimbeer, I think in the 87 playoffs?

I can't think of many guys now who can wear you down and punish you, the way the 80's, 90's players did.

I agree Wade has traces of other players games. I picked Richmond because they are both about the same height, weight. They both could score 22-25 a season. 45% or higher field goal percentage. And about 30% from 3's (Richmond higher). And KJ and Hardaway had the speed and slashing ability.

Another reason why I'm skeptical of these guys today, where's the technical proficiency that you saw 20-25 years ago?

Kevin McHale's post up game?
Olajuwon's footwork?
Chris Mullins jump shot? No one is like that today.
Kareem's sky hook etc.

In the 90's, I use to think of Ewings jump shot or Robinsons as "routine", isn't that what every center should do? There were a set of basics that it seemed like everyone could do. If you could do a set of basics well for a long time, through highs and lows, you started becoming "proficient"....i.e. an Alex English.

And some guys got so good, they were deadly, like a Chris Mullin jump shot. The guys now are still stuck on basics.

I also remember a lot of raw talent in the 90's that never really maxed out. Remember Sarunas Marciulonis? On Golden State? He could have been on one of these next generation lists. He had a lot of potential. Similar with Reggie Lewis. Drazen Petrovic? These guys weren't trying to be everything, they had much better fundamentals.
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Old 04-08-2012, 05:02 AM
 
Location: Earth
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. GE View Post
Not sure of your age... but Did you ever see Ron Harper play his first couple years in the league with the Cavs prior to his knee injuries?

They are not just a like but those first couple of years, he's the "closest" person I can even think to say his game is like... Wade is a much better defender and has a better J for sure though.
I did see him a few times in his prime, but not often enough to really gauge his game that well. Well let's put it this way, I was in my teens(early teens I'm thinking), my most vivid memory of him was a Bulls-Clippers game in which he played a very strong game against Jordan. I recall thinking at the time 'who is this guy?' because I had never seen him play before.
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Old 04-08-2012, 05:17 AM
 
Location: Earth
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Originally Posted by John23 View Post

1)I can't think of many guys now who can wear you down and punish you, the way the 80's, 90's players did.

2)I agree Wade has traces of other players games. I picked Richmond because they are both about the same height, weight. They both could score 22-25 a season. 45% or higher field goal percentage. And about 30% from 3's (Richmond higher). And KJ and Hardaway had the speed and slashing ability.

3)Another reason why I'm skeptical of these guys today, where's the technical proficiency that you saw 20-25 years ago?
1) Well for one thing, the way the game is called now, it doesn't allow for that kind of physical play anymore. The game has been 'pussified' for lack of a better term. My mind harkens back to those early 90's Bull-Knicks games or mid 90's Knicks-Heat and Knicks-Pacer. Resembled a wrestling match more than a basketball game at times....

2) Richmond was 6'5 or so, Wade is more like 6'3( but has VERY long arms which is why he plays bigger than he is). Two different players, Richmond more a shooter, Wade a slasher. Wade was a more dominant scorer though, good for 26-30 ppg in his prime( more than the 22-25 you mentioned). In fact, his ppg this year is his lowest since his 2nd season.

3) Fundamentals are seriously lacking. One thing that stands out to me when I watch old games, is that it seems like 'everyone' could shoot the midrange. Now it's a lost art; guys are either slashers and dunkers, or 3point shooters, asides from a few like Kobe, Durant, Melo who have good midrange games.

While it seems like the game and players have evolved i.e bigger, stronger, faster, jump higher, dribble more creatively, in other ways the game has also devolved, post play is lacking asides from a few players( I love guys like Al Jefferson and Zach Randolph for their old-school postgames; Duncan too of course). The influx of youth ( guys coming out of high school or only playing a season of NCAA) meant that you had young pros still learning the game at a point when their games should have been more fundamentally sound when they entered the league.
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Old 04-08-2012, 02:31 PM
 
Location: The "Rock"
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg1977 View Post
I did see him a few times in his prime, but not often enough to really gauge his game that well. Well let's put it this way, I was in my teens(early teens I'm thinking), my most vivid memory of him was a Bulls-Clippers game in which he played a very strong game against Jordan. I recall thinking at the time 'who is this guy?' because I had never seen him play before.
You would have liked his game... He was tough and He had a lot of potential. I think he would been a great rival for Jordan had his body held up. Unfortunatly for us fans it did not. it's actually amazing that he was able to still salvage a decent career and get a few rings. That in itself speaks to the kinda heart he had.

I have a lot of respect for him. He also dealt with a stuttering problem. He was able to handle things well. Speaks to his upbringing I guess. But definitely a solid individual.
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Old 04-08-2012, 08:30 PM
 
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First things first, these young guns need to win a title first. I know technically you have two that already have in Wade and Bynum. But Wade won his what seems like a decade ago and for Bynum, well this is his first year playing good basketball, staying healthy and getting heavy minutes. Of course it is starting to look inevitable that one of these younger teams could win it all this year but perhaps the Spurs will have something to say about that. Or the Lakers minus Bynum of course.
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Old 04-09-2012, 06:24 AM
 
Location: Earth
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Originally Posted by buffalobrandon View Post
First things first, these young guns need to win a title first.
Not really..... Charles Barkley, Patrick Ewing, Karl Malone,John Stockton, Reggie Miller, Elgin Baylor. All historically great players, and not a single title amongst them.
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Old 04-09-2012, 07:16 AM
 
297 posts, read 340,251 times
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Originally Posted by Greg1977 View Post
Not really..... Charles Barkley, Patrick Ewing, Karl Malone,John Stockton, Reggie Miller, Elgin Baylor. All historically great players, and not a single title amongst them.
Good point. I guess I was taking this more in the direction of which player is going to put their footprint on this decade of basketball, which wasn't really the OPs intentions. Trust me, as a Bills fan I know good players without rings.
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Old 04-09-2012, 08:07 AM
 
Location: Earth
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Originally Posted by buffalobrandon View Post
Good point. I guess I was taking this more in the direction of which player is going to put their footprint on this decade of basketball, which wasn't really the OPs intentions.
Lol actually I'm the OP, and it was my intention to kind of 'forecast' which players are going to be 'the guys' over the next 10 years. A number of players, like Rose and Durant, while young have played 4-5 years now, so I don't think it's too soon to start comparing them to past stars, of course not in career achievements, but in level of play.
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