U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Sports > Basketball
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 06-11-2012, 08:41 AM
 
51,859 posts, read 41,758,040 times
Reputation: 32364

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by pgtitans View Post
But you have to understand the amount of pressure he has placed on himself. "Not one, not two, not....", that is the reason why anything less than championship is going to give him criticism. What do you expect? Who fault is it that he said those things?
Oh, I agree.

Let me reiterate yet again that I have ZERO issue with people hating Lebron and the Heat for the hubris and attitudes.

However, when people unfairly criticize his play then I have an issue. I just want to be able to discuss the playoffs without someone coming along and blaming Lebron when he missed 1 of 2 FT's with a couple minutes left in the game and then makes a ludicrous claim that the greats never did that. (An actual thread we had here).

Lebron has been by far the most dominant player in the playoffs this year. Let's see if it continues to the finals. He definitely seems more focused as if realizing that no....it's not just going to happen for him. Perhaps it took him until age 27 to pull his head out is butt and play his best ball.....like it did for Kobe.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 06-11-2012, 08:56 AM
 
Location: Earth
3,653 posts, read 3,877,543 times
Reputation: 1802
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
However, when people unfairly criticize his play then I have an issue. I just want to be able to discuss the playoffs without someone coming along and blaming Lebron when he missed 1 of 2 FT's with a couple minutes left in the game and then makes a ludicrous claim that the greats never did that. (An actual thread we had here).
There's a difference between playing bad and playing uninspired. All greats have bad games, playing uninspired is another issue entirely. The 2011 finals for Lebron wasn't just sub-par basketball, it was uninspired( go back a season before that in the series against Boston, before the move to Miami). Totally disengaged from the importance of the moment. He can do better, and I hope to see it this year in the finals.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-11-2012, 03:33 PM
 
51,859 posts, read 41,758,040 times
Reputation: 32364
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg1977 View Post
There's a difference between playing bad and playing uninspired. All greats have bad games, playing uninspired is another issue entirely. The 2011 finals for Lebron wasn't just sub-par basketball, it was uninspired( go back a season before that in the series against Boston, before the move to Miami). Totally disengaged from the importance of the moment. He can do better, and I hope to see it this year in the finals.
I somewhat agree, especially in the boston year. Frankly, I think last year he was still trying too hard to involve his teamates which made him a bit passive at times. Throw in the fact that Dallas brought their A+ game and we shouldn't take anything away from that.

Regardless, he is "beasting" right now. If he gives Durant the (Jordan\Pippen vs. Drexler treatment) then all this stuff is going to disappear in the next 2 weeks. forever.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-11-2012, 07:12 PM
 
Location: DMV
10,136 posts, read 11,640,377 times
Reputation: 3181
I just heard on the radio today that Lebron was using some kind of breathing technique during the games. A doctor sent a message to a local radio station and said that it looked like he was trained for anxiety. Then they talked about this article here:

LeBron James' other decision - ESPN

Quote:
Yet James had somehow gone adrift himself, first starting in a 2010 playoff series that ended his tenure in Cleveland, then his free-agency fiasco, then another mysterious end to the following season. He needed advice and help, but it was not in his nature to look for it or accept it.


"I just told him that he's got to get back to trusting his instincts," said Dambrot, now the head coach at the University of Akron. "He came down here after the Finals and we had a heart-to-heart and I told him he's got to get back to doing what he thinks is right, not what he's supposed to think is right or what anyone else thinks is right. I just kept telling him, put the raincoat on, let all this roll off."



While he sought some counsel, according to those around him, James came to the decision of implementing changes by himself. That meant from a personal and professional standpoint. From finally moving his family to Florida during the season after refraining from doing so last year to the way he's managed his focus and overall mental state for the past six weeks. Those adjustments have shown through during the Heat's playoff run. His attitude and habits are simply different.


Last year, he battled insomnia throughout the postseason. He went to the gym in the middle of the night. He used Twitter in the middle of the night, once declaring "Now or never" at 3 a.m. before Game 5 of the Finals. He watched television commentary about his play and read columns about it.


"I get on the Internet, read you guys' columns, those are fun," James said before Game 5 against the Mavericks. "I've seen a lot of them. They're pretty good. Appreciate it."


This year is different. He hasn't tweeted since April. He's going to bed early, not late.


Did James see Kevin Durant's huge fourth quarter in Game 4 of the Western Conference finals against the Spurs?


"No, I was sleeping but I heard KD was great," James said last week.


What did he think about the Thunder's great comeback to win Game 6 and reach the Finals?


"I didn't watch it but congratulations to them," James said.
Very interesting. Definitely brings a more human side to this. At the end of the day, I know I never knew he went through all this. Glad he got help and this could probably be the reason why he's performing better this year.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-12-2012, 05:53 AM
 
Location: Earth
3,653 posts, read 3,877,543 times
Reputation: 1802
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
I somewhat agree, especially in the boston year. Frankly, I think last year he was still trying too hard to involve his teamates which made him a bit passive at times. Throw in the fact that Dallas brought their A+ game and we shouldn't take anything away from that.

Regardless, he is "beasting" right now. If he gives Durant the (Jordan\Pippen vs. Drexler treatment) then all this stuff is going to disappear in the next 2 weeks. forever.
I wouldn't go as far as to say Dallas even brought their A+ game. Dirk wasn't 'quite' as good in that series as the prior ones( he still played well), overall the Mavs played solid team ball, and the heat didn't, compounded by Lebron's woes. If you look at those games, most of them were relatively close, which leads me to believe that if Lebron played anywhere near how he was playing against Chicago, the result may have been entirely different.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-12-2012, 07:38 AM
 
51,859 posts, read 41,758,040 times
Reputation: 32364
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg1977 View Post
I wouldn't go as far as to say Dallas even brought their A+ game. Dirk wasn't 'quite' as good in that series as the prior ones( he still played well), overall the Mavs played solid team ball, and the heat didn't, compounded by Lebron's woes. If you look at those games, most of them were relatively close, which leads me to believe that if Lebron played anywhere near how he was playing against Chicago, the result may have been entirely different.
Did you look at Bosh's numbers?

Also, you need to look at some of the key games where Dallas bombed 3's in like crazy.

Terry for example shot 36% in the reg season and 44% in the playoffs that year from 3-pt range. You can' just look at Dirk and conclude that Dallas didn't bring their best game throughout the playoffs last year.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-12-2012, 08:44 AM
 
Location: Earth
3,653 posts, read 3,877,543 times
Reputation: 1802
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
Did you look at Bosh's numbers?

Also, you need to look at some of the key games where Dallas bombed 3's in like crazy.

Terry for example shot 36% in the reg season and 44% in the playoffs that year from 3-pt range. You can' just look at Dirk and conclude that Dallas didn't bring their best game throughout the playoffs last year.
Bosh's stats for the finals:

Game 1: 19 points, 9 rebounds
Game 2: 12 points, 8 rebounds
Game 3: 18 points, 3 rebounds
Game 4: 24 points, 6 rebounds
Game 5: 19 points, 10 rebounds
Game 6: 19 points, 8 rebounds

Series averages: 18.5 points, 7.3 rebounds
Season Averages: 18.7 points, 8.3 rebounds

With the exception of sub-par shooting in games 1-3, Bosh's output was close to par with the regular season. A little fact that slipped under the radar is that Bosh was actually the most consistent playoff performer last year out of the 'big 3', in terms of consistently playing to his capabilities from round 1 to the finals. Lebron sucked in the finals, and Wade sucked against Chicago.

Lebron averaged 26.6 points for the season and 17.8 in the finals, a drop-off of 8 points. Wade's finals scoring average? 26.5 points compared to 25.5 in the finals... Out of the big 3, the biggest letdown was Lebron's offensive output, inarguable paltry for a player of that caliber and ability. Wade and Bosh either exceeded or matched the offensive production you'd expect from them. Even with Dallas shooting lights out as you say, they didn't exactly blow Miami out of the building, and that's even with Lebron struggling. It's not unreasonable to suggest that Lebron's lack of offense was a major contributor to the Heat losing, given that most of the games were only decided by 4-6 points.

The whole A+ thing is such an arbitrary thing, not really worth expending a great deal of time determining if it was an A+, or an A-, or a B+, or whatever. The mere fact that Dirk didn't always bring his best in the finals is enough for me to say that Dallas didn't bring theirs on the whole, given his importance to that team.

Last edited by Roman77; 06-12-2012 at 09:04 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-12-2012, 01:41 PM
 
51,859 posts, read 41,758,040 times
Reputation: 32364
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg1977 View Post
Bosh's stats for the finals:

Game 1: 19 points, 9 rebounds
Game 2: 12 points, 8 rebounds
Game 3: 18 points, 3 rebounds
Game 4: 24 points, 6 rebounds
Game 5: 19 points, 10 rebounds
Game 6: 19 points, 8 rebounds

Series averages: 18.5 points, 7.3 rebounds
Season Averages: 18.7 points, 8.3 rebounds

With the exception of sub-par shooting in games 1-3, Bosh's output was close to par with the regular season. A little fact that slipped under the radar is that Bosh was actually the most consistent playoff performer last year out of the 'big 3', in terms of consistently playing to his capabilities from round 1 to the finals. Lebron sucked in the finals, and Wade sucked against Chicago.

Lebron averaged 26.6 points for the season and 17.8 in the finals, a drop-off of 8 points. Wade's finals scoring average? 26.5 points compared to 25.5 in the finals... Out of the big 3, the biggest letdown was Lebron's offensive output, inarguable paltry for a player of that caliber and ability. Wade and Bosh either exceeded or matched the offensive production you'd expect from them. Even with Dallas shooting lights out as you say, they didn't exactly blow Miami out of the building, and that's even with Lebron struggling. It's not unreasonable to suggest that Lebron's lack of offense was a major contributor to the Heat losing, given that most of the games were only decided by 4-6 points.

The whole A+ thing is such an arbitrary thing, not really worth expending a great deal of time determining if it was an A+, or an A-, or a B+, or whatever. The mere fact that Dirk didn't always bring his best in the finals is enough for me to say that Dallas didn't bring theirs on the whole, given his importance to that team.
Bosh's shooting percentage dropped from 50% in the regular season to about 41% in the finals. Thats about 3-4pts per game.

Sorry, I just can't accept that his points are roughly on par so it's "ok". That's an abysmal drop-off.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-12-2012, 02:16 PM
 
3,421 posts, read 2,590,240 times
Reputation: 1238
I've come to the conclusion that lebron will never prove the doubters wrong, because no matter what he does, they will find something wrong with him. People early on make a decision on who they like and hate in sports. Once they do that, no matter what that athlete does, the haters will always find something wrong, and the supporters will always be there for the athlete. Lebron james can win six championships, but if he doesnt hit a game winning shot in the 7th game of any of them, haters will still say he is not clutch. The reality is, most haters will just continue to hate lebron no matter what. Perfect example is Kevin Durant. There was game in the playoffs where he didnt show up in the 4th quarter, but you didnt hear a peep from anybody. If lebron james doesnt show up, the radio stations and tv shows will dedicate their entire shows to why lebron didnt show up in the 4th quarter. Another example, kevin garnett and rondo dont shake hands after losing game 7, nothing but crickets. Lebron james doesnt do it after orlando, he got crushed by everybody.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-12-2012, 04:28 PM
 
Location: Earth
3,653 posts, read 3,877,543 times
Reputation: 1802
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
Bosh's shooting percentage dropped from 50% in the regular season to about 41% in the finals. Thats about 3-4pts per game.

Sorry, I just can't accept that his points are roughly on par so it's "ok". That's an abysmal drop-off.
I did state that his game 1-3 shooting numbers were bad, games 4 to 6 he shot considerably better. Lebron's percentage AND scoring average dipped, so I don't see how it's even an argument who performed worse, relative to what we expect from them. And again, anyone watching that finals saw a disengaged Lebron, to which I'll repeat that there's a difference between playing bad and playing uninspired. Lebron was the latter, and the criticisms to that end are valid. To try and compare Bosh playing subpar to Lebron and its effect on that series, is to suggest that Bosh's play overall is as crucial to the Heat's fortunes as Lebron's. It isn't, the Heat are impacted far more negatively when Lebron doesn't perform, given his all court talents and dominance. The fact that Miami made it through the East without Bosh for half of their games, and Wade's inconsistent play, exemplifies precisely Lebron's value when he's on his game.

Last edited by Roman77; 06-12-2012 at 04:42 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Sports > Basketball
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top