ESPN Poll: Dream Team 1992 vs. Current Olympic Squad (hoop, race, legends)

[KodeBlue]

Originally Posted by BajanYankee

Good thread. I thought about starting the same thread after having this discussion with my brother.

I think this current crop of players is superior at the Guard/Swing Forward position. The Kobe/MJ matchup is a wash. Even at 34, I don't see anybody locking Kobe down. Durant, Anthony, LBJ and Westbrook is a lot of fire power. Chris Paul and Deron Williams could outplay John Stockton. Magic was past his prime in 1992. I think a very strong and physical Deron Williams would give him fits. Same thing goes for Larry Bird. He was well past his prime during the Barcelona games.

I'd take Lebron James in a matchup against Barkley, Jordan or Pippen. None of those guys are big or strong enough to guard him.

Malone, Robinson and Ewing are CLEARLY superior (skill wise) to this team's Bigs. But Love has got range and Howard has got, well...Howard has got....Howard has got....muscles? He can dunk really good.

I don't think the Dream Team would demolish this current team. From a historical perspective, yes, it's the greatest team, ever assembled, but that does not mean they would take to the court and demolish players in an era where basketball is more competitive, athletic, and the training more intense than it's ever been.

You really think a 34 year old Kopy, I mean Kobe is gonna get buckets on a prime jordan? Jordan would be a younger, smarter, stronger, way more athletic version of what kobe dreams he could be. Not to mention that jordan IS a lockdown defender, even more so than scottie. Then you say Barkley Jordan and Pippen aren't strong enough to gaurd LBJ?? Jordan alone is much quicker than LBJ and about as strong, Barkley was a 6'5 power forward, that should tell you something, and Pippen is quick, agile and long enough to shut LBJ down. The league is so soft now its ridiculous. Also, Size, strength and athleticism from then to now hasn't change much (Who do think is gonna stop Karl Malone, kevin durant? LOL) Team USA doesnt stand a chance, especially from 11 HOF's from the "no blood no foul" era.

[Tappan Zee]

Originally Posted by BajanYankee

Good thread. I thought about starting the same thread after having this discussion with my brother.

I think this current crop of players is superior at the Guard/Swing Forward position. The Kobe/MJ matchup is a wash. Even at 34, I don't see anybody locking Kobe down. Durant, Anthony, LBJ and Westbrook is a lot of fire power. Chris Paul and Deron Williams could outplay John Stockton. Magic was past his prime in 1992. I think a very strong and physical Deron Williams would give him fits. Same thing goes for Larry Bird. He was well past his prime during the Barcelona games.

I'd take Lebron James in a matchup against Barkley, Jordan or Pippen. None of those guys are big or strong enough to guard him.

Malone, Robinson and Ewing are CLEARLY superior (skill wise) to this team's Bigs. But Love has got range and Howard has got, well...Howard has got....Howard has got....muscles? He can dunk really good.

I don't think the Dream Team would demolish this current team. From a historical perspective, yes, it's the greatest team, ever assembled, but that does not mean they would take to the court and demolish players in an era where basketball is more competitive, athletic, and the training more intense than it's ever been.

LOL, at the Kobe/MJ matchup. You gotta be kidding me. I mean did you watch tonight's game against Brazil, I'm sorry Kobe is looking really old in tonights game. Look what Huertas did to him, Kobe tried defending Huertas and it was frustrating to watch. Huertas broke him down, almost felt sorry for kobe. Now you want Kobe to guard Jordan in his prime, good luck.

Dream team has never been down to any international team and team 2012 was down 10 or so in the first half. Dream Team would crush this current team hands down.

[Mathguy]

Originally Posted by Hp1167

I think there's a bit of nostalgia going on in this thread.

I grew up on 80's-90's basketball. I think there were 4-5 year periods during both the 80's and 90's in which we saw some of the greatest basketball ever being played.

That said, basketball then is different than basketball now, so it makes it hard to compare.

I'm not a LeBron James fan, but I think he's being overlooked in this discussion. In so much as nobody could guard Jordan, in truth there is no one that comes close to guarding LBJ. And I really think LBJ would do a decent job of guarding MJ.

Another overlooked factor is the matchups created at given times on the floor. '92 is a deeper team; a bit more stout and bit more clutch. '12 is a more athletic team, and arguably a better wing team, combining the PG/SG/SF combinations.

If you trot out a lineup of Chris Paul, Kobe Bryant, Kevin Durant, LeBron James and Dwight Howard (should be be on the '12 team, which he rightfully should), how do you guard that team? The '92 team probably goes with Magic, MJ, Pippen, Barkley and Robinson. I give the edge to '12 in that matchup because, like Barkley says, great offense always beats great defense. Or until Kobe kills the team by playing hero ball, I guess.

But the combinations of subs make it interesting and where the '92 team gains an advantage.

I agree with many of your points but the thread started because Kobe claimed they could beat the 92' team.

Um, HOWARD isn't on the team. So, if you want to do "what if" scenarios then do so but you can't call that the 2012 team.

-Kobe is nowhere near his prime.
-Most of us give Lebron the edge at his position.
-Sorry, but NOBODY can guard Jordan. Pull up some old video...he's faster than Lebron. Pippen used to guard Jordan all the time in practices too and Lebron is not a better defender than Pippen, I will give you equal though.

Here is the bottom line:
LeBron James scores 30, USA Olympic basketball team rallies to beat Brazil | syracuse.com

The Americans believe they have a better squad than four years ago and maybe even could have beaten the Dream Team, but perhaps it’s time to end that debate.

The Dream Team never found itself in a six-point game with six minutes to go, as the Americans did after Varejao tipped in a miss. The U.S. finally pulled away in the final 4 minutes, started by consecutive baskets by James, a 3-pointer and a bucket in the lane.

I know the competition is tougher now...but DT92 is up 20 going into the 4th against that squad.

[Mathguy]

Box score from last nights exhibition.

Kobe, Melo and Durant all with more shots than points.
Kobe 1/7 from 3-pt range....seriously? Gotta get to the rim and the line guys.
Ditto for the others that were 1/4 and 0/4 from 3pt range.

http://www.usabasketball.com/misc/12_mnt_exh_02_box.pdf

[BajanYankee]

Originally Posted by KodeBlue

You really think a 34 year old Kopy, I mean Kobe is gonna get buckets on a prime jordan?

Yep. Michael Jordan was a great basketball player; he was not Jehovah. Kobe Bryant just averaged 30 ppg this past season so the notion of him scoring against any defense is not outside the realm of feasibility. Besides, Michael Jordan has never had a defensive assignment quite like Kobe Bryant (and vice versa) so there's no reason to think that he would "lock down" Kobe Bryant. I see this matchup as a wash.

Originally Posted by KodeBlue

Jordan would be a younger, smarter, stronger, way more athletic version of what kobe dreams he could be. Not to mention that jordan IS a lockdown defender, even more so than scottie.

Let's be real here. MJ is my favorite player of all time without a doubt. But let's not pretend like he had the toughest defensive assignments. Scottie usually drew those. And guarding Mitch Richmond, Ron Harper and Jeff Hornacek is not the same as guarding Lebron James, D-Wade or T-Mac or even a speedy Allen Iverson.

Originally Posted by KodeBlue

Then you say Barkley Jordan and Pippen aren't strong enough to gaurd LBJ?? Jordan alone is much quicker than LBJ and about as strong, Barkley was a 6'5 power forward, that should tell you something, and Pippen is quick, agile and long enough to shut LBJ down. The league is so soft now its ridiculous. Also, Size, strength and athleticism from then to now hasn't change much (Who do think is gonna stop Karl Malone, kevin durant? LOL) Team USA doesnt stand a chance, especially from 11 HOF's from the "no blood no foul" era.

Okay, man. You sound like my father now. We should just go right ahead and put the '92 Dream Team up on Mt. Olympus with the Temptations, the Grateful Dead, Woodstock, and the Civil Rights Movement. Nothing like them before. Nothing will ever measure up after. They're simply sacred and untouchable.

I think the only decisive advantage the Dream Team would have is at the Center position. Although Chandler is a formidable defensive presence, Ewing just had too much game. His fade away could be automatic at times. Robinson, on the other hand, was considered "soft" and basically a p**** for much of his career. We all consider him a "great" now, but that was the knock on him. That said, I don't think Team USA has anyone who really matches up well with him.

An old ass Magic Johnson and athletically underwhelming John Stockton are not a matchup for Chris Paul and Deron Williams. Paul would barbecue Stockton. Earvin had HIV by this time and was beyond his prime.

Scottie Pippen could not deal with Lebron James, Carmelo Anthony or Kevin Durant. Same goes for Clyde Drexler. Again, I think the MJ-Kobe matchup is a wash because nobody is stopping either one of those guys.

[BajanYankee]

Originally Posted by Tappan Zee

Dream team has never been down to any international team and team 2012 was down 10 or so in the first half. Dream Team would crush this current team hands down.

You can't compare international competition in 1992 to international competition in 2012. The Dream Team played a Brasilian team whose best player was a 34-year old Oscar Schmidt. You call that competition? The other Olympic teams were more concerned with snapping photos and getting autographs from the Dream Team than they were with the actual games. Those teams were clearly tourists.

Basketball is so much more globally competitive today than it was in 1992. I don't think Americans really understand that. My younger cousins in England, Sweden, Barbados, Trinidad and South Africa are as into basketball as they are into soccer (if not more). This has been happening for a while now. They're learning more about the game, they're developing the technical expertise in the sport and creating programs to develop talent, and most importantly, they have excellent athletes. It's only a matter of time before American basketball hegemony is a relic of the past.

[BajanYankee]

Originally Posted by Mathguy

I know the competition is tougher now...but DT92 is up 20 going into the 4th against that squad.

Let's keep in mind that this was an EXHIBITION. Just like this game back in 1992.

It's No Dream: Olympic Team Loses - Los Angeles Times

[Mathguy]

Originally Posted by BajanYankee

Yep. Michael Jordan was a great basketball player; he was not Jehovah. Kobe Bryant just averaged 30 ppg this past season so the notion of him scoring against any defense is not outside the realm of feasibility. Besides, Michael Jordan has never had a defensive assignment quite like Kobe Bryant (and vice versa) so there's no reason to think that he would "lock down" Kobe Bryant. I see this matchup as a wash.



Let's be real here. MJ is my favorite player of all time without a doubt. But let's not pretend like he had the toughest defensive assignments. Scottie usually drew those. And guarding Mitch Richmond, Ron Harper and Jeff Hornacek is not the same as guarding Lebron James, D-Wade or T-Mac or even a speedy Allen Iverson.



Okay, man. You sound like my father now. We should just go right ahead and put the '92 Dream Team up on Mt. Olympus with the Temptations, the Grateful Dead, Woodstock, and the Civil Rights Movement. Nothing like them before. Nothing will ever measure up after. They're simply sacred and untouchable.

I think the only decisive advantage the Dream Team would have is at the Center position. Although Chandler is a formidable defensive presence, Ewing just had too much game. His fade away could be automatic at times. Robinson, on the other hand, was considered "soft" and basically a p**** for much of his career. We all consider him a "great" now, but that was the knock on him. That said, I don't think Team USA has anyone who really matches up well with him.

An old ass Magic Johnson and athletically underwhelming John Stockton are not a matchup for Chris Paul and Deron Williams. Paul would barbecue Stockton. Earvin had HIV by this time and was beyond his prime.

Scottie Pippen could not deal with Lebron James, Carmelo Anthony or Kevin Durant. Same goes for Clyde Drexler. Again, I think the MJ-Kobe matchup is a wash because nobody is stopping either one of those guys.

I agree that nobody can stop Kobe from shooting enough to score 30points.
Did you watch the playoffs this year?
Heck OKC isn't even a great defensive squad and Kobe shot <43% in 4 of the 5 games.
It was game 4 before he shot >39%.

Kobe shot 43% this season and in the playoffs. Jordan is going to beat him by 10% in this key category.
That means Kobe is going to be 11/25 and Jordan is going to be more like 13/25. Doesn't sound like much but tossing up a 5 point handicap at the start of the game is NOT a wash.

32 is "old ass" magic johnson....yet Kobe, who is turning 34 next month and would be the 2nd oldest player on DT92 (only to Bird) is still somehow a wash against Jordan in his prime?

I'll stop there for brevity.

[Mathguy]

Originally Posted by BajanYankee

Let's keep in mind that this was an EXHIBITION. Just like this game back in 1992.

It's No Dream: Olympic Team Loses - Los Angeles Times

1. Let's see them hoist up a gold before making comparisons to DT92.

2. Hey, why not link up the box score to the game....oh wait...it was a 20 minute scrimmage.

[KodeBlue]

Originally Posted by BajanYankee

Yep. Michael Jordan was a great basketball player; he was not Jehovah. Kobe Bryant just averaged 30 ppg this past season so the notion of him scoring against any defense is not outside the realm of feasibility. Besides, Michael Jordan has never had a defensive assignment quite like Kobe Bryant (and vice versa) so there's no reason to think that he would "lock down" Kobe Bryant. I see this matchup as a wash.



Let's be real here. MJ is my favorite player of all time without a doubt. But let's not pretend like he had the toughest defensive assignments. Scottie usually drew those. And guarding Mitch Richmond, Ron Harper and Jeff Hornacek is not the same as guarding Lebron James, D-Wade or T-Mac or even a speedy Allen Iverson.



Okay, man. You sound like my father now. We should just go right ahead and put the '92 Dream Team up on Mt. Olympus with the Temptations, the Grateful Dead, Woodstock, and the Civil Rights Movement. Nothing like them before. Nothing will ever measure up after. They're simply sacred and untouchable.

I think the only decisive advantage the Dream Team would have is at the Center position. Although Chandler is a formidable defensive presence, Ewing just had too much game. His fade away could be automatic at times. Robinson, on the other hand, was considered "soft" and basically a p**** for much of his career. We all consider him a "great" now, but that was the knock on him. That said, I don't think Team USA has anyone who really matches up well with him.

An old ass Magic Johnson and athletically underwhelming John Stockton are not a matchup for Chris Paul and Deron Williams. Paul would barbecue Stockton. Earvin had HIV by this time and was beyond his prime.

Scottie Pippen could not deal with Lebron James, Carmelo Anthony or Kevin Durant. Same goes for Clyde Drexler. Again, I think the MJ-Kobe matchup is a wash because nobody is stopping either one of those guys.

I'm 27

Kobe average 30 ppg shooting at an underwhelming 43%. I'll never get why people compare Jordan to a player that's playing in a much softer league, shooting at a lower percentage, less athletic, lazy on defense, with poor shot selection...etc. Like I said, there is NO WAY kobe, or anybody from team USA, gonna stop jordan. Jordan was still dropping 50 point games at age 40. And yes, jordan would lock kobe down. Kobe is definitely one of the greatest to play the game, but Jordan is too skilled and talented for kobe.

I'm a lebron fan, but scottie would lock him down. scottie can guard 1-5 like it's nothing. Also with karl malone, barkley (Both of which are more than capable of containing Lebron) in the paint, Lebron wouldn't set foot in the paint, which also works in pippen's favor because of his perimeter defense. I would assign Malone and Robinson (Robinson would rotate between 4-5) to Melo and Durant.


Tyson chandler...LOL.

The only problem the dream team would have, comes from the pg position. Stockton would get killed against Westbrook and CP.

BTW, Magic was only 32 during the dream team days.