Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Bird is an all-time great, but LeBron is better IMO.
Among non-centers, the only guy I'd take over LeBron is Jordan. Even in that comparison, LeBron is a more well-rounded player (though Jordan was no slouch in that department), but Jordan was a much more dominant scorer.
LeBron is obviously the better physical talent. But as a total player, I'll take Bird. He did what he did in a much tougher era, against showtime Lakers and did it without forming a super team.
LeBron is obviously the better physical talent. But as a total player, I'll take Bird. He did what he did in a much tougher era, against showtime Lakers and did it without forming a super team.
A couple thoughts:
1) The NBA has A LOT more really good teams today than it did back in Bird's prime. Really, the only teams at or near the Celtics' level in Bird's prime years were the Lakers, 76ers (first half of his career), maybe the Bucks (first half of his career), and the Pistons (second half of his career).
2) Bird didn't need to form a super team because the early 1980s Celtics' management surrounded him with a super team. He played with three legitimate Hall of Famers (Kevin McHale, Robert Parish, Dennis Johnson) who had prime seasons with the Celtics, and played with a fourth Hall of Famer (Bill Walton) who had an excellent season as a supporting cast player in 1985-86, the best Bird era Celtics team. That's 3-4 more Hall of Famers in their primes than James played with in Cleveland.
None of the above is to belittle what Larry Bird did in his career; he was clearly the best player on a team that won 3 NBA titles, including on one of the greatest single-season teams in NBA history. However, LeBron James is able to do more things on the floor than Larry Bird could (both were/are great at most of the things they could do).
LeBron is obviously the better physical talent. But as a total player, I'll take Bird. He did what he did in a much tougher era, against showtime Lakers and did it without forming a super team.
Right, because his management formed the super team for him, which LeBron tried and tried to do in Cleveland.
Larry Bird - HOF 12 time All-Star
Robert Parish - HOF 9 time All-Star
Kevin McHale - HOF 7 time All-Star
Otis Birdsong - 4 time All-Star
Jim Paxson - 2 time All-Star
Danny Ainge - 1 time All-Star
Saying the current Heat is a superteam compared to the Bird Era Celtics is absurd. Larry Bird's team was the definition of a Super Team. Arguably the greatest roster to ever play together.
I'll go with the guy who doesn't sit on the bench with cramps during a Finals game
Kobe > James
I'm going to take up for LeBron for a few reasons. First, everything I've read on this states that cramps of that type can really be that debilitating. They really do hurt that badly. Heck I occasionally have had cramps occur in the lower part of my leg and when they hit you can't do ANYTHING but work to try and make them stop, it takes front and stage over everything else that may be going on with you at that point. I mean, they HURT.
Second, I am one personally that will pretty much refuse to do something in a non-air conditioned environment in a situation where it's reasonable to expect it, and I don't care what people think of me for it either. I'm one that agrees with businesses and such that totally shut down 100% if the A/C goes out, that's how it should be. This isn't the year 1820 for crying out loud.
Bicycle in the heat, okay, swim in the heat, okay (and heck, how hot can you be when you're in the water?), but pretty much anything else--nope. I have seen other similar scenarios where people are expected to do things in the heat in situations where they shouldn't have to, and it's ridiculous. My brother-in-law works in a factory and it can get up to 100 degrees in there. That's ridiculous. It's the year 2014, what in the world is wrong with the people running these places, have they never heard of air conditioning? I couldn't do a job like that, in fact I REFUSE to even if I could, and you can call me lazy if you want, I don't care. Other people can--so what? Harry Houdini could escape from handcuffs, does that mean that every person should be able to do that or they're "pansies?" Please.
"My uncle fought in Afghanistan last year when it was over 100 so spare me"--be for real, that's a WAR. Who WOULDN'T max out in life or death situations, we're talking about an actual WAR. For all the hype and talk about games "becoming a war" or such, let's face it, games are not a war. To expect people to expend themselves in a game the same as they would a war, that's ridiculous, even for all-time legends.
Third, I know that NFL and baseball players play outside, but so what? That reminds me of when people stood up for the NBA dress code saying "I have to wear a suit & tie at work myself." Apples and oranges. Should a plumber have to wear a suit & a tie too? Obviously not, with different job fields come different expectations.
To that end, I myself work in an office and I do well at it. One of the reasons why I gravitated towards office work is because I did NOT want to have to do manual labor and do it in the cold or heat. Others can do that all day long, hurray for them, but that's not me and I don't care if anyone thinks I'm a wuss for it.
And--again--it's the year 2014. Yes people used to get along without air conditioners--so what? They used to get along without polio vaccinations too, and the basketball goals used to in fact be made of actual peach baskets. So what?
2) Bird didn't need to form a super team because the early 1980s Celtics' management surrounded him with a super team. He played with three legitimate Hall of Famers (Kevin McHale, Robert Parish, Dennis Johnson) who had prime seasons with the Celtics, and played with a fourth Hall of Famer (Bill Walton) who had an excellent season as a supporting cast player in 1985-86, the best Bird era Celtics team. That's 3-4 more Hall of Famers in their primes than James played with in Cleveland.
I should note I forgot to mention Hall of Famer Tiny Archibald in my post quoted above; he played at an All-Star level on the first three or so Bird era Celtics teams. He essentially played a similar role on the first few Bird era Celtics teams that Dennis Johnson played on middle Bird era Celtics teams.
The key point remains the same - Larry Bird played with some great players in his NBA career, and as much as he made them better, they enhanced his game too. LeBron James played with nowhere near the same talent while he was with the Cavaliers. LeBron with Cleveland was sort of like Michael Jordan early in his Bulls career before Scottie Pippen and Horace Grant joined the team or became great (Pippen) or very good (Grant) players, or Jordan's two seasons with the Wizards after his second retirement.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
