Top 10 NBA Players ( Post Jordan) (fan, teams, playing, stats)
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If you look through his box scores from that playoff run he has some absolutely enormous games and many where he lead his team in every statistical category including assists.
I mean the guy is widely talked about around the league by analysts and writers as arguably the greatest PF of all time....and those guys are not Spurs loyalists.
To flat out say that Duncan shouldn't even be in consideration for best player since Jordan is grossly biased IMO.
So, where does Duncan fall short then? Can't be all-nba teams, mvps, championships or accumulated stats so what is it?
I agree. Anyone who claims that Duncan should not even be in the discussion is out of his mind. Timmy's per game numbers won't blow you away, but total stats over his career sure do!! And his per game averages aren't as impressive as Kobe's or McGrady or Iverson, but it's all a product of his willingness to play team ball. Kobe averaged 28 FGA per game during his 35ppg season. And again, that doesn't include his shot attempts where he was fouled and went to the line for 2.
I'd put it as Bryant>Duncan>James for now. Duncan is a great player, but never carried a team on his back like Kobe during his last two championships. With a must-win game on the line, there's no one you want with the ball in their hands for the last shot but Bryant.
When has Kobe ever carried his team to a championship? After Shaq left, the Lakers were a mediocre or slightly worse. Between 2004-2007 they were basically a .500 team who either didn't make the playoffs or were eliminated early. It wasn't until they got Pau Gasol and a couple other key players to compliment Kobe that they became championship contenders again. I think Lebron actually does more to carry his teams than Kobe.
It's easy to forget how dominant Duncan was during his prime (early 20s-early 30s). While he can't consistently carry the team anymore (though he does occasionally in the playoffs), he did frequently in his prime. During this period he carried the Spurs many times. If you look at his stats, his production doesn't really drop off until the 2009-2010 season when he was 35. There have been very few players who played at an elite level that late into their career.
I mean the guy is widely talked about around the league by analysts and writers as arguably the greatest PF of all time....and those guys are not Spurs loyalists.
To flat out say that Duncan shouldn't even be in consideration for best player since Jordan is grossly biased IMO.
So, where does Duncan fall short then? Can't be all-nba teams, mvps, championships or accumulated stats so what is it?
Best being dominant. I dont think he's top two post Jordan. Obviously he's in the discussion but more like #3-4, probably 3 with all things considered. Nothing to be ashamed of.
Best being dominant. I dont think he's top two post Jordan. Obviously he's in the discussion but more like #3-4, probably 3 with all things considered. Nothing to be ashamed of.
To me best means does the most to help the team win. I'm not saying Kobe and Shaq didn't, but Duncan is more about overall team-play and winning than the two egomaniacs.
To me best means does the most to help the team win. I'm not saying Kobe and Shaq didn't, but Duncan is more about overall team-play and winning than the two egomaniacs.
Only because you are a Duncan fan. Is he as good a scorer as either of them? No. Is he as dominant as Shaq? No. Kobe? No. Where is he better? Longevity? Ok, but that doesnt make him the best. It makes him Cal Ripken or Bret Favre..
I'd put it as Bryant>Duncan>James for now. Duncan is a great player, but never carried a team on his back like Kobe during his last two championships. With a must-win game on the line, there's no one you want with the ball in their hands for the last shot but Bryant.
Never carried a team? How old are you? 15? Duncan absolutely carried those early 2000s teams. In 2003 he dragged David Robinson's corpse, 20 year old Parker (who was getting benched for Speedy Claxton late in games) and NBA newcomer Manu to a title. Re-watch game six of the Lakers series and how he absolutely dominated Shaq. Watch game 6 of the finals where he damn near had a quadruple double.
Way too many people on this forum make baseless statements without doing the proper education.
Only because you are a Duncan fan. Is he as good a scorer as either of them? No. Is he as dominant as Shaq? No. Kobe? No. Where is he better? Longevity? Ok, but that doesnt make him the best. It makes him Cal Ripken or Bret Favre..
Compared to Shaq, Duncan is a better defender, passer, and shooter, and about as good a rebounder. When Shaq was more than 10' away from the basket he was usually pretty useless. Duncan can actually pass from the top of the key, whereas Shaq made obvious passes to shooters from the key. The only advantage Shaq has is individual scoring; Duncan is better or as good in every other facet of the game.
Kobe is certainly a better individual scorer, but Duncan is a better rebounder and passer. Defensively they're probably about even, though Duncan is an interior defender while Kobe is perimeter, so we can't really compare apples-to-apples in that area.
I think an argument can be made that Duncan and Kobe are about equally good, but very different players. But in terms of actual skill Duncan is better than Shaq. Shaq basically just steamrolled other players with size and strength, while Duncan in his prime was a beautiful combination of fundamental acumen and athleticism. He also never let himself go physically the way Shaq did at times.
I think someone else might have already posted this, but it's worth another look: Game 6 highlights of the 2003 Western Conference Semis. Shaq and Duncan both had great games, but compare the two. Duncan scores in a wide variety of ways, while pretty much all Shaq's points are in the paint. Duncan's superior passing skills are also evident. Sorry, but anyone who can't see that Duncan is better is missing something: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rR6AgYWdoBQ
Quote:
Originally Posted by UTHORNS96
Never carried a team? How old are you? 15? Duncan absolutely carried those early 2000s teams. In 2003 he dragged David Robinson's corpse, 20 year old Parker (who was getting benched for Speedy Claxton late in games) and NBA newcomer Manu to a title. Re-watch game six of the Lakers series and how he absolutely dominated Shaq. Watch game 6 of the finals where he damn near had a quadruple double.
Way too many people on this forum make baseless statements without doing the proper education.
That's exactly the problem. Many posters are only thinking of the Duncan over the last few seasons. He had several monster games during mid to late 20s peak. I don't think Shaq ever played as well as Duncan did during game 6 against the Nets.
Last edited by PanapolicRiddle; 07-18-2015 at 01:48 PM..
Only because you are a Duncan fan. Is he as good a scorer as either of them? No. Is he as dominant as Shaq? No. Kobe? No. Where is he better? Longevity? Ok, but that doesnt make him the best. It makes him Cal Ripken or Bret Favre..
He sure beat the crap out of Shaquille and Kobe on their own court to knock them out of the playoffs in the box score I linked to and there are many more like that.
Duncan is also a much better ball-handler than Shaq. He doesn't do it much anymore, but during his prime he would often lead the fast break after grabbing a board. How many other 7' 270 pd players were ever capable of doing that? I can't think of any right off hand, and Shaq certainly wasn't.
So Duncan is a better defender, passer, shooter, and ball-handler than Shaq. In terms of individual scoring in the paint Shaq was more dominant, but Duncan is better in every other facet of the game. Does this effectively explain why Duncan is better overall?
Last edited by PanapolicRiddle; 07-19-2015 at 10:42 AM..
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