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Old 12-13-2017, 12:55 PM
 
3,565 posts, read 1,879,512 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eddiehaskell View Post
Thunder won 47 games despite losing a top 2-3 player and having a pretty bad roster. Iíd say they somewhat exceeded expectations.
A pretty bad roster full of players who are now contributors on other rosters (most notably Victor Oladipo, shackled by Westbrook, but also Steven Adams, Taj Gibson, Enes Kanter, Roberson, Payne, McDermott, maybe even Sabonis)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
I'm going to have to offer the following two counter-points.

1) Steve Nash
2) Steve Nash
Nash won one when his team had the best regular season record and he was likely their best player. He won the second one with the NBA's 4th best record, again leading the league in assists while delivering the league's 2nd best shooting efficiency (after Shaq). There were other viable candidates in both of those years, but Nash led a successful team. Westbrook didn't.
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Old 12-13-2017, 08:46 PM
 
Location: Springfield, Ohio
12,201 posts, read 10,436,423 times
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I just don't think you can put up the numbers Westbrook did (padded or not) and not win the MVP. He has the explosiveness of Iverson with the all around game of Oscar Robinson.
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Old 12-14-2017, 06:13 AM
 
52,055 posts, read 41,872,746 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCityTheBridge View Post
Nash won one when his team had the best regular season record and he was likely their best player. He won the second one with the NBA's 4th best record, again leading the league in assists while delivering the league's 2nd best shooting efficiency (after Shaq). There were other viable candidates in both of those years, but Nash led a successful team. Westbrook didn't.
So the vast majority of the time the voters get awards right.....
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Old 12-14-2017, 07:02 AM
 
5,450 posts, read 1,554,927 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Natural510 View Post
I just don't think you can put up the numbers Westbrook did (padded or not) and not win the MVP. He has the explosiveness of Iverson with the all around game of Oscar Robinson.
I'd have to look at videos of Oscar Robertson and see if his teammates only cared about boxing out.....
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Old 12-14-2017, 08:35 AM
 
3,804 posts, read 1,390,327 times
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I cant wait to see the Thunder/Sixers game on ESPN tomorrow night.
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Old 12-14-2017, 09:11 AM
 
11,680 posts, read 7,063,091 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCityTheBridge View Post
A pretty bad roster full of players who are now contributors on other rosters (most notably Victor Oladipo, shackled by Westbrook, but also Steven Adams, Taj Gibson, Enes Kanter, Roberson, Payne, McDermott, maybe even Sabonis)
None of those players were stars with or without Westbrook. Oladipo now looks legit (will probably never lead a contender), but he spent 4 years with the Magic averaging 14-18 ppg...basically the same numbers with Westbrook. He put up a pathetic 11ppg on 34% shooting in the playoffs...is that on Westbrook? He shot 6-25 from 3 - Westbrookís fault? THAT was supposed to be the Thunderís 2nd best offensive threat. And before you say Westbrook had to be holding him back, remember that Durant played with Westbrook and still averaged his usual 25-30 ppg.

McDermott = role player
Roberson = role player
Sabonis = rookie
Payne = garbage

Adams, Kanter and Gibson are all role players too. I think we see that in todayís NBA you donít win a lot with one star surrounded by role players. The last team do that might have been the Mavs in 2011...although they had vets/proven stars that settled in the role player positions.

Speaking of role players:

One Team, One Stat -- In playoffs, Oklahoma City Thunder collapsed without Russell Westbrook | NBA.com

The Thunder were garbage without Westbrook on the floor. Some of these guys put up better numbers on teams where they are forced into a larger role, but what prevented them from stepping up in the playoffs where it really counts?
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Old 12-14-2017, 09:33 AM
 
Location: California
1,191 posts, read 1,287,999 times
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The MVP award is VERY subjective. The narrative around the award changes depending on which players are favored by the media in certain years. Some years its the "best player on the best team" award. Other years its the "where would his team be without him" award. And sometimes its the "we're tired of giving it to this guy so lets give it to someone else" award. Finally, there's the "we should have given him at least one by now" award.

Best player on best team award:
Dirk 2007

Where would his team be without him:
Westbrook 2017

We're tired of giving it to this other guy:
Derek Rose 2011 (LeBron James)
Karl Malone 1997 (Micheal Jordan)

We should have given him at least one by now:
Kobe Bryant 2008

There are plenty more examples of each. There is one last one. Some years its just obvious because one player sets himself apart from everyone else. Think Shaq in 2000 and Curry in 2016.
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Old 12-14-2017, 01:46 PM
 
5,450 posts, read 1,554,927 times
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That 2008 Kobe Bryant MVP was simply horrific.
Highway robbery, and the media tried to justify it by pointing to the last regular season meeting between New Orleans and LA as being the deciding factor....
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Old 12-14-2017, 04:19 PM
 
Location: Springfield, Ohio
12,201 posts, read 10,436,423 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amenalot View Post
That 2008 Kobe Bryant MVP was simply horrific.
Highway robbery, and the media tried to justify it by pointing to the last regular season meeting between New Orleans and LA as being the deciding factor....
I think half the time itís just a means to give a nod to a great player who they think should have an MVP under his belt, like the Oscars. Sometimes players just have a monsterous season which canít be ignored, like Westbrook last year, Curry the year before, Lebron in Miami, etc.
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Old 12-14-2017, 06:16 PM
 
52,055 posts, read 41,872,746 times
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The MVP award is a complete wildcard from the standard all-nba awards. It's really more of a team award but can encompass other factors as well.

With that said, I only brought this up because another poster claimed that "unfair" MVP awards invalidated all the all-nba awards only to reverse course about how MVP awards were fair when I mentioned Nash.

However in their mind, proving that Draymond Green was really better than Barkley despite not being made any better by Steph Curry and others because although they always make players around them better it doesn't diminish the awesomeness of the guys being made better because....that doesn't count. LMFAO.

Just putting the "coupe de grace" on this utter logical pile of bull poo.
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