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Old 10-23-2017, 03:26 PM
 
2,838 posts, read 1,781,508 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCityTheBridge View Post
I don't buy drive and hunger as the difference makers. I buy talent. Same as last year, the Warriors are more talented than all of their competition. Health would not have helped the Blazers, Jazz, or Spurs get over the GSW mountain last year.

Durant was integrated last year because Steph Curry is the most unselfish superstar in basketball.



I expect Giannis has improved--he's at an age where players typically make big strides. He & the Bucks will be really fun to watch this year and for years to come.

The Warriors are playing like they're still in preseason. There's nothing broken, just a lack of game conditioning & focus. They will be fine.

I think Paul & Harden will work well together.
Yet we have yearly examples of drive and hunger working for the better and for the worse.
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Old 10-23-2017, 04:20 PM
 
3,565 posts, read 1,877,900 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eastcoastbias View Post
Yet we have yearly examples of drive and hunger working for the better and for the worse.
I am very curious what you mean by that. I think drive and hunger separates the good from the great primarily in the offseason and during practice. The greats are working on their game & their bodies, while the good are taking a (relative) break.

These players got to this level because they are competitors. They try to win because they are competitors.
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Old 10-23-2017, 07:20 PM
 
52,015 posts, read 41,851,918 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eastcoastbias View Post
Yet they were 100% healthy when it mattered. Maybe I point this out more because it seemed like everyone in their path had a key injury (aside from Cle) during crunch time.


Drive and Hunger can play a huge role. You had guys like Durant playing with a massive chip on his shoulder and the Warriors in general trying to bury a 73 win no title year where they firmly believed they should have won. This factor didn't surprise me, but is it present this year???


What surprised me was the quick integration of a Superstar like Durant- say what you want about that's just the way the organization works and its the culture- but you are pairing two former MVPs together and you have one ball. Year 1 it worked well. I have no reason to believe it won't work well again.


But will injuries come into play and will there be the same axe to grind type mentality that really made the Warriors a tough out last year.
1) Injuries always come into play. They predetermined many classic Spurs-Lakers matchups in the early 2000's.

2) GS is hugely talented. Durant is top 2 or 3 in the league just for starters. That being said, GS had been playing a lot of games. I'm not going to predict sh*t until I see who is banged up or out of the season for the rest of the year which takes us forward about 80 games.

3) GS learned a hard lesson chasing the regular season win record. It now appears they're following the old formula of past repeat champions and rolling through the regular season rested. We'll see if that works for them.
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Old 10-24-2017, 07:54 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCityTheBridge View Post
I am very curious what you mean by that. I think drive and hunger separates the good from the great primarily in the offseason and during practice. The greats are working on their game & their bodies, while the good are taking a (relative) break.

These players got to this level because they are competitors. They try to win because they are competitors.
When you have an entire team trying to right a wrong (losing in 16) and a Superstar bound and determined to justify a move that was questioned (Durant) it is a perfect recipe to put your head down and mow through the grind of 100 games. Again loads of talent + hungry for many reasons (a few stated above).


Conversely, JR was paid Tristan was paid, Lebron delivered a chip, Lue supposedly straightened the ship. Going into 17 was a little different and the Cavs were a great team as well. Last season, Do you the think the listless Cavs were the 2nd best team in Eastern Conference? They certainly played like it through most of the year and Celtics were the #1 seed (a team not as talented but clearly hungry).


Taking it out of the Cavs Warriors Celtics context and team context- you have guys playing in contract years that all of sudden look a little more explosive- got an extra bounce. I think the norm is the drive and hunger to ebb and flow and not stay constant.
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Old 10-24-2017, 09:55 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCityTheBridge View Post
Keep dreaming. <Knocking on wood> If healthy, the Warriors will cruise to the Finals and collect #3 over a valiant effort from LBJ. You have to measure them against the 90s Bulls, the Shaq/Kobe Lakers, and other all-time great teams because that is where they belong.
Golden State so far have proven that they don't belong with the 90s Bulls.
The 90s Bulls 3-peated twice.
The Warriors failed to even win 2 championships in a row.
The 90s Rockets are better than this Warriors team, so are Shaq-Kobe Lakers and Kobe-Gasol Lakers.
Talking a lot (which is what Klay did, instead of proving it on the court) doesn't help.
The other problem with Warriors is, they don't have an aura.
Magic Johnson's Lakers had an aura, so did Larry Bird's Celtics and Michael Jordan's Bulls.
Golden State are just a bunch of 3-point shooters.
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Old 10-24-2017, 10:22 AM
 
2,838 posts, read 1,781,508 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amenalot View Post
Golden State so far have proven that they don't belong with the 90s Bulls.
The 90s Bulls 3-peated twice.
The Warriors failed to even win 2 championships in a row.
The 90s Rockets are better than this Warriors team, so are Shaq-Kobe Lakers and Kobe-Gasol Lakers.
Talking a lot (which is what Klay did, instead of proving it on the court) doesn't help.
The other problem with Warriors is, they don't have an aura.
Magic Johnson's Lakers had an aura, so did Larry Bird's Celtics and Michael Jordan's Bulls.
Golden State are just a bunch of 3-point shooters.
I'm Cavs fan and quite honestly care very little about the Warriors. But 90s Rockets are not better than this Warrior team neither are Kobe-Gasol Lakers, you could debate the Shaq Kobe Lakers (I think those Laker teams present matchups problems with the Warriors). I think fans of both squads (maybe they are really the same fans HAHA) will point out that Shaq would be useless in the series but Laker fans would point out that guys like Draymond and Durant would be in foul trouble.


I don't think the Warriors are likeable...but who cares. Do they have an aura- I say no. They have a killer instinct- they can pull away and pour it on against any team. I think Lebron steals some of the aura in the matchups that we've previously seen, but the Cavs don't possess it either. The 90s Bulls I would argue had the aura- I don't know of too many teams in recent history that have had an aura.
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Old 10-24-2017, 10:41 AM
 
3,565 posts, read 1,877,900 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eastcoastbias View Post
When you have an entire team trying to right a wrong (losing in 16) and a Superstar bound and determined to justify a move that was questioned (Durant) it is a perfect recipe to put your head down and mow through the grind of 100 games. Again loads of talent + hungry for many reasons (a few stated above).

Conversely, JR was paid Tristan was paid, Lebron delivered a chip, Lue supposedly straightened the ship. Going into 17 was a little different and the Cavs were a great team as well. Last season, Do you the think the listless Cavs were the 2nd best team in Eastern Conference? They certainly played like it through most of the year and Celtics were the #1 seed (a team not as talented but clearly hungry).

Taking it out of the Cavs Warriors Celtics context and team context- you have guys playing in contract years that all of sudden look a little more explosive- got an extra bounce. I think the norm is the drive and hunger to ebb and flow and not stay constant.
I don't buy it at all. Draymond got paid and then became DPOY--he's a competitor. Curry won in '15, then built on his game in the offseason to produce one of the greatest seasons in NBA history. Hunger wasn't the problem. He's one of the greats, and he understands that he will separate himself with the offseason work.

The Cavs last year were talented and flawed. The Celtics were talented and young. They had no answer to LBJ's brilliance, and that doomed them in the ECF. It wasn't hunger, it was one of the best ever playing maybe the best basketball of his career.

Quote:
Originally Posted by amenalot View Post
Golden State so far have proven that they don't belong with the 90s Bulls.
The 90s Bulls 3-peated twice.
The Warriors failed to even win 2 championships in a row.
The 90s Rockets are better than this Warriors team, so are Shaq-Kobe Lakers and Kobe-Gasol Lakers.
Talking a lot (which is what Klay did, instead of proving it on the court) doesn't help.
The other problem with Warriors is, they don't have an aura.
Magic Johnson's Lakers had an aura, so did Larry Bird's Celtics and Michael Jordan's Bulls.
Golden State are just a bunch of 3-point shooters.
You can't recognize the greatness on display in GS and it's too bad.

Steph Curry broke basketball defense at the NBA level, and nobody has figured out how to fix it.

Draymond Green is one of the best post defenders, one of the best perimeter defenders, and the best help defender in the NBA--at 6'6".

Klay is one of the best shooters ever, and also delivered 1st team all-defense work on the perimeter in the playoffs.

KD is one of the best scorers ever to play, and a nightmare on defense when he is locked in.

There is plenty of aura, plenty of talent, and this is the best team in basketball. You can only measure them with the all-time greats, because that is the pantheon where they belong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by eastcoastbias View Post
I'm Cavs fan and quite honestly care very little about the Warriors. But 90s Rockets are not better than this Warrior team neither are Kobe-Gasol Lakers, you could debate the Shaq Kobe Lakers (I think those Laker teams present matchups problems with the Warriors). I think fans of both squads (maybe they are really the same fans HAHA) will point out that Shaq would be useless in the series but Laker fans would point out that guys like Draymond and Durant would be in foul trouble.

I don't think the Warriors are likeable...but who cares. Do they have an aura- I say no. They have a killer instinct- they can pull away and pour it on against any team. I think Lebron steals some of the aura in the matchups that we've previously seen, but the Cavs don't possess it either. The 90s Bulls I would argue had the aura- I don't know of too many teams in recent history that have had an aura.
My bold prediction for this year is that the Warriors lose a playoff game. It barely happened last year. What made the Jordan Bulls, the Showtime Lakers, the Motion Spurs, and the Heatles great was great players playing elevated basketball--elite offense and elite defense. These Warriors are that team in the mid-2010s. They still have to compete with one of the best players ever to play, still in his prime--a challenge Jordan did not face during the Bulls' championship runs. I think it's the best thing for basketball since Jordan--reminiscent of the Lakers-Celtics era in the 80s.
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Old 10-24-2017, 02:47 PM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
28,269 posts, read 26,273,936 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amenalot View Post
The Warriors failed to even win 2 championships in a row.
Don't we need to wait a few seasons to make a statement like this? It's like saying Jordan Spieth will never be on Tiger's level because he's failed to accomplish at age 24 what Tiger had already accomplished by age 26. Chances are Spieth won't match Tiger, just as the chances are that the Warriors won't match the Bulls, but we've at least have to give them the chance to, right?
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Old 10-24-2017, 07:33 PM
 
Location: Here or There
3,962 posts, read 2,514,962 times
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Should I be surprised that in Game 3 of the season, Curry is throwing a mouthpiece again, and Durant got ejected? Durant's middle "ring" finger to the crowd was pretty pathetic.
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Old 10-24-2017, 11:34 PM
 
Location: Springfield, Ohio
12,201 posts, read 10,431,779 times
Reputation: 11220
Quote:
Originally Posted by eastcoastbias View Post

I don't think the Warriors are likeable...but who cares. Do they have an aura- I say no. They have a killer instinct- they can pull away and pour it on against any team. I think Lebron steals some of the aura in the matchups that we've previously seen, but the Cavs don't possess it either. The 90s Bulls I would argue had the aura- I don't know of too many teams in recent history that have had an aura.
No one in sports these days has that mystique you guys speak of, with the advent of cyberspace and the 24-hours sports channels. Magic, Kareem and Bird were shown on TV once a week and their legends grew by not using Twitter and not being followed around 24-7 by content-starved sports cable channels digging for any soundbite possible to over-analyze.
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