U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Sports > Basketball
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 03-13-2018, 01:53 PM
 
Location: Honolulu, HI
6,105 posts, read 1,833,046 times
Reputation: 8673

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gregory05 View Post
Warriors will not defeat the Rockets in the playoffs without a healthy Steph Curry. Those two losses recently against the other playoff contenders (Trailblazers, Timberwolves} just proved Kevin Durant shows lack of leadership to carry the team.
I donít know about that, KD can turn it up in the playoffs. Plus Klay Thompson.

We have to assume the rockets wonít be the warriors until proven otherwise.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 03-13-2018, 03:34 PM
 
2,286 posts, read 1,511,805 times
Reputation: 1143
It looks like Warriors without Curry is: Durant scores 40 points, they lose. Or might win a close one if their opponent isn't too great. With Curry in, they win by 10+. Individually, KD is a much better player, but that's not their system.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-13-2018, 04:18 PM
 
Location: Western US
498 posts, read 142,143 times
Reputation: 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by rarog View Post
It looks like Warriors without Curry is: Durant scores 40 points, they lose. Or might win a close one if their opponent isn't too great. With Curry in, they win by 10+. Individually, KD is a much better player, but that's not their system.
Stephen Curry is Golden State's most important player. It's just not the same without him.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-13-2018, 06:12 PM
 
3,565 posts, read 1,876,340 times
Reputation: 2263
Quote:
Originally Posted by rarog View Post
It looks like Warriors without Curry is: Durant scores 40 points, they lose. Or might win a close one if their opponent isn't too great. With Curry in, they win by 10+. Individually, KD is a much better player, but that's not their system.
I continue to be entertained by those who say that KD is (some variation of) a better player, but he just can't win like Curry can. The proof is in the pudding: Curry led the top point differential team for 3 years prior to this. KD joined the top point differential team last year. Curry led a team to the Finals 3 straight years. KD joined a team that went to the Finals last year--his second career appearance.

The point is to win the games. Curry is better at it than KD. The reasons are obvious to the eyeballs: Curry's offensive game is more complete--especially all of the elements that involve the team: passing, screening, directing traffic, using screens, ball handling, pushing in transition, decision-making. And while KD is an incredible--and efficient--scorer, Curry is still a bit more efficient at scoring.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SawuScimitar74 View Post
Stephen Curry is Golden State's most important player. It's just not the same without him.
It's not the same without him because he is the model Nellieball point guard. He has all of the basketball skills, top flight IQ, and great speed with the ball. We are in the pace and space era--the Nellieball era. And the best Nellieball point guard is the ultimate offensive weapon--a force multiplier for the offense.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-13-2018, 11:32 PM
 
Location: Western US
498 posts, read 142,143 times
Reputation: 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCityTheBridge View Post
I continue to be entertained by those who say that KD is (some variation of) a better player, but he just can't win like Curry can. The proof is in the pudding: Curry led the top point differential team for 3 years prior to this. KD joined the top point differential team last year. Curry led a team to the Finals 3 straight years. KD joined a team that went to the Finals last year--his second career appearance.

The point is to win the games. Curry is better at it than KD. The reasons are obvious to the eyeballs: Curry's offensive game is more complete--especially all of the elements that involve the team: passing, screening, directing traffic, using screens, ball handling, pushing in transition, decision-making. And while KD is an incredible--and efficient--scorer, Curry is still a bit more efficient at scoring.



It's not the same without him because he is the model Nellieball point guard. He has all of the basketball skills, top flight IQ, and great speed with the ball. We are in the pace and space era--the Nellieball era. And the best Nellieball point guard is the ultimate offensive weapon--a force multiplier for the offense.
Exactly. Stephen Curry is literally the engine to what the Warriors do. Not only is he the best shooter in NBA history, he is also an excellent passer. Steph is definitely one of the smartest players as well. While he excels at shooting the ball, he cares very deeply about getting his teammates involved, as he knows he can't do it all by himself. No one can do it by themselves.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-15-2018, 08:03 AM
 
91 posts, read 67,233 times
Reputation: 173
Quote:
Originally Posted by callofdutyplayer View Post
Can the Rockets beat the Warriors in a 7 game series in the playoffs? Seems like the Rockets have more shooters and a better team
I'm a lifelong Warriors fan (there were many hopeless seasons prior to the sale of the team) who watches nearly every game. I don't think the league has ever seen the combination of defensive and offensive ruthlessness that the team displayed over the previous three years. This year they seem a bit 'off' on defense, while the rest of the league has made up a lot of ground on their style offensively.

At the beginning of the year I scoffed at the Rockets because I didn't think they could compete with the Warriors on the defensive side of the ball. With the Dubs' slippage there, and the Rockets' improved focus on D (check out their scores of late, they seem to be gearing up for playoff style ball), I think it will be a very tight series. I'd say Warriors in 6, but the games will be mostly wire-to-wire.

One thing I've noticed with my team: they do not handle the hype very well. The Warriors have played this entire season with a high level of arrogance. If they do fall short this year, it will be because they messed around and let the Rockets get HCA, and presumably the easier road to the WCF. When these Warriors won their first title in 2015, they were not expected to do so and thus played with the hunger of an upstart. After that year, many people, including coaches like Doc Rivers, called them "lucky". That fueled them for 2016 when they won 73 games. In 2017, they were fueled by blowing a 3-1 Finals lead, and all the resulting jokes. This year, they started the season as the OVERWHELMING favorites, and what we see is the most losses in the Kerr era with still 15+ games to go, lackadaisacal defense, Kerr letting the players coach entire games just for kicks, Twitter wars, etc.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-15-2018, 11:48 AM
 
3,565 posts, read 1,876,340 times
Reputation: 2263
Quote:
Originally Posted by buggzy702 View Post
I'm a lifelong Warriors fan (there were many hopeless seasons prior to the sale of the team) who watches nearly every game. I don't think the league has ever seen the combination of defensive and offensive ruthlessness that the team displayed over the previous three years. This year they seem a bit 'off' on defense, while the rest of the league has made up a lot of ground on their style offensively.

At the beginning of the year I scoffed at the Rockets because I didn't think they could compete with the Warriors on the defensive side of the ball. With the Dubs' slippage there, and the Rockets' improved focus on D (check out their scores of late, they seem to be gearing up for playoff style ball), I think it will be a very tight series. I'd say Warriors in 6, but the games will be mostly wire-to-wire.

One thing I've noticed with my team: they do not handle the hype very well. The Warriors have played this entire season with a high level of arrogance. If they do fall short this year, it will be because they messed around and let the Rockets get HCA, and presumably the easier road to the WCF. When these Warriors won their first title in 2015, they were not expected to do so and thus played with the hunger of an upstart. After that year, many people, including coaches like Doc Rivers, called them "lucky". That fueled them for 2016 when they won 73 games. In 2017, they were fueled by blowing a 3-1 Finals lead, and all the resulting jokes. This year, they started the season as the OVERWHELMING favorites, and what we see is the most losses in the Kerr era with still 15+ games to go, lackadaisacal defense, Kerr letting the players coach entire games just for kicks, Twitter wars, etc.
What we are seeing this year is a combination of two factors, imo: 1) injuries, and 2) a veteran team that knows its own capability and isn't pressing hard every night. They are cruising to a potential 60 win season, and they will spend the 1st two rounds of the playoffs tightening up. Deep playoff runs take their toll. Home court won't be a major factor in the WCF. As long as the Dubs are healthy, neither of the top 2 seeds will have a tough road to the WCF, and the WCF is bound to be a challenge for both teams.

We've still seen this team turn it on for quarters and halves. The WCF will be a tight series because the Rockets are a great team.

Don't forget how bored Curry was with human basketball in '15-'16--almost every night he made/attempted to make one or two plays utterly incomprehensible to conventional basketball thinking. I'm not worried about this team getting focused when the games matter. I'm worried about this team getting and staying healthy for those games.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-16-2018, 05:11 AM
 
Location: Virginia Beach
4,212 posts, read 2,833,476 times
Reputation: 4502
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCityTheBridge View Post
What we are seeing this year is a combination of two factors, imo: 1) injuries, and 2) a veteran team that knows its own capability and isn't pressing hard every night. They are cruising to a potential 60 win season, and they will spend the 1st two rounds of the playoffs tightening up. Deep playoff runs take their toll. Home court won't be a major factor in the WCF. As long as the Dubs are healthy, neither of the top 2 seeds will have a tough road to the WCF, and the WCF is bound to be a challenge for both teams.

We've still seen this team turn it on for quarters and halves. The WCF will be a tight series because the Rockets are a great team.

Don't forget how bored Curry was with human basketball in '15-'16--almost every night he made/attempted to make one or two plays utterly incomprehensible to conventional basketball thinking. I'm not worried about this team getting focused when the games matter. I'm worried about this team getting and staying healthy for those games.
Again, a very optimistic view. For your sake, I hope you're right, because you are ignoring some signs besides injuries...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-16-2018, 07:52 AM
 
91 posts, read 67,233 times
Reputation: 173
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCityTheBridge View Post
What we are seeing this year is a combination of two factors, imo: 1) injuries, and 2) a veteran team that knows its own capability and isn't pressing hard every night. They are cruising to a potential 60 win season, and they will spend the 1st two rounds of the playoffs tightening up. Deep playoff runs take their toll. Home court won't be a major factor in the WCF. As long as the Dubs are healthy, neither of the top 2 seeds will have a tough road to the WCF, and the WCF is bound to be a challenge for both teams.

We've still seen this team turn it on for quarters and halves. The WCF will be a tight series because the Rockets are a great team.

Don't forget how bored Curry was with human basketball in '15-'16--almost every night he made/attempted to make one or two plays utterly incomprehensible to conventional basketball thinking. I'm not worried about this team getting focused when the games matter. I'm worried about this team getting and staying healthy for those games.
You are saying pretty much the same thing as some of my friends back in the Bay Area. Early on it was "they are bored with the early season, wait till the mid-point of the season". Then it was "wait till the All-Star Break". Then it was "Houston's post-break schedule is murderous, the Warriors will overtake them in the standings". Now it's "the #1 seed doesn't matter anyways".

I live in Vegas now, and the oddsmakers here still have the Warriors as strong favorites. As I previously posted, I think they'll still come out of the West, but I've watched the games and I see some slippage. Primarily, Livingston and Iguadola are not as productive as they've been, 2018 Nick Young is worse than 2017 Pat McCaw, and they are getting exposed a bit at center. Health is the most important thing at this point, but it would behoove them to get into "playoff mode" now and not just wait till the playoffs.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-16-2018, 10:57 AM
 
3,565 posts, read 1,876,340 times
Reputation: 2263
Quote:
Originally Posted by buggzy702 View Post
You are saying pretty much the same thing as some of my friends back in the Bay Area. Early on it was "they are bored with the early season, wait till the mid-point of the season". Then it was "wait till the All-Star Break". Then it was "Houston's post-break schedule is murderous, the Warriors will overtake them in the standings". Now it's "the #1 seed doesn't matter anyways".

I live in Vegas now, and the oddsmakers here still have the Warriors as strong favorites. As I previously posted, I think they'll still come out of the West, but I've watched the games and I see some slippage. Primarily, Livingston and Iguadola are not as productive as they've been, 2018 Nick Young is worse than 2017 Pat McCaw, and they are getting exposed a bit at center. Health is the most important thing at this point, but it would behoove them to get into "playoff mode" now and not just wait till the playoffs.
The oddsmakers are responding to the bets. Last year, the Warriors didn't wake up to playoff basketball until after the 1st half of Game 1 of the WCF. They were playing regular season--in some cases preseason--basketball for the first two rounds.

Iguodala has had a lot more bounce after the all-star break. His body looks ready & the Warriors don't need numbers from him. They need his defense, his ability to push in transition, and his IQ. Livingston looks like the same guy he was last year: a wing who can give some minutes with length & ball handling. West, who you didn't mention, has been a fantastic small ball 5 this year. If he can get healthy, Bell looks like a quality speed 5. Nick Young is going to do Nick Young things. McCaw did not have a heavy playoff load, and Nick Young offers more right now than McCaw does (though I think McCaw will be a better pro when all is said and done). Zaza remains an effective center, giving this team exactly what it needs from a 5. Of course, he may be unplayable against Capella.

The most important thing now is health. Give Curry & Bell time to rest their ankles. Give Klay time to heal his hand. Get Dray some nights off for his shoulder/back. If they lose out the rest of the way, that's fine. If they need to shake out some rust in Round 1, that's fine. The 1 seed would be nice, but you have to realize that health is far more important to this team than seeding or home court.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Sports > Basketball
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top