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Old 09-27-2015, 12:55 PM
 
Location: Old Mother Idaho
21,230 posts, read 14,251,947 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pnwguy2 View Post
Exactly.

And the same with Idaho. Unfortunately, a few odd, crazy folks have brought this racist/bigoted idea to the rest of the country. Also, unfortunately, a few posts here and there will not dispel it anytime soon. I can just go on my experience living in Idaho the past decade+, in both Boise and other smaller areas. I will repeat, I have never experienced racial or religious bigoted ideas in my time there. I can only speak for myself, and yes, I am a white male who is non-LDS. I no longer live in Idaho, but its racial or religious climate is not the reason I left. For those who choose to keep this argument alive, so be it, but in my true belief, it is false.
As an old native, I think the reality lies in the middle. I believe there is more discrimination of all kinds than you experienced, but less than some other folks have experienced.

Idahoans tend to keep their prejudices to themselves unless there is something that arouses them, and we all tend to be polite in a superficial way, because we don't have a lot of people around us all the time as it is in big cities and states with larger populations.

Prejudice in many areas of life does exist here, but for newcomers, a lot of it depends on who a newcomer gets to know and becomes friends with. There are just as many folks who have no great prejudices as those who do here, and I do agree that Idaho is slowly changing in this.

For sure, Idaho is not like a southern state in this regard. The bigotry of the west is all it's own style, as the forces of nature here in the northwest forces us all to overcome our human differences for mutual benefit and survival regularly. There are very few states left where a beautiful sunny morning can turn into a fight for life when a blizzard roars in around 3 in the afternoon, and there is no one around for miles in any direction.

This is something every person who lives here long enough will encounter. And until one does, no newcomer will ever truly understand why we are who we are here.

Don't let city life in Boise fool you; when I lived in the Treasure Valley years ago, a young wife who got into a little spat with her husband left home with her kids to cool down with a little drive around the Boise foothills. When authorities finally found her car, she and 3 of her children were dead from exposure, and the sole surviving child barely made it.

Even though Boise has grown, we are all as vulnerable to nature as ever.
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Old 09-27-2015, 01:45 PM
 
Location: Boise
2,008 posts, read 2,971,858 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluesmama View Post
We just spent a week in Boise 5 to 6 weeks ago, and no - we do not think Boise has the worst drivers. We could see some increasing problems soon, judging by all the construction giving way to growth.

But as it is now, the only thing we complained about were the LONGEST timed traffic lights ever. Maybe it helps with the flow, I don't know.
One thing about Idaho is that it is a driving area. There isn't much for public transportation and everyone pretty much depends on their cars. Considering the population of the treasure valley, the traffic would lead you to think the population is several times what it is. Often times its like driving through Denver or Atlanta in terms of traffic. I don't exactly understand the causes, but the traffic in the treasure valley is thick for its size. I think that some of this is due to outdated roads that should have had an extra lane 20 years ago. Karcher and Eagle roads come to mind the most.
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Old 09-29-2015, 10:40 AM
 
1,282 posts, read 3,339,638 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cleatis View Post
I wasn't exactly trying to Idaho bash, I know that everywhere has its problems. I was just trying to be straight up about Idaho problems. There are definitely worse states to be in that have more problems. I just don't like to sugar coat or pretend these problems don't exist because its worse somewhere else. Idaho is a decent enough place to live, it just belongs somewhere near Texarkana
It's not "bashing" to reflect the uncomfortable truths around something, and I, for one, appreciate your directness about the matter. I'd rather know what I'm getting into, frankly. This is also consistent with some of my experiences, in Northern Idaho in particular, and based on some of the research I've done, there is a fairly long history of racism in the area, especially in regards to Hispanics. It's important that people who are considering relocating to the area are aware of these propensities. No one is saying that all Idahoans are racist, obviously, but it seems pretty clear that there are some of those elements present, even if only lurking under the surface a bit, as is often the case.
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Old 09-29-2015, 12:37 PM
 
742 posts, read 831,819 times
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While Idaho has a pretty obvious history of harboring obvious racists, it's a little trickier to assign the more complicated signifier "racism" to Idaho and her people.

I'd say it's more "discomfort" of people who are different then the typical Idaho demographic, and that many people who have moved here did so to be in an area of commonality with regard to race, culture, language, religion, and politics... and this tendency certainly punctuates the Idaho experience, especially in the rural areas and up north.
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Old 09-30-2015, 08:52 AM
 
Location: Boise
2,008 posts, read 2,971,858 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VandalsLOL View Post
While Idaho has a pretty obvious history of harboring obvious racists, it's a little trickier to assign the more complicated signifier "racism" to Idaho and her people.

I'd say it's more "discomfort" of people who are different then the typical Idaho demographic, and that many people who have moved here did so to be in an area of commonality with regard to race, culture, language, religion, and politics... and this tendency certainly punctuates the Idaho experience, especially in the rural areas and up north.
I could agree with this, I don't think its racism as in burning cross racism so much as it is "different-ism". Most people in Idaho are reasonable people who would be above this behavior. The crowd in question, I suspect, doesn't really like anyone. They will be discriminatory to anyone who isn't a good ol boy. I have noticed a decline in this behavior. It seems like the 00s were the worst, the last few years this element has either gone away or calmed down at least. But maybe I'm just not noticing. My social circles have gotten smaller after having a few kids.
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Old 10-02-2015, 03:53 PM
 
1,282 posts, read 3,339,638 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VandalsLOL View Post
While Idaho has a pretty obvious history of harboring obvious racists, it's a little trickier to assign the more complicated signifier "racism" to Idaho and her people.

I'd say it's more "discomfort" of people who are different then the typical Idaho demographic, and that many people who have moved here did so to be in an area of commonality with regard to race, culture, language, religion, and politics... and this tendency certainly punctuates the Idaho experience, especially in the rural areas and up north.
From what I've read, and from my limited experiences with people up north, it goes well beyond discomfort (the racism against Hispanics in particular). But then, I think where you find xenophobic tendencies, which I think is what you are driving at, you also tend to find racism as well, since they both tend to be fear-based behaviors. The same is true of areas that have pockets of religious fundamentalists, whether in this country or elsewhere, for the same reasons. Ethnocentric behavior is almost always rooted in fear and ignorance. This is pretty pervasive in Appalachia as well, and another poster's comments about Idaho acting more a like a southern state doesn't surprise me at all.

Another poster's comment about people here being more subtle in their attitudes also makes good sense to me. In addition, and I was having this discussion with someone the other day, in the 21st century, it has become more and more socially unacceptable to hold these beliefs (and rightfully so), and so just because someone does not go around shouting racial slurs in public or in their books or on TV, by no means does that mean they don't hold racist beliefs. These people are less likely to wear their black hearts on their sleeves, for obvious reasons. Others will broadcast their ignorance for all to see and hear. Just turn on the news.
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Old 10-02-2015, 05:04 PM
 
29 posts, read 87,880 times
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So what you are saying is just because people in Idaho do not act racist, they still are? Quite the intellectual conclusion.
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Old 10-02-2015, 05:25 PM
 
1,282 posts, read 3,339,638 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mo2010 View Post
So what you are saying is just because people in Idaho do not act racist, they still are? Quite the intellectual conclusion.
Nope, did not say that at all. I said not all people (whether in Idaho, Mongolia, Katmandu, or elsewhere) who hold racist beliefs advertise their beliefs in public for all to see. Some do, some don't. Most don't, for obvious reasons.
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Old 10-02-2015, 09:12 PM
 
Location: Sandpoint, ID
3,110 posts, read 9,429,382 times
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I ran into dramatically more racism during my career policing urban SoCal that I ever heard expressed in northern Idaho. The worst racism I ever encountered was when I worked areas (like north Long Beach county area) which were 1/3 black, 1/3 hispanic, and 1/3 Korean. It was pervasive, ugly, and blatant.


Northern Idaho, by example, is quite blissful by comparison. The lack of racial diversity does not appear to have lowered racial tolerance here. And IMO the claim of xenophobia are highly overstated.

Quite frankly, if we went off what most people write about northern Idaho, you'd think there were clansmen hiding behind every tree. Writers love to keep a good story alive...truth not withstanding.

So...let's bring this topic back to people's OWN experiences with Idaho...not what someone has read or what someone chooses to speculate.
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Old 10-03-2015, 12:29 AM
 
43 posts, read 39,840 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sage of Sagle View Post
I ran into dramatically more racism during my career policing urban SoCal that I ever heard expressed in northern Idaho. The worst racism I ever encountered was when I worked areas (like north Long Beach county area) which were 1/3 black, 1/3 hispanic, and 1/3 Korean. It was pervasive, ugly, and blatant.


Northern Idaho, by example, is quite blissful by comparison. The lack of racial diversity does not appear to have lowered racial tolerance here. And IMO the claim of xenophobia are highly overstated.

Quite frankly, if we went off what most people write about northern Idaho, you'd think there were clansmen hiding behind every tree. Writers love to keep a good story alive...truth not withstanding.

So...let's bring this topic back to people's OWN experiences with Idaho...not what someone has read or what someone chooses to speculate.

Well of course you did. First off, there's just far more people in urban SoCal than in (mostly) rural Northern Idaho. Second, you were policing in urban SoCal, so necessarily you're out and about daily dealing with the scum of the planet. I don't remember reading that you policed in Northern Idaho, but you have a stay at home business, so of course you don't run into more racism. Third, you're a white male in an absurdly predominantly white region of the country, so it stands to reason you're not experiencing or observing racism there.

The experience of racism, or sexism, or bigotry is fairly unique to one's situation. Where you, Sage, a white male in a 95+% white region, might not observe or experience racism, perhaps someone who is of a different race experiences it much differently. Moreover, they're likely to not say anything about it, simply because they are such a minority they don't want to be the nail that sticks up and gets hammered down.

That is why the current discussion about indirect, rather than direct, racism is so fascinating and important.

To trace it to my experiences, as a woman, I have felt sexism in most places I have lived and worked... but especially so when I'm in Boise and Idaho in general. And the thing of it is, most people probably don't even realize it. In fact, they probably think they're being nice, chivalrous, or courteous, when it fact they come off to me as condescending, belittling, disrespectful, and ignorant. Kind of a "barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen" sort of vibe. To be sure, it's kind of a clash of cultures between modern understanding of sex and gender, and traditional views on these roles typically found in Idaho (and similar states).

To make it relevant to the topic, this has been somewhat of a biting negative experience I have when I visit Idaho. As I mentioned before, I have close friends and family here so my visits tend to be long and frequent, so I don't think I'm unqualified to offer my opinion.

At the same time, Boise is such a great place in so many other respects that these... somewhat backwoods views on race and sex and culture... can probably be overlooked, imo.
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