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Old 05-10-2017, 07:50 PM
 
8,083 posts, read 4,613,935 times
Reputation: 22645

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Quote:
Originally Posted by timberline742 View Post
Way to miss the point, and misunderstand addiction, all in one post.
Wrong on both accounts.

Save the lectures. Just because you choose to do the whole Kumbaya, "it's a disease" route doesn't mean the rest of us have to...

Wish we had a "miracle" nose spray for those with REAL diseases. You know the kind, the kind you don't choose to have every day or have to commit crimes to stick with...maybe like cancer? Leukemia? Wish we had those lock boxes just waiting to save them.
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Old 05-10-2017, 08:01 PM
 
19,764 posts, read 14,807,968 times
Reputation: 9430
Quote:
Originally Posted by timberline742 View Post
2-3 minutes is life vs death. You're promoting a policy that will result in more people dying. The end.


And you're really screaming that you do not understand addiction. The first step is for a person admitting they have a problem. They have to decide they want to get clean. Even then, it is incredibly hard. Very very hard. Forcing people to get treatment is a great way to spend money, but not a good way to get people clean.


And police are NOT good at convincing people to get treatment. Not at all. They rely on coercion and threats (prosecution vs treatment) which is incredibly ineffective, and even wasteful, since slots in treatment programs are very limited. If you force or coerce someone into one that doesn't really want to get clean, it is taking a spot from a person that does.
The police are there to protect the public from danger, it is true they do not have time to be social workers. But do you really not understand that it can be those unwanted police encounters, or program referral received in the ER that can often lead one to realize they have a problem (I could name several)? I agree A LOT of money is spent forcing people into treatment, and there needs to be a better system in place. But you seem to be advocating people not being pushed into it, which WOULD result in more people dying. At least if they receive medical care, there is a chance. I suppose you are for methadone dispensers on the streets as well???

Last edited by massnative71; 05-10-2017 at 08:44 PM..
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Old 05-11-2017, 07:33 AM
 
Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
41,516 posts, read 33,808,531 times
Reputation: 39900
Quote:
Originally Posted by LLCNYC View Post
Wrong on both accounts.

Save the lectures. Just because you choose to do the whole Kumbaya, "it's a disease" route doesn't mean the rest of us have to...

Wish we had a "miracle" nose spray for those with REAL diseases. You know the kind, the kind you don't choose to have every day or have to commit crimes to stick with...maybe like cancer? Leukemia? Wish we had those lock boxes just waiting to save them.


So, you promote a false dichotomy (its narcan vs drugs for other diseases).


And promote a lack of any understanding of addiction (promoting that it is just a matter of willpower).


Got it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by massnative71 View Post
The police are there to protect the public from danger, it is true they do not have time to be social workers. But do you really not understand that it can be those unwanted police encounters, or program referral received in the ER that can often lead one to realize they have a problem (I could name several)? I agree A LOT of money is spent forcing people into treatment, and there needs to be a better system in place. But you seem to be advocating people not being pushed into it, which WOULD result in more people dying. At least if they receive medical care, there is a chance. I suppose you are for methadone dispensers on the streets as well???


You too are promoting a false narrative. Narcan availability is about saving lives. That is it. Making it less available will result in more deaths. That is simply a fact.


No one said anything else. Requiring the police to be called for narcan results in more deaths with little benefit, especially to the dead people. We need more treatment, we need to be using those seats in treatment for those that really want to get clean, and then deal with the rest sensibly, by decriminalizing it and regulating it (if it was regulated things like fentanyl which are causing most of the ODs now wouldn't be in the supply). There are many models out there, most in Scandinavian countries and places like Iceland that have completely reversed the drug addiction trend in their country, but thanks to American extreme conservatism, we won't explore them.


And the methadone dispenser red herring is irrelevant, because methadone isn't an overdose cure.
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Old 05-11-2017, 08:03 AM
 
Location: Cleveland, OH
10,625 posts, read 11,025,236 times
Reputation: 9982
End the drug war.
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Old 05-11-2017, 08:08 AM
 
Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
41,516 posts, read 33,808,531 times
Reputation: 39900
Quote:
Originally Posted by bjimmy24 View Post
End the drug war.


Places that have done it have fared much much better overall. But, there is too much money made off of it.
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Old 05-11-2017, 12:18 PM
 
Location: East Coast
4,095 posts, read 3,202,773 times
Reputation: 6312
Quote:
Originally Posted by bjimmy24 View Post
End the drug war.
Agree with you 100% on this one, bjimmy.
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Old 05-11-2017, 01:00 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, OH
10,625 posts, read 11,025,236 times
Reputation: 9982
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagoliz View Post
Agree with you 100% on this one, bjimmy.
I knew we had something in common!
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Old 05-11-2017, 02:37 PM
 
348 posts, read 279,859 times
Reputation: 610
I have no problem if other people want to use drugs, legal or otherwise. It's funny that people talk about addiction with such moral outrage. I take zero issue with addiction. If narcan makes their drug use safer, why not?

Cambridge as a whole is exceptionally safe compared to similar metro areas. No problems there.
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Old 05-14-2017, 10:44 AM
 
Location: Camberville
15,008 posts, read 20,010,423 times
Reputation: 26401
Quote:
Originally Posted by LLCNYC View Post
Wrong on both accounts.

Save the lectures. Just because you choose to do the whole Kumbaya, "it's a disease" route doesn't mean the rest of us have to...

Wish we had a "miracle" nose spray for those with REAL diseases. You know the kind, the kind you don't choose to have every day or have to commit crimes to stick with...maybe like cancer? Leukemia? Wish we had those lock boxes just waiting to save them.
As a cancer survivor, I hope you support universal healthcare so that we have access to earlier screenings and the new medications that come out every day that is making more and more cancers curable.

In the meantime, I'll keep supporting narcan access. A life is a life. A disease is a disease.
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Old 05-14-2017, 12:43 PM
 
Location: Montreal
1,516 posts, read 686,048 times
Reputation: 1632
I'm for the antidote but I hate that the pharmas are jacking the cost of these drugs. I hope I have a choice but probably don't if caught in a car crash and the MDs subscribe something stronger than Morphine.

Besides that, I found Cambridge Square to be very pleasant, and no overstepping panhandlers. In fact, I didn't see many in Boston. Near where I live 《Montreal》 in Shaughnessy Village/Concordia U' s main campus is rife with panhandlers. I am not bothered by them. I noticed a lot of police both city and transit at Cambridge Sq. I think the response time is minimal.
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