Young grad deciding between boston or NY (Georgetown, Harvard: real estate, apartments)

[kelly0509]

Hey everyone..im a new grad from florida and thinking about moving up to the east cost in a year or so to go to grad school/work a little first...and i've been keying in on boston and nyc for the hospitals they have to offer to work at, the potential grad schools, and having the reputation of being a young town?I also was thinking about DC if anyone has anything to say about that! I was seeing what people thought of these two cities - niegberhoods, cost of living, nightlife, whatever? thanks in advance!!!!!

[ogre]

When someone is making a choice about school, my advice is to consider first which school will work best for you and your career plans. After all, this will affect the rest of your life, not just the several years you might enjoy living in a particular city while you attend grad school.

Keeping that in mind, obviously you do have to live in the place where you're in school, so there are points to consider. Here are some:

NYC is the largest city in the country, and has more city amenities than Boston. NYC stays open all night, and the public transit runs all night (though it is true, as one user pointed out in a similar thread, that trains run somewhat infrequently very late at night, so this may be less of a benefit than it seems at first), while Boston's transit system shuts down within an hour after midnight, and there's little open in Boston late at night other than convenience stores and a few small eateries.

However, NYC also has more urban negatives than Boston--traffic, crowding, general hustle and bustle. Though it's a matter of taste, Boston is also probably a better-looking city. Though both cities are close enough to nice outdoor scenery for day trips, Boston is closer to a greater variety of outdoor recreation. All other things being equal, if you want the most intense urban experience, go with NYC. If you'd like a nice city with plenty to do, but a less frenetic pace (not exactly tranquil, but less intense than NYC), you'll likely find Boston more to your liking.

Other factors:

These are two of the most expensive cities in the country for living costs, but NYC is even worse than Boston in that regard. You mentioned D.C. as another possibility, and cost of living is one reason you might consider D.C. over your first choices. It may not be really cheap to live in D.C., but it still costs less than it does in the other two.

Both of your top choices are easy to negotiate without a car. In fact, a car might be an inconvenience in either of these cities, though even more so in NYC than in Boston. Depending on your need/desire, or not, for wheels, that might be another reason to look a little more closely at D.C.

So . . . a few points to think about, but I'd look first at which graduate program would suit your long-term plans best.

[PDFierro]

Could you afford New York? I wanted to move there, but can't afford it and thus chose Boston. Below is a link to the thread that ogre was referring to.

possible move to boston, need some insight into the city

[kelly0509]

thanks for the insight....yea one of the reason i was thinking of these three cities were for some grad programs im interested in, but the cost of living thing is definitly a barrier

[RemiJP]

I just finished with the grad school application process and my advice is to apply to programs that interest you most, find out where you get in, and THEN decided how to handle cost of living and all the financial stuff later. If you are accepted to many different programs, those factors will really influence your decision.

[ogre]

I wouldn't want for the talk about cost of living to discourage you, but it is something to consider realistically. I'm doing a grad school search myself. I've looked at a couple of schools in Boston and NYC, and discovered that even the on-campus apartments at these schools are more expensive than similar housing at schools in small cities and small towns. I guess the colleges get money wherever they can, and they can charge more rent when the alternative of cheap off-campus housing isn't available. Cost of living is only one factor, but definitely a good factor to consider.

[holden125]

I agree very much with almost everything in ogre's post. I would, however, put in a vote for Boston just because of cost of living. Also, while there are plenty of people in New York in your age range, they are generally either in relatively high paying finance jobs or struggling to make ends meet. In some sections of Boston, people around your age absolutely predominate (for better or worse).

Originally Posted by ogre

When someone is making a choice about school, my advice is to consider first which school will work best for you and your career plans. After all, this will affect the rest of your life, not just the several years you might enjoy living in a particular city while you attend grad school.

So . . . a few points to think about, but I'd look first at which graduate program would suit your long-term plans best.

This is particularly true and is very good advice.

Originally Posted by ogre

Keeping that in mind, obviously you do have to live in the place where you're in school, so there are points to consider. Here are some:

NYC is the largest city in the country, and has more city amenities than Boston. NYC stays open all night, and the public transit runs all night (though it is true, as one user pointed out in a similar thread, that trains run somewhat infrequently very late at night, so this may be less of a benefit than it seems at first), while Boston's transit system shuts down within an hour after midnight, and there's little open in Boston late at night other than convenience stores and a few small eateries.

However, NYC also has more urban negatives than Boston--traffic, crowding, general hustle and bustle. Though it's a matter of taste, Boston is also probably a better-looking city. Though both cities are close enough to nice outdoor scenery for day trips, Boston is closer to a greater variety of outdoor recreation. All other things being equal, if you want the most intense urban experience, go with NYC. If you'd like a nice city with plenty to do, but a less frenetic pace (not exactly tranquil, but less intense than NYC), you'll likely find Boston more to your liking.

I've split 85% of my life between these two places, and I shuttle back and forth now. This is a good summary of the differences. I will say in defense of NYC that there are some beautiful areas that rival the nicest neighborhoods in Boston, and which are a little outside the usual beaten path for many people who visit. The heart of Manhattan has a lot of ugliness and noise, though, and what beauty there is can be hard to appreciate because the scale is too big and the pace too hectic.

I believe I am the user who said it's little help to have 24-hour subway when they come so infrequently it takes you half the night to get home. This I say from experience, lots of experience. Something that needs to be said in connection with that: a reason that you will be on the subway for two hours or more is that you will have to live far away due to the cost of housing. The average Manhattan 2-bedroom apt. is almost $4000 and in many neighborhoods a "flex-2" can easily be over $3000. A "flex-2" or a "2/conv" is a cramped one bedroom apartment made into an even more cramped 2 bedroom apartment by giving up all or most of the living room. In some cases you would have to pay hundreds out of pocket for the privilege of erecting a wall to make the second bedroom. The real estate broker's fee is very hard to avoid (unless you answer a roommate ad on craigslist, but I've had some very wierd experiences doing that in NYC), and it is 15% of the annual rent, or almost 2 months rent. If you had a roommate lined up and you went to look at a typical Manhattan flex 2, you'd be asked to pay about $12,000 up front for a small apartment with no living room. Almost half of that would be a realtor's fee that you'd never see again. Studios or 1-BR to live alone, you're talking monthly rent well over $2000 in many parts of NYC.

In the closer neighborhoods of the outer boros, the spaces are a bit larger but not by that much, and are not much cheaper. Even with a roommate or two, if you are within 35 minutes of midtown Manhattan (in the day, not at night when it takes forever) and live in a safe area with no roaches or rodents in your apartment, you are doing really well if you pay less than $1100-$1200 per person.

By contrast, in Boston I personally know people who live in places like Brighton Center, Davis Sq, and 10 minutes west of Harvard Sq. on the busline. These are areas that are close to other young people and places to go out, and they are paying in the range of $500-850 each (with roommates) for nice big apartments with driveway and laundry. You can all but forget about having laundry in the apartment, or even in the building, in New York.

Originally Posted by ogre

Other factors:

These are two of the most expensive cities in the country for living costs, but NYC is even worse than Boston in that regard. You mentioned D.C. as another possibility, and cost of living is one reason you might consider D.C. over your first choices. It may not be really cheap to live in D.C., but it still costs less than it does in the other two.

Both of your top choices are easy to negotiate without a car. In fact, a car might be an inconvenience in either of these cities, though even more so in NYC than in Boston. Depending on your need/desire, or not, for wheels, that might be another reason to look a little more closely at D.C.

I lived in DC about 10 years ago, a time when Boston apartments were very expensive, and DC was the cheapest option of the three then. A year ago I almost moved back there and was shocked at how much more expensive it had gotten. Almost New York prices and in my mind, not really worth it. Today I'd say that, while Boston has very expensive central areas, it is the cheapest of the three and offers the most opportunity for a nice place without a very high rent. Contrary to longstanding perception, Boston is also the lowest tax burden of the three these days.

When I lived in DC I often said you couldn't live there without a car (though I did), and you couldn't live there with a car either.

DC is much less walkable than New York or Boston, as it is more spread out. The metro is much vaunted, but very few apartments in the city are really within walking distance of it. Instead I had to take the bus to work, and in the evenings I could walk home in 45 minutes and beat the bus from my office to my house because the bus sat in so much traffic.

If you do have a car, traffic is pretty bad and parking not easy in many places. Much of DC also has resident parking only, like much of Boston, so unless you have a driveway you need to register in DC, which is kind of expensive. My last tour of duty in DC, I lived in Glover Park, near Georgetown, and most of the houses there were rentals and had driveways in the alley behind the house. More central areas of DC often don't have as much of this.

[Hollytree]

I agree with the above and would add that I think DC is more expensive now than Boston. Housing, food, retail clothing- all very high. I think they really rely on the federal employees paying big bucks to live there!
Probably your best bet in any of those cities as a student would be to live in the dorms if you're single, if you're not and have a family- good luck finding affordable housing.

[jake786]

i'd say definitely go with boston. not only does it have the best schools and hospitals out of the 3... the cost is living is much better. you can definitely live in parts of brighton, allston, cambridge or even closer downtown (kenmore, northend) for 500-800 with roommates