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Old 06-22-2013, 09:23 PM
 
Location: San Francisco, CA
326 posts, read 457,606 times
Reputation: 223

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I'm a little disappointed at the level of competition in the Heavyweight division these days. Seriously, whats up with all the fat heavyweights?

We used to have athletes in peak physical shape like Muhammad Ali, Mike Tyson, and Evander Holyfield and now the only guys in the division that look to be legitimately in shape are the Klitschko brothers.

It's doubly sad to me because Wladimir and Vitali Klitschko are clearly among some of the best in boxing today but there doesn't seem to be a single contender that can give them any kind of legitimate challenge.
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Old 06-22-2013, 10:52 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
14,330 posts, read 19,547,612 times
Reputation: 18436
Default Great topic

I agree. What a pathetic bunch of blubbery pudgies in the heavyweight division. Thick, hog heads, fat faces, blubbery necks, man-boobs, expanding waistline, lard arses, and legs that look no different than those of Rosie ODonnell. The nerve of these pigs to get into the ring, disgracing the dignity of the sport. Reflects a sad state of affairs in this country.

These pretenders don't appear to respect the sport or honor its history. They appear to avoid roadwork, but have no problem running from it. No dietary or training discipline, no skills, no dedication, and no business being anywhere but unloading trucks at UPS.

I too wish the Klitschkos had a better caliber of competition.
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Old 06-23-2013, 01:31 AM
 
Location: Las Vegas, NV
519 posts, read 504,164 times
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I was pretty hopeful for Seth Mitchell as some here might remember, but his last two fights have me wavering on that. I'll attribute that, in part, to him not having an extensive amateur background. I'll have to see more from him. Another guy that I'm curious to see more of is Bermane Stiverne. Unfortunately, there just isn't a lot going on in the heavyweight division. I begin to wonder if there ever will be again.
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Old 06-23-2013, 04:35 PM
 
322 posts, read 445,949 times
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Folks have to realize that there's too much money to be made in other sports for big, strong and athletic guys in the states. Seth Mitchell is a prime example. He's probably the only mainstream American heavyweight with size, power & athleticism...and the only reason he's a pro boxer is because he can't play football anymore.

The thing with Mitchell is that going up against the elite heavyweight competition will be a big problem because of his lack of amateur experience as Evan702 eluded to in his post. Most big guys with the physical tools that Seth Mitchell has aren't going to want put in the work and grind it out in anonymity while their are other more lucrative opportunities out there for them. It's a long hard road for even the best of the best to make money in boxing. I don't see how boxing is going to be able to attract quality heavyweights in the U.S. with this dynamic in place.
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Old 06-23-2013, 10:05 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
14,330 posts, read 19,547,612 times
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Seth Mitchell looks like a slugging club fighter who just escaped from prison. His skills are raw and mediocre. He doesn't appear to be a true student of the game. Another Buster Mathis, JR.

I'd place him in the same category as Orlin Norris or Bert Cooper.
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Old 06-23-2013, 11:17 PM
 
363 posts, read 586,528 times
Reputation: 159
Quote:
Originally Posted by EHCT View Post
Folks have to realize that there's too much money to be made in other sports for big, strong and athletic guys in the states. Seth Mitchell is a prime example. He's probably the only mainstream American heavyweight with size, power & athleticism...and the only reason he's a pro boxer is because he can't play football anymore.

The thing with Mitchell is that going up against the elite heavyweight competition will be a big problem because of his lack of amateur experience as Evan702 eluded to in his post. Most big guys with the physical tools that Seth Mitchell has aren't going to want put in the work and grind it out in anonymity while their are other more lucrative opportunities out there for them. It's a long hard road for even the best of the best to make money in boxing. I don't see how boxing is going to be able to attract quality heavyweights in the U.S. with this dynamic in place.
What sport makes more money than boxing in America. David Haye can't even box, did you see how disgracefully he lost to Klitschko and he made $30 million for it. Had he been American the sum would have been substantially more. More crummy boxers like Berto are making millions they don't deserve.

What sport is mitchell going to make. With everyone trying to get rich off basketball and football do you really think it is any easier to get rich making the nfl or nba. You still need natural talent in those sports. I played football, basketball alot and it is easier for the average guy to train 5 hours a day in boxing than to train for 5 hours a day in football (good luck finding people to train with if you don't live in a very football oriented place.) I played basketball alot and was pretty good, then I went and played with people in the collge level and got my butt handed to me, and none of those guys are even close to d league level.

Boxing is just declining in popularity amongst the young, I don't know anyone under 40 who pays to see boxing on ppv. Its hard to just find a bar who plays boxing events.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LexusNexus View Post
I agree. What a pathetic bunch of blubbery pudgies in the heavyweight division. Thick, hog heads, fat faces, blubbery necks, man-boobs, expanding waistline, lard arses, and legs that look no different than those of Rosie ODonnell. The nerve of these pigs to get into the ring, disgracing the dignity of the sport. Reflects a sad state of affairs in this country.

These pretenders don't appear to respect the sport or honor its history. They appear to avoid roadwork, but have no problem running from it. No dietary or training discipline, no skills, no dedication, and no business being anywhere but unloading trucks at UPS.

I too wish the Klitschkos had a better caliber of competition.

Most these guys lack food discipline and don't seem to do road work. They say joe frazier couldn't compete against big modern heavyweights, but by round 5 most of these modern heavyweights are running out of steam. Cunningham got tired after what 5 rounds of fighting a taller man who he knocked down. joe Frazier knocked out a tub o lard called buster mathis who used his fat on him.

I blame the referees. At the low levels they make these fat boxers lean on guys and clinch them and tire them out, these are illegal moves, they should be disqualfying them rather than rewarding them.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomlcsc View Post
I'm a little disappointed at the level of competition in the Heavyweight division these days. Seriously, whats up with all the fat heavyweights?

We used to have athletes in peak physical shape like Muhammad Ali, Mike Tyson, and Evander Holyfield and now the only guys in the division that look to be legitimately in shape are the Klitschko brothers.

It's doubly sad to me because Wladimir and Vitali Klitschko are clearly among some of the best in boxing today but there doesn't seem to be a single contender that can give them any kind of legitimate challenge.
Well some guys like mitchell and haye are in shape, the problem is they need to learn how to box. Sadly even in the 90s, some of those fat boxers like lamont brewster, ross puritty and corrie sanders at least put in the effort to learn how wladmir fights so they could actually beat him using skill. Now guys just go in and think they can win magically

I too wish they had better competition.
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Old 06-24-2013, 07:24 AM
 
322 posts, read 445,949 times
Reputation: 728
Quote:
Originally Posted by scaramouchebluez View Post
What sport makes more money than boxing in America. David Haye can't even box, did you see how disgracefully he lost to Klitschko and he made $30 million for it. Had he been American the sum would have been substantially more. More crummy boxers like Berto are making millions they don't deserve.

What sport is mitchell going to make. With everyone trying to get rich off basketball and football do you really think it is any easier to get rich making the nfl or nba. You still need natural talent in those sports. I played football, basketball alot and it is easier for the average guy to train 5 hours a day in boxing than to train for 5 hours a day in football (good luck finding people to train with if you don't live in a very football oriented place.) I played basketball alot and was pretty good, then I went and played with people in the collge level and got my butt handed to me, and none of those guys are even close to d league level.

Are you serious??? How many boxers are making millions in pay-per-view money compared to the overall pool of professional boxers? Then tell me how many of those boxers are heavyweights? There are over 30 NBA teams, each with 12 roster spots. There are over 30 NFL teams each with 53 roster spots. Are you going to seriously tell me that it's an easier road to make millions in boxing rather than in those other sports?

Of course smaller guys like Berto and Cotto aren't going to be making millions in the NFL. They haven't won the genetic lottery. I'm talking about guys that are genetically gifted with size and athleticism. There's always room for an athletic 6'4" 245lb. guy in an NFL training camp. Tons of guys get drafted every year in the NBA and NFL with guaranteed contracts or bonuses worth millions. How many boxers are making that kind of money at 19 or 20 yrs old? Most professional boxers never even come close to that kind of money. Also, you are kidding yourself if you think that it's easier to train and live the lifestyle that a successful boxer lives than it is to play those other sports. If it were, more people would be doing it.

The fat, out of shape American heavyweights you see now weren't going to make it in any other sport because they're not athletic enough. If you think about it, they're not really making it as big time boxers either. All of the proof you need is right in front of you. By the way, David Haye and Klitschko aren't American. I can't vouch for the opportunities that the larger athletes have in other countries.
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Old 06-24-2013, 04:46 PM
 
363 posts, read 586,528 times
Reputation: 159
Quote:
Originally Posted by EHCT View Post
Are you serious??? How many boxers are making millions in pay-per-view money compared to the overall pool of professional boxers? Then tell me how many of those boxers are heavyweights? There are over 30 NBA teams, each with 12 roster spots. There are over 30 NFL teams each with 53 roster spots. Are you going to seriously tell me that it's an easier road to make millions in boxing rather than in those other sports?

Of course smaller guys like Berto and Cotto aren't going to be making millions in the NFL. They haven't won the genetic lottery. I'm talking about guys that are genetically gifted with size and athleticism. There's always room for an athletic 6'4" 245lb. guy in an NFL training camp. Tons of guys get drafted every year in the NBA and NFL with guaranteed contracts or bonuses worth millions. How many boxers are making that kind of money at 19 or 20 yrs old? Most professional boxers never even come close to that kind of money. Also, you are kidding yourself if you think that it's easier to train and live the lifestyle that a successful boxer lives than it is to play those other sports. If it were, more people would be doing it.

The fat, out of shape American heavyweights you see now weren't going to make it in any other sport because they're not athletic enough. If you think about it, they're not really making it as big time boxers either. All of the proof you need is right in front of you. By the way, David Haye and Klitschko aren't American. I can't vouch for the opportunities that the larger athletes have in other countries.
30 NBA teams 12 roster spots = 360 basketball players. 360 out of all the millions of people who play basketball. There are over 347 Div 1 basketball teams, that is not counting the 32 conferences in div 2. there are easily over 1000 ncaa teams with 12 players a team, throw in the d-league and euro league players trying to make the nba and the odds aren't much better, probably alot worse, because alot of guys get cut after having a temp contract and never even have a full career, never mind all the injuries. The majority of players who pass through the nba are like the majority of boxers, they play for a short period of time before it is clear they are not competitive and are more or less dropped out.
There are 5 titles, 17 weight classes and those in the top 10 are making good money. =850.
The average NBA player makes more than the average top 10 boxer, but they also make more than any other sports ON AVERAGE. But top American boxers are amongst the most highly paid athletes. Show me an American heavyweight champion, I'll show you a man with huge earnings.

Strangely basketball salaries have skyrocketed since the mid-early 90s as the sport had grown, the top contracts back then were nowhere near as lucrative as a single american heavyweight fight.

Yes it is easier to make it as a top american heavyweight or in boxing than as a top american basketball player or nfl player, especially one who is well paid. For 1 the top 10 nba players, you will not find any fat guys with beer bellies and big guts who lack discipline, you find very hard working hungry guys who spend all day in a gym. Compare that to the heavyweight boxing scene today where guys are fat, slow and let themselves go and still manage to make it in the top 10-15. Some of these guys can't box, some of these guys are fat and slow and some of these guys are in a boxing ring for size alone and not talent.

Basketball is harder to make you cannot just become good in basketball by practicing alot and being a good player is no guarantee of ever making it. The d league and college is full of guys who are just a little short of being nba level. It is far harder.

The NFL salaries don't impress me, at least in nba you actually can't just get cut for being injured. Plenty of the top players outside of quarters won't be able to play and earn competitively for more than 5-10 years. The injuries in football are WORSE than boxing and the pay is in general less. When you factor in the thousands of collge and nfl europe and every other guy who wants to make money from football, it is way harder to make nfl and cfl money is a joke except for the top 2-3 players in the whole league but with the same risk. The rock could not make it as a cfl player then went into wrestling and is insanely rich. You will not find ex boxers going into basketball or football because those sports are HARDER to break into. You will find lots of washed up basketball players and football players in boxing because it is easier to get in the top 10 in boxing.

If we are talking just big guys, ok. Well lets see sure you can make it into the nfl easily as a de and get the **** smacked out of you, and get paid 50 grand a year. Or you can be the punching bag for some guy in boxing and make that in a night.

In NFL if you get injured they can cut you and pay you nothing. NBA guys have it sweet I'll admit but those guys are pushed very hard, I knew a big guy, 6'6 and almost made the raptors but couldn't pass the physical due to an old hamstring injury. He could play ball like a monster, but he couldn't pass the physical because he couldn't do enough leg lifts or something like that. Most rookies aren't making much in the nfl. I don't follow it that much but when I use to from what I remember it wasn't until they come out the rookie contract they see real big money. How many boxers are making rookie type money at that age, quiet a few.

O never mind, I just looked this up, well it looks like they changed the payout structure, nfl guys seem to be paid alot more now too from when I use to watch it, especially rookies. Its probably alot closer in money than I initially thought if you are on the high end of football too, but I think boxing is easier to break into boxing.

Most pro boxers don't see millions but neither do most football players. The difference is there is no barrier to entry to becoming a pro boxer and HUGE barriers to entry to becoming a pro footballer or pro basketball player in the nba or nfl. Denton Daley is a local canadian crusierweight from my area. He is 10-0, rated #2 in canada and number 26 in the world. He is making very good money through tv contracts and filling medium sized indoor stadiums. He has beaten no one of relevance and will probably be knocked out as soon as he steps up against real international competition. He is in essence a bum destroyer or a can crusher. He isn't talented in boxing, certainly not to the level that someone in the NFL or NBA or MLB is yet he is making million of dollars. You see had boxing been like the NBA and only scoop up the top 5% of college players (hey there are over a thousand ncaa teams presumably almost all of whom would take an nba contract if offered yet out of the 12000 plus players only what 64-100 are drafted?)

You cannot fake it in basketball like that by fighting inferior competition like Deontay Wilder or Andre Berto and still be worth 12 million dollars and making millions of dollars per fight.

Someone like Mosley is ranked 16th in the world, he struggle to beat the cans he picks and is making 650k a fight. Can an old equally washed up 40 something basketball player even get a contract? How about nfl Fat american heavyweights like bernard stervine would have zero chance to be top anything in any sport but boxing. The heavyweight boxing scene is pitiful. Go watch shaw vs sugar shane mosley, an old fat retired basketball player can still practically beat a top boxer in the world. Sure there is a huge size difference. but shaq has surprisingly fast hand for such a giant man and is faster on his feet and in hand speed than any heavyweight today. If he had a top trainer like teddy atlas or the guy who just past away the kronk gym GUY WHo use to train klitschko, I forget his name right now, he'd whip just about any hw boxer today. these fatties aren't making it because they cannot even give a decent fight to klitschko. Even fat samuel peter dropped klitschko 3 times but lost because he spent the last 5 rounds standing in 1 spot because with his hands down because he was too fat to finish the fight properly.
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