U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Sports > Boxing
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 10-05-2013, 11:59 AM
 
Location: San Francisco, CA
326 posts, read 457,526 times
Reputation: 223

Advertisements

I think lack of notable competition notwithstanding, you could make a pretty good case for Wlad and Vitali to be considered among the greatest heavyweight fighters of all time.

Both Joe Louis and Mike Tyson often faced less than noteworthy competition and they are still considered among the all-time greats.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 10-05-2013, 12:36 PM
 
Location: Brooklyn,NY
10,614 posts, read 13,151,434 times
Reputation: 16173
They are the most prominent heavyweights in quite some time for sure. Wladimir faces Povetkin tonight, Who is being touted as the most dangerous opponent Wlad has faced in a while. I don't think he will be able to withstand Wlad's power if he gets hit flush early on Both brothers are smart fighters, Avoiding brawling and using a technical approach. Hit and avoid getting hit. Wlad has been knocked out before so this is an important approach especially.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-06-2013, 08:46 AM
 
Location: :~)
1,483 posts, read 2,916,968 times
Reputation: 1519
The brothers dominated an era when our potential American HW's decided to play other sports so their opponents were limited. Plus, Wladimar has a great jab but a glass jaw...literally!...I am shocked that he survived this long with that jaw. Vitali is very strong, but robot like. I would anticipate an opponent with valid HW credentials with movement causing him serious problems. These factors could shift everything stated below.

Potential problem opponents:

Tyson - I would be interested to see them fight Tyson due to his bobbing and weaving, this would enable him to punch inside...this is a potential train wreck for Wladimir. I like Tyson but his opponents were limited too. Tyson's management knew his shortcomings and did a great job of hiding that and finding him perfect opponents. I still think he is one of the greatest though.

Larry Holmes - I have not compared the height and reach, but off the top of my head, I foresee big problems with Larry. Larry could knock people out with this jab...much power! With today's advancements in medicine and training, I could easily see Larry handing out beat downs. But I have to check the height, weight and reach comparisons...size matters!

Foreman would cause problems due to his strength and power. Sam Peter was Foreman like and he flat out almost destroyed the Wladimir...watch the fight, talk about survival.

Lennox Lewis beat one of them already...though a shady win...but he won. I actually grew to like Lennox. I think a younger Lennox would beat both of them. The game changer to my answer was Vitali's balls to stand in there. But, Lennox would destroy Wladimir.

Here is my surprise opponent. Oliver McCall. Oliver had much potential. A clean Oliver could have rewritten history. He was crazy enough to stand in there with the brothers. His skills and craziness could have changed history...but he liked the pipe!

Also consider this, from the late 70s, 80's and definitely 90s, there were a class of opponents who were great fighters...not champions, but fighters. If the brothers fought this class of opponents they would have lost more often or eventually due to wear and tear. Fighting Daffy Duck or Pee Wee Herman does not impact wear and tear, which is one reason the brothers lasted soo long.

All that considered, given their size and reach, I do think they are in there somewhere...
- "Best ever" (No way!)
- Top "5" (I am on the fence...No, but maybe)
- Top "10" ever (Yes)

Last edited by jbub22; 10-06-2013 at 08:57 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-07-2013, 08:34 PM
 
1,140 posts, read 1,091,540 times
Reputation: 478
I'd say Wladimir is an ATG, but his chin and stamina will always give him trouble against the greats. I rate his brother Vitali higher. I think he is more versatile both offensively and defensively, plus he doesn't stop moving.

If Wlad had a referee that was harder on his, what could be considered, holding tactics, I don't think he is capable of relying on a plan B since he's harboring a well known glass jaw and tends to panic when hit with flush punches.

In contrast his brother, could get on his bike and put a boxing lesson on a lot of guys. He has that type of capability, and he does get tagged, he has shown a great chin.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-07-2013, 08:40 PM
 
1,140 posts, read 1,091,540 times
Reputation: 478
Guys that can and have a great chance or even favored to beat Wlad: Dempsey, Foreman, Tyson, Jack Johnson, Frazier, Louis, and Ali. Interestingly enough, I give Wlad the best chance against Dempsey and Ali. Rocky Marciano is a wild card.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-08-2013, 10:35 AM
 
Location: Back in the gym...Yo Adrian!
9,369 posts, read 18,018,108 times
Reputation: 18406
I don't even have the Klitschkos in the top 20 all-time. There was a lot of talent in the HW division prior to the 21st century. They easily fall behind fighters such as Dempsey, Johnson, Tunney, Louis, Schmeling, Marciano, Charles, Walcott, Liston, Frazier, Ali, Foreman, Norton, Patterson, Bivins, Tyson, Lewis, Holyfield, Holmes, Bowe, and a host of lesser known and under-appreciated heavyweights such as Cleveland Williams, Zora Folley, George Chuvalo, and several others.

Quality of opposition is what will hurt their legacy most. It was the same problem Holmes has faced sealing his legacy.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Sports > Boxing
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top