Buffalo + NO JOBS = BYE (Boston, Mexico: place to live, agricultural, moving to)

[Genghis]

This is ridiculous. The southeast averages more rainfall than most of the country. It can support a high population density, as high as the east coast which gets less rain on average. Right now, there's a drought out there, that's all. They get droughts everywhere. Big deal. There are plenty of arguments against the southeast, but a temporary water shortage isn't one of them. There have been millions and millions of people in southern california for decades, and they still have water despite being a semidesert.

[aka_mouse]

Originally Posted by Genghis

This is ridiculous.

No, its not ridiculous. And you're right though, who cares about the rainfall or drought...

Its the South. Thats reason enough right there to NEVER go there.

[I'minformed2]

Originally Posted by jp03

Your buttons are just to EASY to push.....

I'm just stating facts...you didn't "push my buttons". You stated facts that were made to be sort ot sly...and so did I. Were you trying to "push my buttons". I wasn't under that impression.

[ScranBarre]

Originally Posted by aka_mouse

No, its not ridiculous. And you're right though, who cares about the rainfall or drought...

Its the South. Thats reason enough right there to NEVER go there.

While I agreed with you up to this point, this was just rather harsh and uncalled for. I don't hate the South or its inhabitants at all. I just hate that they don't have the slightest idea about long-range urban planning and, more importantly, refuse to admit it. As someone who has spent countless hours reading many books on this topic, I cringe when I hop on Google Earth and zoom around Lake Norman in the Charlotte area, Northern Georgia, etc. and see nothing but endless cul-de-sacs and big-box stores, all of which increase our nation's dependency upon foreign oil. If gasoline were indeed an infinite resource, I'd say knock yourselves out, but the more irresponsible these Southern cities become in terms of autocentricity, the higher the prices soar for those of us who live in or very near urban cores and drive relatively rarely.

Benjamin Franklin was one of our nation's earliest and BEST urban planners, laying out Philadelphia in an efficient grid-shaped network anchored by urban green space on each outer vertex. Such a design permitted folks to walk everywhere---be it parks, stores, workplaces, etc. This is the reason why Center City Philadelphia is now one of the most expensive places to live on the East Coast---it pays to live in a part of town where a five-minute walk will take you anywhere and everywhere. In North Georgia, not even a five-minute drive will get you to the grocery store on the crowded roadways, causing more fuel to be wasted as vehicles sit and idle in gridlock. Just what purpose do cul-de-sacs serve, anyways, other than to disconnect people's properties from other zones as much as possible?

Once again I by no means hate the South, and I can't believe you'd say something so harsh. Just because their elected officials and urban planners are MORONS doesn't mean the residents themselves are, even if they're willing to fight me tooth and nail in an attempt to show me that an autocentric layout is good for our environment and economy. On the contrary I know of many educated people in the South, including my aunt and uncle (who ironically live in the North Georgia sprawl), and my great aunt and great uncle, who live in Shreveport, LA.

I will disagree with Genghis though. If Greater Atlanta continues to grow as exponentially as it has been growing for the past several years (I believe it gained 800,000 new residents since 2000 alone), then eventually those aquifers will be getting consumed much more quickly than rain can replenish them---drought or no drought. Want to see the effect that the Southwest has had upon the Colorado River? Visit where it empties out into the Pacific Ocean in Mexico, where it becomes little more than a trickle. If California ever gets an unusually warm season where the Sierras don't receive much snow, their aquifers are doomed, as they rely primarily on that snow melting for drinking water for the rest of the dry season.

Pennsylvania has had its fair share of droughts as well (I believe 2002 was the last major one), but do I ever worry about running out of water? No. Why? Folks here CONSERVE when times get tough. I can't believe how stupid many people in the South are to STILL be watering their lawns, washing their cars, filling their pools, etc. when the lakes that feed Atlanta have only a 2-3 month supply of potable water remaining. In my neighborhood people cut back when only a drought watch is issued. Why is that not the case down there? If I lived in Charlotte you better believe I'd be calling 911 to tattle on EVERYONE in my neighborhood when I saw them illegally consuming water during an exceptional drought.

[jp03]

Originally Posted by ScrantonWilkesBarre

While I agreed with you up to this point, this was just rather harsh and uncalled for. I don't hate the South or its inhabitants at all. I just hate that they don't have the slightest idea about long-range urban planning and, more importantly, refuse to admit it. As someone who has spent countless hours reading many books on this topic, I cringe when I hop on Google Earth and zoom around Lake Norman in the Charlotte area, Northern Georgia, etc. and see nothing but endless cul-de-sacs and big-box stores, all of which increase our nation's dependency upon foreign oil. If gasoline were indeed an infinite resource, I'd say knock yourselves out, but the more irresponsible these Southern cities become in terms of autocentricity, the higher the prices soar for those of us who live in or very near urban cores and drive relatively rarely.

Benjamin Franklin was one of our nation's earliest and BEST urban planners, laying out Philadelphia in an efficient grid-shaped network anchored by urban green space on each outer vertex. Such a design permitted folks to walk everywhere---be it parks, stores, workplaces, etc. This is the reason why Center City Philadelphia is now one of the most expensive places to live on the East Coast---it pays to live in a part of town where a five-minute walk will take you anywhere and everywhere. In North Georgia, not even a five-minute drive will get you to the grocery store on the crowded roadways, causing more fuel to be wasted as vehicles sit and idle in gridlock. Just what purpose do cul-de-sacs serve, anyways, other than to disconnect people's properties from other zones as much as possible?

Once again I by no means hate the South, and I can't believe you'd say something so harsh. Just because their elected officials and urban planners are MORONS doesn't mean the residents themselves are, even if they're willing to fight me tooth and nail in an attempt to show me that an autocentric layout is good for our environment and economy. On the contrary I know of many educated people in the South, including my aunt and uncle (who ironically live in the North Georgia sprawl), and my great aunt and great uncle, who live in Shreveport, LA.

I will disagree with Genghis though. If Greater Atlanta continues to grow as exponentially as it has been growing for the past several years (I believe it gained 800,000 new residents since 2000 alone), then eventually those aquifers will be getting consumed much more quickly than rain can replenish them---drought or no drought. Want to see the effect that the Southwest has had upon the Colorado River? Visit where it empties out into the Pacific Ocean in Mexico, where it becomes little more than a trickle. If California ever gets an unusually warm season where the Sierras don't receive much snow, their aquifers are doomed, as they rely primarily on that snow melting for drinking water for the rest of the dry season.

Pennsylvania has had its fair share of droughts as well (I believe 2002 was the last major one), but do I ever worry about running out of water? No. Why? Folks here CONSERVE when times get tough. I can't believe how stupid many people in the South are to STILL be watering their lawns, washing their cars, filling their pools, etc. when the lakes that feed Atlanta have only a 2-3 month supply of potable water remaining. In my neighborhood people cut back when only a drought watch is issued. Why is that not the case down there? If I lived in Charlotte you better believe I'd be calling 911 to tattle on EVERYONE in my neighborhood when I saw them illegally consuming water during an exceptional drought.

Geez...this is a DROUGHT..it will rain again. Charlotte get more rain on average than Buffalo for godsakes. That said i do agree with the posters above about the incredible lack of planning that we are seeing. That has to change regardless of the amount of rain. FYI..I don't see ANYBODY watering lawns or misusing water around here. People get it now..hopefully we will get rain soon and you guys can go back to shoveling snow and turning up the old thermostat 8 months a year. And yes that was harsh but this seems to be the norm here.

[jp03]

Originally Posted by I'minformed2

I'm just stating facts...you didn't "push my buttons". You stated facts that were made to be sort ot sly...and so did I. Were you trying to "push my buttons". I wasn't under that impression.

heh..ok I just get a kick out of how much you defend WNY and dis North Carolina. Its just funny..

You hated it down here, some love it here. West NY has its merits too. Personally, its too cold, but thats just me. I love it up there from May to September, no place in this country has nicer weather during that time frame.

[aka_mouse]

Oh I definitely hate the south.. I hate the cities, the weather, their stupid accents, their culture, values and that 'southern pride' crap, i hate the totally fake 'niceness'/'politeness' thing they do. I just would never ever want to be stuck living down there. Even the centers that have filled with northerns Id still be stuck in the south.

[jp03]

Originally Posted by aka_mouse

Oh I definitely hate the south.. I hate the cities, the weather, their stupid accents, their culture, values and that 'southern pride' crap, i hate the totally fake 'niceness'/'politeness' thing they do. I just would never ever want to be stuck living down there. Even the centers that have filled with northerns Id still be stuck in the south.

Same to you pal

[ScranBarre]

Originally Posted by aka_mouse

Oh I definitely hate the south.. I hate the cities, the weather, their stupid accents, their culture, values and that 'southern pride' crap, i hate the totally fake 'niceness'/'politeness' thing they do. I just would never ever want to be stuck living down there. Even the centers that have filled with northerns Id still be stuck in the south.

I honestly don't fault people for moving to the South. I just fault those who move to the South then come onto message boards of their home states to say "Ha-Ha" with their tongues sticking out as if they were smart enough to "escape" from the Rust Belt while the rest of us are too dumb to do the same. I'm not saying that reference applies to anyone in particular in this thread, but I've seen it during my months of lurking on the Upstate NY forum, as well as on the forums for PA, OH, MI, NJ, and other Northern states. You don't see native Southerners moving to Boston and then coming back onto the NC board to make fun of those who still live in the South, do you? It just seems like a double-standard to me.

[aka_mouse]

Originally Posted by jp03

Same to you pal

Cause you guys have nothing but nice things to say about the North