Buffalo and Cleveland/Through the Looking Glass (Amherst, Cheektowaga: live in, statistics)

[SlickRick1]

Ok, I see your argument better and I apologize for the false interpretation. What do you think of my assessment of not counting Canada's population? Do you agree with me in that assessment. I think it is a little innacurate not to count that population since it is technically in the metro area assuming US and Canada were one in the same.

[SlickRick1]

At least it is something to ponder. You could technically count Niagara Falls as well in the metro area. Different states count different areas as a whole differently. I lived in Pittsburgh as well, and there is no way when both cities hover around 300,000 in just the city that Pittsburgh's overall metro pop is close to 2.3 million. I lived there and for that to be the case they must be counting population fifty miles down the road. Because I cannot see that the surrounding areas within normal mile boundaries makes up two million unless they were counting all the way to state college.

[UpstaterInBklyn]

Thanks Rick,

I was actually thinking about your thesis regarding Canadian residents.

The concept of a Metro area attempts to define a single regional economy. The international border constitutes just enough of a "firewall" to prevent a single economy in the Southern Ontario / WNY region.

There is some cross border commuting but I would guess it is less than 5% of residents. One of the other key indicators is wholesale distribution patterns. For example, does a restaurant in Buffalo order its supplies from a distributor in St. Catharines? Does a newsstand in Fort Erie get its magazines from a distributor in Buffalo? Most likely not. The Canadian businesses do business with their regional hub, Toronto, and the American businesses deal with theirs, Buffalo.

You could draw the same conclusions about other border town pairs: Detroit/Windsor and San Diego/Tijuana, for example.

One area that is an aberration for the Buffalo/Southern Ontario region is the television market. Since Buffalo's channels are on cable systems throughout Southern Ontario, including Toronto, the TV stations in Buffalo have viewership that would otherwise make it a top 10 market!

To answer your questions about metro areas:
Pittsburgh's official MSA is consists of seven counties:

• Allegheny
• Armstrong
• Beaver
• Butler
• Fayette
• Washington
• Westmoreland

The Buffalo MSA is only Erie and Niagara counties, so Niagara Falls is included in the Buffalo statistics.

[Alt Dach]

IF the canadians were counted??DUH-why not mexico city its over 20million

[SlickRick1]

I wouldnt consider it from just a economy stand point though. People in the US travel there for many reasons and vica versa. I think it would be ignorant to just base it from an economy standpoint but if that is a criteria, then that is a criteria. It doesn matter anyway because those who live in the Buffalo area consider canada their neighbors and vica versa. I think you do have to take many more things it into consideration, and there is no wall its a river. For instance when Buffalo had a day in which they had no taxes, Canadians were driving over in droves to shop at the area malls. But the perception and idea that you know there is a large group of people within a rock throw away has to be counted for something. I think to just base it on economy is not fair or accurate. What about quality of life. For instance Before the Niagara falls area got a casino, people in the area went to Canada. And by the way I am not so sure how accurate your stats are about 5%. When I lived in Buffalo I was always running into people who lived in Canada, yet worked in Buffalo and vica versa. If you have been to Buffalo then you would know that there are always Canadians licensce all over in the city. Once againg though even if you are accurate it doesnt take into consideration every other aspect. I have friends whose girlfriends reside in Canada. I am just saying it is to easy to disregard something important as proximity or throw it in a simple statistical group because it is easier that way. Furthermore, look at NYC, do you consider Jersey apart of the NY metro area, the ones who define statistical areas do.

[SlickRick1]

By the way thank you for your insight and I do see your point. And thank you for shedding light on Pittsburgh. I always wondered what they were counting to come up with such a large number. It is nice to know that they count seven counties. Maybe Buffalo should count monroe county and then they can double their population. Interesting and good fact checks.
And I see yours and the other guys point about mexico etc. It makes sense, but do you understand my point that there are a lot of people in close proximity, so the statistics can be skewed which ever way you want to look at it. Bottom line no matter what the statistics say, there are a group of people just over the border whom share many of the same regional qualities. Good stuff though, Thank you for taking the time to post a response.

[ckhthankgod]

Actually, people that live in Detroit and windsor do cross to work, play and so on. So, the idea of including the Canadian population is not a stretch.

For instance, there actually is a decent sized Black community in the Windsor area in which many, if not most of them descend from Southern states like Kentucky and Tennessee. They have been there for a long time too. Many of these people have family in Detroit too. So, there is a lot of crossing back and forth.

[ckhthankgod]

Another thing is that many canadians even come to the Syracuse area to shop, for events and things like that too. It's only about an hour and a half on I-81. Many come from the Kingston, Ottawa, Belleville and Brockville areas too. We even get some from Quebec.

[SlickRick1]

Actually I thought Cleveland was one of the dullest, ugliest, dirtiest, and ghetto looking big cities Ive ever been too besides Jacksonville and Phoenix. Sorry to hate on Cleveland, but Cleveland SUCKS, CLEVELAND SUCKS!

[minibrings]

how many people live in the Buffalo metro area? The niagara region of Canada has about 430,000... Im curious as what the number in the region would be if you add Buffalo