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View Poll Results: Population in 2015
~270,000 18 33.33%
265,000-270,000 4 7.41%
260,000-265,000 4 7.41%
250,000-260,000 7 12.96%
240,000-250,000 2 3.70%
225,000-240,000 19 35.19%
Voters: 54. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-30-2009, 10:31 AM
 
Location: Hamburg, NY
1,350 posts, read 2,952,276 times
Reputation: 1013

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Canerican View Post
Did you know that taking a job in Buffalo meaning taking about a $8000 hit per year on salary for a person with a BS in management? The average Business grad in Buffalo will make about $35,000 a year, in other areas (outside of NY, so NYC's high salaries aren't factored in)

Yes Buffalo's cost of living is low, but is it almost 20% below average? No.

Nashville's cost of living is about the same, yet average salaries there are $15k above Buffalo. For any grad think dollars and cents, moving away is very logical

While this may be factually true (as I have neither the time or desire to research it) I can tell you firsthand that I make about 10K more per year than I did in Austin, TX (though I have a BBA not a BS but that's insignificant) & my costs have went down considerably. If I ever lose my current position then I guess that I will find out how true this is but as it stands now I'm very happy with what I make & how far it goes (when compared to other places I have lived since graduating). I also spend much less time in traffic (which is always a bonus) even though I live almost twice as far from my place of employment here than I did in Texas.
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Old 06-30-2009, 03:49 PM
 
1,513 posts, read 2,855,313 times
Reputation: 447
Of course, there are millionaires in every city.

I actually went and dug up the stats... I was wrong, you actually lose $10,000 by staying in Buffalo as opposed to going to a city outside of New York.

Bachelor of Science - Business Administration 2008 - UB School of Management
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Old 07-01-2009, 07:28 AM
 
Location: Boston, MA
1,684 posts, read 3,207,648 times
Reputation: 1570
Quote:
Originally Posted by Canerican View Post
Of course, there are millionaires in every city.

I actually went and dug up the stats... I was wrong, you actually lose $10,000 by staying in Buffalo as opposed to going to a city outside of New York.

Bachelor of Science - Business Administration 2008 - UB School of Management
And that wherein lies the problem. Complaints have been made before in this message board about white collar professionals making a lot less than blue collar professionals in Buffalo and it is likely because the region is stubbornly sticking to its blue collar past. Remember that many blue collar workers, especially people in trades, are unionized and so their wages are protected. Office workers are often not unionized and so their employers can give them little compensation. With low wages, high taxes, and limited supply of jobs, all of that spells trouble for a region trying to keep its population intact.

This all goes back to my all time argument that the taxes in the Buffalo-Niagara region have to be significantly lowered. The region right now is not in a position to arrogantly demand high taxes from everyone. That will be likely to attract even more businesses to the area.

I'm also surprised that the public school teachers in Buffalo make so little in comparison to teachers in Boston despite the high tax revenue. A first year teacher in Buffalo makes only $34,000 on average but a first year teacher in Boston makes $44,000. $34,000 is more like a salary wage for Springfield, MA, one of our more downtrodden cities or for little towns like Athol, MA. An average salary for a public servant in a major city like Buffalo oughtn't be that low. Now you see that there is a serious problem.
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Old 07-01-2009, 12:26 PM
 
1,513 posts, read 2,855,313 times
Reputation: 447
Yeah, and look at Pittsburgh, Allegheny county lowered its taxes in order to attract more good workers, and what happened? People moved in, now Pittsburgh, which was positioned similarly to Buffalo is making a fast and furious comeback, and is becoming a regional center of everything from banking, to pharmaceuticals. What's more they discovered that with this lower tax bracket, they have made more revenues, and don't need to raise taxes quite so much, since there are more people contributing.

If Buffalo figured this out, we could see growth in less than 5 years... but they aren't even close...
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Old 07-02-2009, 06:14 PM
 
Location: Rockport Texas from El Paso
2,601 posts, read 7,309,896 times
Reputation: 1569
Some people are in real denial. Yesterday's Wall St Journal had Buffalo as the top population declining city in the region. That was in an article that showed that during recessions people don't leave the cities as much.

The State of NY does demographic projections and the entire area will steadily lose population over the next 5 years.

Why would someone want to pay such high real estate taxes? I love the old buildings but the taxes are way too high.
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Old 07-02-2009, 06:59 PM
 
5,091 posts, read 13,169,575 times
Reputation: 6912
Buffalo has been in decline for over 50 years and it will never return to the size of the past. It will become a small city in a less populated rural area. If is is done right, it could become an attractive smaller place with simple pleasures and enjoyment with simple wants, in a geographical beautiful place.

If it is done wrong, it will be a decayed shell with outlandish pretensions and desires of residents trying to keep up, unsuccessfully, with the other cities. It will spend and tax itself on ridiculous projects and hype, and think that professional sports are the one and only glory of a city. They will forget that the real shinning moment of Buffalo's past was at the turn of the 20th Century when it showcased itself at the Pan American Exposition---well before the excesses of professional sports.

I will say to Buffalo---go back to your time past; and you will go forward to a brighter time future.


Livecontent
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Old 07-02-2009, 07:19 PM
 
Location: Buffalo, New York
205 posts, read 399,143 times
Reputation: 163
I don't think anyone is in denial. The state doesn't do any estimating. The US census bureau does the estimating. Although some schools are also know to throw out estimates but still. I'm trying to find someone... anyone that doesn't say that Buffalos population won't be around 270k. Can you please link a source?

Maybe you are referring to this wall street article.
Interactive Graphic - Census Shows Biggest Cities Get Bigger
I'm trying to figure out if you meant by "Yesterday's Wall St Journal had Buffalo as the top population declining city in the region." Region as is WNY? NorthEast? NYS? Similar sized cities?
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Old 07-03-2009, 12:43 AM
 
Location: BUFFALO, NY
1,576 posts, read 4,714,386 times
Reputation: 319
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuffaloLight View Post
I don't think anyone is in denial. The state doesn't do any estimating. The US census bureau does the estimating. Although some schools are also know to throw out estimates but still. I'm trying to find someone... anyone that doesn't say that Buffalos population won't be around 270k. Can you please link a source?

Maybe you are referring to this wall street article.
Interactive Graphic - Census Shows Biggest Cities Get Bigger
I'm trying to figure out if you meant by "Yesterday's Wall St Journal had Buffalo as the top population declining city in the region." Region as is WNY? NorthEast? NYS? Similar sized cities?
Yesterday it was rated the 3rd highest population loss by percentage in the nation.
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Old 07-03-2009, 06:12 AM
 
Location: Apex, NC
79 posts, read 306,298 times
Reputation: 57
Looks like the results as of right now suggest expectations for growth or stability or complete reduction in population. I really hope that Buffalo sees growth. I myself have left to grow my career and education.

If I was able to have the same growth in Buffalo as I would elsewhere, I would have stayed.
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Old 07-03-2009, 08:08 AM
 
Location: Buffalo-Rochester
260 posts, read 866,628 times
Reputation: 75
Quote:
Originally Posted by Canerican View Post
There is no doubt that Buffalo's population is in freefall, so I am curious as to exactly how low you think it will get. It appears that the decline slowed, but then has increased again.

So exactly how many people will leave the area in about 5 years. Will sound policies return to area attracting families and businesses? Or will our politicians continue to accelerate the decline?

***Note that the population at the time of this poll is estimated at just about 270,000 (down about 25,000 in a decade)
I am sorry but whom ever voted for 270,000 really needs to be brought back down to reality... I want to be wrong. I love Buffalo a lot, hey I have chosen to live here but seriously. Buffalo will be right around the 250,000 mark.
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